House voltage ranges from 124VAC down to 80!

JoshK · « **Reply #40 on:** 24 Aug 2009, 01:42 am »

Thanks for sharing Frank! I could really use one of these for its original purpose, for my PCs. I had a brown out take out one of my PC's motherboards. I still haven't recovered all the data from that one's HDs. I'd really hate to have my Vortexbox be taken out.

Bob in St. Louis · « **Reply #41 on:** 24 Aug 2009, 04:32 pm »

Update on the situation:

The tech guy from the power company came out this morning. He performed a few checks of the transformer, all showed good (no surprise).
He also tested the main feed into the meter box with a heat gun, all showed good.

Without turning the power off, he installed a machine that passively measures voltage. He said it works much like a seismograph in that it's got a roll of paper that scrolls. There are two "ink needles", one for each leg. They will measure the highs and lows of voltage only (no amperage).
He asked that I make a note of the time and date of the brown outs so he can compare them to what the machine says, as it also records time and date.
He will return one week from today, next Monday, to see what it says.

I'll be getting together with the wife to perform our own little "load test".
We'll turn on all the lights on the house, the dishwasher, clothes washer and dryer, hot water heater, my entire system, the air compressor in my workshop. Might even have my son use the vacuum cleaner at the same time.

I've reset the Fluke Min/Max readings.

Bob

Don_S · « **Reply #42 on:** 24 Aug 2009, 08:12 pm »

Bob,

I think you need to coordinate with all A/C members. We should all "power up" at the same time.

Remember dude, we're all on the same grid man.

Bob in St. Louis · « **Reply #43 on:** 24 Aug 2009, 08:16 pm »

.....I like that idea!

JohnR · « **Reply #44 on:** 25 Aug 2009, 01:03 pm »

Quote from: Don_S on 24 Aug 2009, 08:12 pm

Remember dude, we're all on the same grid man.

Hah! Same internet, maybe

Bob - sorry, I didn't read the whole thread closely, just skimmed it, but were you able to detect low voltages being associated with any particular time of day? (Like in the evening when everybody further up the line is cooking dinner...)

Bob in St. Louis · « **Reply #45 on:** 25 Aug 2009, 01:28 pm »

I didn't mention the time of day John, but it does seem to be worse in the evening hours. But in all fairness, that's also the only time of day when the entire system is on. During the day, I've only got half of it on. The worse thing that happens during the day is when the 'event' happens, the audio will mute for about one second, but nothing turns off.

The Fluke has been recording for about 24 hours. The Min/Max is 110 and 121VAC.
The low reading of 110 was enough I could hear the relays in the UPS clicking, but it wasn't bad enough to turn anything off.
Not too bad so far.

Bob

Berndt · « **Reply #46 on:** 25 Aug 2009, 01:53 pm »

Learn something new about my fluke DMM every day!
Thanks Bob.

Bob in St. Louis · « **Reply #47 on:** 25 Aug 2009, 02:00 pm »

Yea, this meter has been my best friend for almost 20 years now. I used it on a professional basis diagnosing circuits in cars "back in the day". It's fixed lots of electrical gremlins, that's for sure.
But that Min/Max button is great.
For instance: You can set it to record, then poke, prod, and wiggle wire harnesses. It will beep when there's a new Minimum reading or a new Maximum reading. Works great for finding loose connections. aa

Bob

Bob in St. Louis · « **Reply #48 on:** 1 Sep 2009, 08:56 pm »

Two electric utility trucks arrived today. The fella that came last week brought another "brain" to help him diagnose the problem. He said that last Tuesday (the day after he installed the "seismic" ink needle scrolling wheel thingy on my meter box) they had found a capacitor bank a couple miles down the road with one bad cap in it. Now keep in mind, these caps aren't like the one's we deal with, they're the size of a small refrigerator mind you.....
The lowest voltage readings I recorded after that was 106, 107, 110, since last Tuesday. The equipment in my room has shut of three times since then.
I've also got a blue tint on the extreme right side of my projection screen. I assume this is due to the overheating since the projector has not been allowed to go through it's cool down phase so many times.

When he told me about the "seismic" ink needle scrolling wheel thingy on my meter box (for lack of the proper noun), I was imagining a roll of paper, like a cash register would have. But when he pulled it out of his box, it looks just like a 45 record, maybe slightly larger. They simply call it "the chart". It had recorded both legs of the power coming into my house for the past eight days. Right off the bat, he says I do not have a problem with neutral shift. He also admitted the problem was not in the house, it was further up stream.
That's when I did this --------->>>>>

I had kept a journal of the times when the system shut down, complete with Min/Max/Average readings. He thought that was pretty neat and took my notes, along with the chart back to his boss for further review. I can't recall the exact term he used, but essentially it the equivalent of what I would have called a "voltage drop test". Basically, it's looking for a large drop in power between "them" and "me". They have the ability to monitor this remotely at their place.
Also, they'll install a different monitoring system at my house that not only measures voltage (like the one that's been here eight days), but also measures amperage. Not sure what that's going to tell them, since the problem is farther upstream and not in my house??

A few minutes after they left, the FedEx truck rolls in. He was bringing my new Liebert UPS.

I'll be running a new line (from somewhere

) into my equipment rack dedicated for the UPS and sensitive equipment. I screwed up and bought the wrong type of 20amp outlet.

But in the mean time, I thought I'd take the UPS apart to clean the fuzzy, nasty stuff from it's innards. Much to my surprise, the inside looks like it just came from the factory. In case you're curious, I took a couple photos. The white material is a stiff plastic to help guide airflow. The battery would be on the left side, but I've already removed it.

