[mresseguie]

Hello.

I just ordered a Jeff Bagby designed SB Acoustic Satori driver DIY kit. I have the cabinet instructions/dimensions. My question is: Rather than building my own cabinet, can I order a ready made cabinet from Parts Express that is larger than my kit calls for (and add extra braces or extra top and bottom pieces)? By adding braces and/or top and bottom pieces, the internal volume would decrease.

The kit calls for 15" high x 8.5" wide x 11.5" deep whereas the PE cabinet is 17" high x 10" wide x 12.5" deep.

Would the different sized cabinet negatively affect the sound quality?

OR.....Do I just suck it up, buy a router and bits and a practice board....and pray for success?

Thanks for any and all suggestions....

[JLM]

I'd go the Parts Express route and subtract volume.  That way you can brace, try approaching a better ratio of internal dimensions, add stuff/lining, or any combination of the above.  A local audio club member brought his curved Parts Express cabinets to a recent meeting and they look very nice, so unless you're a finish carpenter (probably not or you wouldn't be asking) it's doubtful you could match their quality. 

[srb]

I'm trying to figure out which Jeff Bagby Satori design you're building.  If it's the Kairos / Adelphos (slanted baffle / flat baffle), Jeff says the enclosure is about 17 liters.  However, external dimensions of 15" H x 8.5" W x 11.5" D (using all 3/4" material) only translates to ~ 15.5 liters internal volume, and even a bit less if there is a brace or the baffle is 1" vs 3/4".

Because I would be inclined to want to keep the same 8.5" baffle width that the design specifies to maintain any baffle step compensation or other design criteria, I'm wondering if there's another cabinet available that would be close to the correct volume and still have an 8.5" wide baffle.

Steve

[hdspeakerman]

Go to Parts Express Tech talk forum and talk with Jeff about your project.  He is very helpful.

Howard

[mresseguie]

Steve,

It is the Adelphos. Your comment, "Because I would be inclined to want to keep the same 8.5" baffle width that the design specifies to maintain any baffle step compensation or other design criteria, I'm wondering if there's another cabinet available that would be close to the correct volume and still have an 8.5" wide baffle." Is precisely why I posted to this thread. There are so many points to consider when making a speaker, and I know but a few. I initially wanted to try the Kairos, but I know my wife and how she would not care for that slanted baffle.

Howard,

Even though I've been to PE website 10 or 20 times, I did not realize there is a tech talk forum there. Sheesh. Thanks, man.

JLM,

If I get an all clear from Jeff Bagby, and cannot find another alternative, I may try a ready made cabinet because it will certainly be better looking than my own.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

I ought to receive my Rythmik F12G sub really soon, and I really want to see how the Adelphos sounds both with and without it. I got a PM from Rythmik's Brian, who stated his shipment of enclosures was sitting at the harbor waiting for customs to clear it. C'mon, customs!

Oh, boy! ONE more post and I lose my Jr member status! Cheers!

[srb]

I got the 17 liter spec from the PDF Manual posted on the Meniscus Audio Kairos page
Kairos High-End Monitor Loudspeaker

Under the Box Model Design heading, Jeff says: "The enclosure is about 17 liters".

On the Parts Express Techtalk Customer Forum, in the Kairos thread Jeff says:

"I have completed a crossover design for the SB Satori drivers for use on a flat baffle and have sent it to Mark at Meniscus.  I used the identical cabinet volume and tuning as the Kairos except without the slanted baffle."

So I'm curious about the 15" x 8.5" x 11.5" Adelpho dimensions which I assume came from cabinet plans you received with your Adelphos kit, in that when I compute internal volume subtracting 3/4" on all sides, the result is ~ 15.5 liters.  I wonder did the enclosure change from the PDF manual still on Mensiscus' site?

17 liters = .6 cu. ft and (of course!) falls in the middle between Parts Express' .5 cu. ft. and .75 cu. ft. cabinets.  If 15.5 liters is closer to the actual final design volume though, perhaps the Parts Express .5 cu. ft. enclosure is close enough (?) and it does have a 8.5" wide baffle.

