[zoom25]

After these three days of lots of long sessions, doing A/B, and getting used to each drive's sound, it's a lot more easier to recognize, hear, and FEEL the difference. The flash drive sounded tighter and had that crispness in the vocals. The hard drive sounded more looser and the vocals didn't have that top end crispness. Call it PRAT or whatever, but it was more fun to listen to the flash drive versions. It was recognizable on the headphones (HD 800) as well. For me, I can close the HDD vs. Flash Drive debate.

The question now becomes SSD vs. Flash/Thumb Drives, and Thumb Drives vs. Thumb Drives? I absolutely love having the large size and super fast speed of SSDs in my Macbook Pro, but have frequently heard that SSD can create electrical noise (more than flash drives). So perhaps, the thumb drives are the best solution. I think Krutsch felt that the thumb drive was better than his SSD.

If I were to go with thumb drives, I'd obviously need to max out on each of the 4 flash drives to match my HDD's space. I'm not putting songs on my hard drive very other day, and usually do it once a month and transfer albums in bulk. So I'm not overly concerned with writing speeds. However, read speeds for playback is the most important.

The newer faster USB 3.0 drives, like the Corsair drives, are faster in both USB 2.0 and USB 3.0 mode, but do you think the faster 3.0 drives also create more noise as a result? I was recently reading the Audioquest Jitterbug page and they did say that USB 3.0 mode creates more noise. Although, I suppose having a slow USB 2.0 drive for playback of WAV could also create problem.

http://www.audioquest.com/jitterbug/faqs

I know this is already on the fringe side of things, but if someone wants to engage....I'm still trying to get a handle on these things. Getting there though.

(I'm guessing James hasn't gotten his Corsair drive to compare against the Cruzer? Black Friday and Cyber week has really backlogged the mail. My cables have been sitting here in Mississauga customs for the past 4 days. Frustrating being only a few km's away from the place.)

[CanadianMaestro]

Zoom, what cables did you buy for your BDP?

[zoom25]

Some interesting things to consider: http://www.computeraudiophile.com/f7-disk-storage-music-library-storage/universal-serial-bus-industry-standard-cables-connectors-and-communications-protocols-between-computers-and-electronic-devices-flash-or-solid-state-drive-29823/

[zoom25]

Zoom, what cables did you buy for your BDP?

I ordered 2 pair of the Grimm Audio TPR cable. I was currently using Mogami 3173 and 2549. I was using the 3173 AES for BDP-1 to my DAC. Although, I was also using 3173 for analog runs from DAC to my Amphion amplifier. I recently compared 3173 and 2549 for analog runs and found that while the 3173 had more resolution, there was something funky going on, so I ordered the TPR after reading that it was blowing a lot of people away with very costly cables. It won the shootout against Audioquest and Vovox cables. This cable is also rated for 110 ohms, so I'm also going to try to see how it fares for both digital and analog.

The TPR is based on the flagship TPM which costs a lot more, but comes very close in performance. As you can see: https://www.helios-online.nl/en/shop/24-68/prefab_analog_cables?merk=Grimm+Audio

$550 CAD for 1 meter of TPM.

Here's the page for TPR: http://www.grimmaudio.com/pro-products/cables/tpr/

TPM page: http://www.grimmaudio.com/pro-products/cables/tpm/

The reason why I went with Grimm cables is because it's rare to find people agreeing about the performance of a cable from both the audiophile and engineering world. It measured and sounded great, so no complaining so far from anyone about their claims.

(Apologies if all you were looking to hear was: Grimm TPR  )

[CanadianMaestro]

Audio Sensibility Statement OCC silver AES, my friend.
 $175CAD for 1m single.

Beats some of my past Cardas cables costing double. With jitter on my Brystons being miniscule, I don't need any more than this.
End of story.
Enjoy the musik!
 

[zoom25]

Audio Sensibility Statement OCC silver AES, my friend.
 $175CAD for 1m single.

Beats some of my past Cardas cables costing double. With jitter on my Brystons being miniscule, I don't need any more than this.
End of story.
Enjoy the musik!
 

That's very nice. From their own website:

"Note: The AES/EBU signal transmission quality is unaffected by the length of the cable. This is unlike the S/PDIF digital coaxial cable where a length of at least 1.5m is recommended to reduce the effect of signal reflection."

