Icepower 1200AS amp. Class D like you've never heard before

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Captainhemo

Re: Icepower 1200AS amp. Class D like you've never heard before
« Reply #2200 on: 13 Jan 2018, 08:24 pm »
A fellow forum member pointed out that my speakers are 84db and 8ohms, so it’s worse than I thought.  But if my current amps get it done, I expect the Purepower to do better, right?

That will depend on the gain of the  amps.... if the IP has less  gain than your current amps and those current amps are insufficient, you may have   problems. If the IP  has equal to or more gain, youi'll be fine. 
If the gain is eqqual to or obviously greater than  that of the current amps, you'll gain some SPL as you'll be able to drive the  IP harder before straining it

jay

Photon46

Re: Icepower 1200AS amp. Class D like you've never heard before
« Reply #2201 on: 13 Jan 2018, 08:40 pm »
I’m not selling more than I can handle. I just had a 6 day DHL delay and had to scrap all my speaker cables. If I was selling the kits prepared the same way as let’s say the Hypex NC-400 kit, it would be a breeze. Just toss all the raw parts in a box with no labor involved at all other than boxing parts. I could order all cable sets from China like they do, use a Chinese case, and charge double. Big win for me. But big loss for you guys.

I definitely wasn't implying that you've been selling more than you can handle. I just meant that if you'd broadcast this project at the quality level you're providing on every audio forum, Ebay, Canuck Audio Mart, & Audiogon you could well have been overwhelmed at your current staffing level. I think everyone here agrees that you've been doing a yeoman's job keeping up with demand and the production/shipping curveballs. The quality level you're offering for the price appears rather unprecedented and we all hope this continues to be a win-win for you and your customers.

bavmike

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Re: Icepower 1200AS amp. Class D like you've never heard before
« Reply #2202 on: 13 Jan 2018, 09:00 pm »
I definitely wasn't implying that you've been selling more than you can handle. I just meant that if you'd broadcast this project at the quality level you're providing on every audio forum, Ebay, Canuck Audio Mart, & Audiogon you could well have been overwhelmed at your current staffing level. I think everyone here agrees that you've been doing a yeoman's job keeping up with demand and the production/shipping curveballs. The quality level you're offering for the price appears rather unprecedented and we all hope this continues to be a win-win for you and your customers.

Thanks. This is also why I'm not making my website too fancy yet. :)

lenardd

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Re: Icepower 1200AS amp. Class D like you've never heard before
« Reply #2203 on: 13 Jan 2018, 11:22 pm »
I’m producing. Lot 5 will have 60 SE’s and 120 standards. Also getting 5 Purepower Six SE, and 10 Purepower Six standards built. Then 4 prototype cases for my new Puremusic DAC/pre

Mike,

In LOT 5, is the standard case the Takachi or the newer case? If the latter, are the standard and SE the same cases?

bavmike

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Re: Icepower 1200AS amp. Class D like you've never heard before
« Reply #2204 on: 14 Jan 2018, 02:08 am »
Mike,

In LOT 5, is the standard case the Takachi or the newer case? If the latter, are the standard and SE the same cases?

The Takachi cases were for kits only. The Purepower amp line are different products. These will be official Mivera Audio branded amps. Both the Standard and SE are brand new cases I’m building from scratch. The standard Purepower case uses twice as much aluminum as the Takachi case. The SE uses 4x the aluminum as the Takachi case. To follow the manufacturing process of our new Purepower cases please follow this thread:

http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=154913.0


bobmustang

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Re: Icepower 1200AS amp. Class D like you've never heard before
« Reply #2205 on: 25 Jan 2018, 04:36 pm »
I’m sure you’ll be able to play loud enough. Unless you often listen at extreme levels.
A question... What is the input voltage to drive the amp to full power? And for comparison, what are the voltages needed for the NC400, and NC500? Might be a good baseline. Passive pres are popular, and IMO best sounding.

TIA

spence

Re: Icepower 1200AS amp. Class D like you've never heard before
« Reply #2206 on: 25 Jan 2018, 04:42 pm »
God bless you Mike for answering the same questions over and over with patience. I'd have blown up by now!