It will be interesting to hear Jeff's feedback on the Parts Express enclosures as there are a lot of people who would suck it up and figure out how to cut the required holes and recesses or get a friend to do it, but do not have the tools, time or skills to build the complete enclosure or the funds to buy North American made finished enclosures.

Steve

[hdspeakerman]

I believe the guys at Meniscus can build cabinets for you if that would help.  Howard

[mresseguie]

Howard,

I'll call Mark in the morning. Why do I always wait until Thursday or Friday to commit to something like this....only to discover more questions when businesses are off for the weekend? 

Steve,

I found this in the PE TechTalk forum Jeff Bagby posted, "My "Kairos" needs a special cabinet, but its brother the "Adelphos" would work fine in the .5 cu ft PE cabinet sealed."

So unless Mark or Mr. Bagby declare otherwise, I expect to buy just this enclosure. Sealed is fine with me as I intend to pair them with my new sub.

Thanks, guys! 

[richidoo]

I have Kairos. Adding an inch to the box width will affect the baffle step rolloff slightly, lowering the knee by only 50Hz. That's within the design tolerance, imo, so you won't hear it. In theory, there would be a slight boost compared to 9" baffle width, maybe <1/2 db at 500Hz, nobody can hear that, and it's just in theory anyway. In reality, the rectangular box doesn't have a smooth BS rolloff, it's quite bumpy. And the simple xo design uses minimal number of standard value parts, so the design is not sensitive to a 50Hz difference in BS freq. 

I'm more concerned about reducing the box volume. For sealed it will still work OK, but that will raise the Qtc of the speaker above .7, adding extra warmth to the midbass. The speaker is so clean and precise, the extra warmth of a smaller box would annoy me. But a larger volume would give you dryer, tighter bass which is nice for classical or acoustic hifi recordings. My Kairos are Qtc .7 with minimal bracing volume, external xo, no port installed, so it's as big a volume as you can get with Kairo box dimensions, but I would still like a bit more damping so I'm building larger volume for the satori woofers as part of making it into a 3way. I'll have enough volume for Qtc .5, but I can fill the volume if that is too dry.

I used very large ga air core coils, I found that it  made a big difference in clarity compared to the steel lam coil in the basic kit. I also recently added a damping resistor to the woofer coil, which made a further improvement in clarity and focus. I don't know how the Adelphos XO differs from Kairos, so damping resistor might not apply.

Congrats on a fine speaker choice, you will love the satori drivers and Jeffs crossover. I've owned a lot of speakers over the years, these are the most enjoyable overall.
Rich

[mresseguie]

Until I get a flat pack for my new speakers, I now have 3/4" pre-finished Sapele plywood cut into the proper sizes. I'll line the insides with vinyl floor tiles to absorb resonance.

[mresseguie]

I used to wonder why guys would take so long to begin constructing their speaker projects after posting their initial announcement. I kept thinking, "C'mon, man. Don't you want to hear those new speakers?" Well, now I understand. It's taken me this long just to begin assembling my speakers. I know it won't be long till they are finished and playing beautiful music. The X-overs are already assembled and wainting to be placed. I'm lining the insides with No Rez.

I computed the inside space to be exactly .75 cu inches, so they ought to sound great.

Here are two pics:





Michael

P.S. Those are (unfinished) home made acoustic panels in the background. I used ROXUL insulation.

[mresseguie]

Well, I blew it on the port hole dimension. The hole I cut is the same diameter as the cardboard tube, but the end cap (port cap?) is 1/8" wider. With a lot of sanding and some filing, I can expand the hole, or I could seal the port hole for sealed speakers.

Anyone out there have an opinion...do I bite the bullet and sand my life away or seal the cabinets? Either way these speakers will be paired with my Rythmik F12G sub, so low bass is not an issue.

I'm leaning toward corking the holes.

Michael