I actually ran into this reflection problem on my setup with SPDIF cables. I still need to confirm my testing with shorter AES cables. I've been using the 18 feet 3173 cable and when compared it to the 10 feet 3173, I thought there was some glare. So I'll compare it to the Grimm TPR which is 2 feet long. If I run into no problem with the shorter TPR, then I'll consider something better later on. I think it's a system matching issue with the Dangerous Source.

Because there is no way I'm buying 18 feet of something like the TPM or that Audio Sensibility with those prices...no Audio Sensebility in that!

Also, I have yet to try out any power cables on the BDP-1, so there is that whole pandora's box that remains to be opened. Then maybe a Bryston BIT. This is never going to end. 

[CanadianMaestro]

You have my deepest sympathy, zoomie.

But sooner or later, ya gotta get off....

[Mike-48]

I ordered 2 pair of the Grimm Audio TPR cable. [...]

I'm wondering what your source was for these cable assemblies. In a few minutes searching online, I didn't find any sources for made-up Grimm TPR cables.  (I retired my soldering iron a few years ago, and I never was very good at it anyway.)


Thanks!

[zoom25]

You have my deepest sympathy, zoomie.

But sooner or later, ya gotta get off....

LOL thanks. Yeah, no worries. I keep a fun sounding rig with my TV that I haven't updated in years running a basic Emotiva DC-1 into Mackie HR824 MK1 monitors being fed by a PS3, Wii, and other fun stuff. It keeps me grounded.

[zoom25]

I'm wondering what your source was for these cable assemblies. In a few minutes searching online, I didn't find any sources for made-up Grimm TPR cables.  (I retired my soldering iron a few years ago, and I never was very good at it anyway.)


Thanks!

Hey there,

I've been using Pro Audio LA for my custom cabling requirements for a few years now. This is the link for the Grimm TPR: http://www.proaudiola.com/category-s/563.htm

You can select the colours of the boot and rings, length. You can also email them if you want further customization that may not be listed. Decent prices, excellent workmanship. For main gear, I buy from Studio Economik, but their cable prices can be expensive even after call-in discounts. The CAD's been crap for a few years, but it still turns out to be a better deal going with ProAudioLA. I usually order cables in bunches and for future needs in order to save out on shipping costs.

They also stock Vovox Sonorus and Evidence Audio Lyric HG if you want to look at other fancier stuff. Hope that helps!

EDIT: Just noticed you are in the US. For some reason I thought you were Canadian as well. I'll keep the info up for other prospective Canadian buyers.

[Mike-48]

I've been using Pro Audio LA for my custom cabling requirements for a few years now. This is the link for the Grimm TPR: http://www.proaudiola.com/category-s/563.htm

Thanks! I've used them, too, a few years ago to make up some Mogami cables. I was happy with the workmanship and quick service.

[CanadianMaestro]

EDIT: Just noticed you are in the US. For some reason I thought you were Canadian as well. I'll keep the info up for other prospective Canadian buyers.

Inscription on tablet: "July 1, 1867".

I swear, isn't that Justin's face??

[Krutsch]

That's very nice. From their own website:

"Note: The AES/EBU signal transmission quality is unaffected by the length of the cable. This is unlike the S/PDIF digital coaxial cable where a length of at least 1.5m is recommended to reduce the effect of signal reflection."

For what it's worth, I have an AQ Carbon AES/EBU cable and a Kimber D-60 (Ag) coax SPDIF and the Kimber is amazing. Snake oil comments in 3...2...1...

But, I run the AES cable - I think it sounds best with my DAC.

[Krutsch]

...

The question now becomes SSD vs. Flash/Thumb Drives, and Thumb Drives vs. Thumb Drives? I absolutely love having the large size and super fast speed of SSDs in my Macbook Pro, but have frequently heard that SSD can create electrical noise (more than flash drives). So perhaps, the thumb drives are the best solution. I think Krutsch felt that the thumb drive was better than his SSD.

...

The newer faster USB 3.0 drives, like the Corsair drives, are faster in both USB 2.0 and USB 3.0 mode, but do you think the faster 3.0 drives also create more noise as a result? I was recently reading the Audioquest Jitterbug page and they did say that USB 3.0 mode creates more noise. Although, I suppose having a slow USB 2.0 drive for playback of WAV could also create problem.

...

Yes. In my experience, the SSD vs. Flash was an easy choice - the Flash drives really provided a better sound for me, my system, etc. SSD drives generate a ton of noise and USB isn't designed to filter that, unlike Ethernet.