A few things to note:
- The massive power cord. The green screwdriver is there for size reference.
- The largest ferrite magnet on the power cord I've ever seen.
- The large gauge twisted pairs inside.

This is a very impressive unit looking at the innards. I suppose it should be given the retail cost.

Speedskater · « **Reply #49 on:** 1 Sep 2009, 09:23 pm »

When I saw some of your posts in other threads, I wondered how your AC power problem was coming along.
What kind of 20 Amp receptacle did it need?

Bob in St. Louis · « **Reply #50 on:** 1 Sep 2009, 09:35 pm »

It requires a NEMA 5-20P, and I bought a 6-20R.

When I went out to purchase it, I left my notes at home. Since the outlet I saw at the store had one terminal "sideways", I thought it was the correct one. But as it turns out, the "sideways" one is on the wrong side.
I had no idea there are so many different types of plugs.

What I need:

What I bought:

Whoops.........

Frank S. · « **Reply #51 on:** 1 Sep 2009, 09:42 pm »

Looking good Bob. The Lieberts are certainly "overbuilt" and have very impressive innards. You probably figured it out already, but you can remove the two pins holding down the white material and clean under there as well.......

Did you test the batteries with the front panel manual battery test? Should get 4 green and a an amber. It might take 24 hours for them to fully charge depending on how long they have been drained. Also I read somewhere it is better to let the unit run for 24 hours with no load attached to charge the batteries properly. Not sure if it is necessary. I did it anyway. Keep us posted............

Bob in St. Louis · « **Reply #52 on:** 1 Sep 2009, 10:05 pm »

Good info Frank, thank you!

But I've not been able to hook it up to the AC power to charge it yet.
Tomorrow, I'll go find the correct plug. But yea....I want to get it up to full charge, then run a battery test. Thanks again for that info.
I've got seven days to return it, should there be a problem. So I'm going as fast as I can. The fact I bought the wrong plug......

......I could kick myself.
Regarding cleaning the innards, like I mentioned earlier, the insides are spotless. I looked for SOMETHING that needed cleaning, but couldn't find anything. Even the fan blades are absolutely spotless....And I mean spotless.

Good stuff. I'm very happy. I'd like to give Frank a very personal and public "Thank You" for recommending this particular piece of equipment.

Bob

Speedskater · « **Reply #53 on:** 1 Sep 2009, 10:23 pm »

They (NEMA) have even more connectors:

www.electri-cord.com/NEMA-configurations.htm

Frank S. · « **Reply #54 on:** 1 Sep 2009, 10:53 pm »

Your most welcome Bob. You got an absolutely incredible deal for that piece. Just think- the "audiophile" equivalent of your UPS would be well over $2000.

Great to read your unit was that clean. Mine needed a little TLC but looks like new now.

FYI- I have the configuration software if you need it. You can hook it up to your PC and check the default settings if you want to and set a few parameters for battery testing etc.

Bob in St. Louis · « **Reply #55 on:** 2 Sep 2009, 12:31 am »

Wow Kevin, that's much more than I knew existed.

Frank, as far as the software is concerned, my PC is 20' away from the rack "as the crow fly's". Closer to 30' if I route the cable through the ceiling as opposed to across the floor.
Yea, I'd like to use that feature, but......I won't be using it anytime soon.
And another thing, I've run out of USB and RS-232 inputs on the PC. Need some more ports, and money is getting thin.

Bob

Frank S. · « **Reply #56 on:** 2 Sep 2009, 12:39 am »

Bob- it doesn't need to be connected all the time. You could bring the UPS to the computer. Just temporarily hook it up to see the settings and if they are where you want them you are done. That's what I did. Took all of about 5 minutes.

Did you have one or two fans on the 2 kVA? Looks like only one. Nice. I had three to deal with. Should be much quieter with only one fan.

Bob in St. Louis · « **Reply #57 on:** 2 Sep 2009, 12:59 am »

Good point about using the USB on a temporary basis. I didn't know that.
Iv'e got a "RS-232 to USB" cable running from the PC to the rack anyway. I can "rob it" occasionally to check the UPS.

The unit has two fans. Both on the right side of my picture, one on top, one on bottom. Both are underneath the white plastic shroud.

Bob

Bob in St. Louis · « **Reply #58 on:** 2 Sep 2009, 04:03 pm »

The tech guy from the electric company came back out to install another type of monitoring system. This one fits between the meter head and the meter box and measures voltage and amperage on the two legs.
They've been remotely monitoring my power and said they saw no anomalies in the past 24 hours. Neither have I. My Fluke shows Min/Max of 117/123.
He spoke with his superiors and said that most likely they'll either install a booster station somewhere between my house and the substation (as the single phase line to my house is an abnormally long run), or they'll install a larger transformer on my pole.

I verbalized my surprise that a single house could overwhelm a transformer, but he said it's possible. Now maybe I can request one that's been cryo'd.

They're really bending over backwards to solve this problem. I'm slightly shocked (no pun intended) they're willing to spend this much time, and possibly a LOT of money to please a single customer.

I've got the correct NEMA 5-20 plug for the UPS, so I'll be running wires, installing and charging that today.

Bob's a happy boy. aa

kyyuan · « **Reply #59 on:** 2 Sep 2009, 04:33 pm »

Bob,

Did you get the 2000 or the 3000 version of the Liebert? Thanks.

Ken