TJHUB

Re: Icepower 1200AS amp. Class D like you've never heard before
« Reply #2207 on: 25 Jan 2018, 04:48 pm »
God bless you Mike for answering the same questions over and over with patience. I'd have blown up by now!

The problem is that information is spread out over too many, and some huge threads.  I’ve read everything, but I can understand why many would not want to.  Maybe a FAQ sticky would be in order?

bavmike

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Re: Icepower 1200AS amp. Class D like you've never heard before
« Reply #2208 on: 25 Jan 2018, 05:05 pm »
A question... What is the input voltage to drive the amp to full power? And for comparison, what are the voltages needed for the NC400, and NC500? Might be a good baseline. Passive pres are popular, and IMO best sounding.

TIA

Someone else did the math already:


I believe the amp is nearly 26dB in gain (25.8 dB overall).

The max power (1% THD) is rated at 600 watts/8 ohms and 1200 watts/4 ohms. This is the equivalent of 69.2V RMS. Doing the math and knowing the gain is almost 26dB that comes out to an input voltage of 3.42V RMS to reach the aforementioned power levels.

raddar

Re: Icepower 1200AS amp. Class D like you've never heard before
« Reply #2209 on: 25 Jan 2018, 05:21 pm »
The problem is that information is spread out over too many, and some huge threads.  I’ve read everything, but I can understand why many would not want to.  Maybe a FAQ sticky would be in order?
:thumb: :thumb: :thumb: Another vote for an FAQ on the Mivera Website

Don_S

Re: Icepower 1200AS amp. Class D like you've never heard before
« Reply #2210 on: 25 Jan 2018, 06:28 pm »
The problem is that information is spread out over too many, and some huge threads.  I’ve read everything, but I can understand why many would not want to.  Maybe a FAQ sticky would be in order?

Too true.  If I had not followed this saga from day one I would be even more lost. Speaking of "Lost", joining this thread now is like jumping into the middle of season 2 of "Lost" or "Blindspot".  :scratch: :lol:

hifial

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Re: Icepower 1200AS amp. Class D like you've never heard before
« Reply #2211 on: 25 Jan 2018, 06:49 pm »
Someone else did the math already:


I believe the amp is nearly 26dB in gain (25.8 dB overall).

The max power (1% THD) is rated at 600 watts/8 ohms and 1200 watts/4 ohms. This is the equivalent of 69.2V RMS. Doing the math and knowing the gain is almost 26dB that comes out to an input voltage of 3.42V RMS to reach the aforementioned power levels.

Mike, you might have already posted it but could you answer the following.

1) Damping factor?

2) Peak current?

3) Watts At 2ohm?

Thanks in advance.

gab

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Re: Icepower 1200AS amp. Class D like you've never heard before
« Reply #2212 on: 25 Jan 2018, 07:15 pm »
Mike, you might have already posted it but could you answer the following.

1) Damping factor?

2) Peak current?

3) Watts At 2ohm?

Thanks in advance.

https://icepower.dk/products/amplifier-power-modules/as-series/

bottom of page where you can download and answer your questions

gab

bobmustang

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Re: Icepower 1200AS amp. Class D like you've never heard before
« Reply #2213 on: 25 Jan 2018, 07:34 pm »
Someone else did the math already:


I believe the amp is nearly 26dB in gain (25.8 dB overall).

The max power (1% THD) is rated at 600 watts/8 ohms and 1200 watts/4 ohms. This is the equivalent of 69.2V RMS. Doing the math and knowing the gain is almost 26dB that comes out to an input voltage of 3.42V RMS to reach the aforementioned power levels.
So balanced is really the best way to go if one want full power. Realistically most do not need it. Offhand, do you have a comparison to the NCores? 

Thanks!!!

bavmike

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Re: Icepower 1200AS amp. Class D like you've never heard before
« Reply #2214 on: 25 Jan 2018, 07:49 pm »
I have no more data on the modules than the datasheet provides.