USB 3.0 is only an issue when connecting to your PC/Mac for syncing music (in which case, who cares). When plugged into the BDP-1, the Corsair GTX Flash drives compared favorably to the Samsung EVO SSD... best of both worlds.

EDIT: I meant SPEED-wise... my speed tests were roughly the same.

But, yes, with a large collection, you need to be prepared to segregate your music.

[zoom25]

Inscription on tablet: "July 1, 1867".

I swear, isn't that Justin's face??

HAHAHA I love it 

[zoom25]

For what it's worth, I have an AQ Carbon AES/EBU cable and a Kimber D-60 (Ag) coax SPDIF and the Kimber is amazing. Snake oil comments in 3...2...1...

But, I run the AES cable - I think it sounds best with my DAC.

What length are you running both cables?

I have been doing more reading and testing this past day and most of the info on this topic is from some time back. It's as if people already have figured this out and moved on, or the more knowledgeable people are bowing out from different forums to avoid the headache. Seeing this trend on both audiophile and pro-audio websites...Cables have always been debated. IMO cables can sound different based on my own testing in both the digital and analog remain. There is nothing fancy going on. It's science and laws of the universe working. Hopefully later on we'll be able to better explain this.

From Steve Nugent's site:

Another interesting thing about audibility of jitter is it's ability to mask other sibilance in a system. Sometimes, when the jitter is reduced in a system, other component sibilance is now obvious and even more objectionable than the original jitter was. Removing the jitter is the right thing to do however, and then replace the objectionable component. The end result will be much more enjoyable.

Jitter can even be euphonic in nature if it has the right frequency content. Some audiophiles like the effect of even-order harmonics in tubes, and like tubes, jitter distortion can in some systems "smooth" vocals. Again, the right thing to do is reduce the jitter and replace the objectionable components. It is fairly easy to become convinced that reducing jitter is not necessarily a positive step, however this is definitely going down the garden path and will ultimately limit your pursuit of audio nirvana.

I pulled out my 18 feet cable today and plugged in the 6 feet SPDIF cable (182cm), which is a little over the recommended 1.5 cable. In my older thread back when I was using the HD 800, I did point out that I liked the detail more on the shorter, but it was fatiguing. Today, on my Amphion, I'm actually preferring the shorter cable. On some tracks, I can hear the sibilance at times, but in a non-fatiguing way. The image is a lot tighter with more balanced weight across the spectrum. Very little fat. I guess HD 800 was bottlenecking the system back then due to its harsher sound signature.

So from what I figure, this 6 footer is long enough to avoid the first reflections and still short enough to not worry about losing on details over a long distance like the 18 footer does. It's still a work in progress, but actually kinda fun to experiment with....definitely more than tinkering with USB drives.

[zoom25]

Yes. In my experience, the SSD vs. Flash was an easy choice - the Flash drives really provided a better sound for me, my system, etc. SSD drives generate a ton of noise and USB isn't designed to filter that, unlike Ethernet.

USB 3.0 is only an issue when connecting to your PC/Mac for syncing music (in which case, who cares). When plugged into the BDP-1, the Corsair GTX Flash drives compared favorably to the Samsung EVO SSD... best of both worlds.

EDIT: I meant SPEED-wise... my speed tests were roughly the same.

But, yes, with a large collection, you need to be prepared to segregate your music.

Thanks, Krutsch! I have also been enjoying the playback from flash drives. I'll be looking into bigger flash drives. So now the question remains,  are you finding any differences in sound between your GTX and GS drives, or any other that you may have?

(The BDP experience keeps getting better and better!)

[Krutsch]

What length are you running both cables?

The Kimber D-60 and the AQ Carbon AES/EBU cable are both 1 meter in length.

[Krutsch]

Thanks, Krutsch! I have also been enjoying the playback from flash drives. I'll be looking into bigger flash drives. So now the question remains,  are you finding any differences in sound between your GTX and GS drives, or any other that you may have?

(The BDP experience keeps getting better and better!)

I haven't looked into sound quality differences, but the I/O performance is significantly different with both USB 3.0 and USB 2.0. So, what I've done is place my Redbook and lossy audio on the GS drive and my high-res music on the GTX drive.

[zoom25]

The Kimber D-60 and the AQ Carbon AES/EBU cable are both 1 meter in length.

I haven't looked into sound quality differences, but the I/O performance is significantly different with both USB 3.0 and USB 2.0. So, what I've done is place my Redbook and lossy audio on the GS drive and my high-res music on the GTX drive.

Thanks!