For comparison to the best NC-500 based amp on the market see the listening impressions thread.

genjamon

Re: Icepower 1200AS amp. Class D like you've never heard before
« Reply #2215 on: 25 Jan 2018, 08:04 pm »
Too true.  If I had not followed this saga from day one I would be even more lost. Speaking of "Lost", joining this thread now is like jumping into the middle of season 2 of "Lost" or "Blindspot".  :scratch: :lol:

Lol - Lost is a great analogy, and not just Season 2. We’ll see what kind of vortex we find ourselves in by the end...

poseidonsvoice

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Re: Icepower 1200AS amp. Class D like you've never heard before
« Reply #2216 on: 25 Jan 2018, 09:00 pm »
So balanced is really the best way to go if one want full power. Realistically most do not need it. Offhand, do you have a comparison to the NCores? 

Thanks!!!

Bob,

I made those calculations that bavmike posted.

That being said, I would like to clarify something for others who may be reading.

The NC400, most NC500 builds, NC1200 and the Icepower 1200AS, all have 26 dB of overall gain.

They do have different output powers though. That's just another way of saying that they have different output voltages (in RMS).

The NC400 is 200 watts/8 ohms, 400 watts/4 ohms.
The NC500 is 400 watts/8 ohms, 700 watts/4 ohms, and 550 watts into 2 ohms (because the power supply becomes current limited)
The NC1200 is 400 watts/8 ohms, 700 watts/4 ohms, and 1200 watts into 2 ohms (due to a beefier power supply)

The Icepower 1200AS is 600 watts/8 ohms, 1200 watts/4 ohms. For the 2 ohm rating, I can't find a specification, but that doesn't mean it can't handle that load either.

Given that the overall gain of all of these amplifiers are the same, i.e. 26 dB and I have already calculated that it takes about 3.5V RMS (or nearly 5 volts peak) to reach a power of 600 watts/8 ohms, that means that to reach powers less than 600 watts into 8 ohms, it will take less input voltage.

Given that most of you have sources that are at least 2V RMS (i.e. CD players, high end dacs, etc...), one need not be worried, you will most likely easily clip any of these amplifiers, even without a preamp. Many of you have sources that are 3, 4, or 5 volts RMS.

What you should be worried about is your hearing and also what your speaker is doing when it is being pumped 600 watts-1200 watts RMS! Many speakers of average sensitivity at higher SPL levels (greater than 100dB or more), will have compression issues since the voice coil will warm up quite nicely. And your ears won't like that! That's just another way of saying that most of you will have more than enough power unless you are trying to use a pair of Magnepans to play metal in an auditorium  :thumb:

Have fun and play safe!

Anand.

barrows

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Re: Icepower 1200AS amp. Class D like you've never heard before
« Reply #2217 on: 25 Jan 2018, 09:34 pm »
I would suggest that at some point it would be a good idea for Mike to publish full specifications of his amp build at his website, I know it is a little bit of work, and he is busy, but it would surely reduce the number of forum questions which needs response.  The following would comprise a good list of specifications:

output power at 1% THD into 8 ohms, and 4 ohms
input sensitivity (VRMS input to reach full rated output)
gain
Maximum current output (I assume at some point there is current limiting)
Damping factor
Input impedance, balanced and single ended
Dimensions
Weight

Most of this technical information comes right form the ICEPower data sheet, but it would still be nice to have it posted at the website to make it a little easier for customers.

I do not think it should be any of Mike's concern to give specifications for other amps, whether Ncore or whatever: if customers need to make comparisons of specs, that should be on them to find the specs of other products.

mocenigo

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Re: Icepower 1200AS amp. Class D like you've never heard before
« Reply #2218 on: 25 Jan 2018, 10:11 pm »
According to the spec sheet

Minimum load impedance at 2.7 Ohm
Maximum output voltage / current 98 Vp / 38 Ap

So 2 ohm could be too much for it.

 Roberto

bavmike

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Re: Icepower 1200AS amp. Class D like you've never heard before
« Reply #2219 on: 25 Jan 2018, 10:39 pm »
That 2.7 ohm spec is minimum nominal impedance if you want to drive the amps to full power with a 2.7 nominal ohm speaker. It can handle any impedances up until the current limiter kicks in at 38 amps draw from the supply.