Difference between 2CE Sig and 2 CE Sig II? Also....

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geowak

Just auditioned a 2CE Sig and it was very nice sounding. Can't really afford the 5 series and not interested in the 3 series.

Compared the 2CE Sig to the Magnepan 1.7 and actually (surprisingly) liked the Vandersteen more.

Can someone who has heard or owned the 2CE Sig II tell me if the design upgrade actually makes it sound that much better? I like the idea of an improved midrange and hi freqs at the mid 2k price range.

ALSO
What kind of speaker cables work well with these speakers? The dealer uses Analysis Plus (bi-wired) with good results. Has anyone else used other affordable cables and heard pleasant sound?
« Last Edit: 21 Nov 2011, 06:52 am by geowak »

jebe1

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Re: Difference between 2CE Sig and 2 CE Sig II? Also....
« Reply #1 on: 22 Nov 2011, 04:57 am »
Richard Vandersteen has been refining the 2ce Signature since the year 2000 so it is important to distinguish between the various iterations before you can talk about what each sounds like. I can think of four different iterations/versions:

[Addendum: Here are the version of the Vandersteen 2ce
  1. 2ce introduced in early 1991 with 3/4" tweeter from the 2ci
  2. 2ce upgraded to 1" tweeter in late 1991 at SN#56032
  3. 2ce upgraded in 1998  to include half the parts of the original 2ce Signature I at SN#77000 ]

Version A: The original Vandersteen 2ce Signature. Introduced in the year 2000. Original MSRP is $1625 including the stands. Goes for about $850 used.

Version B: A refined iteration of Version A. Can be identified with serial numbers 57374 and greater. Richard Vandersteen claims that this version has signficant upgrades over previous versions. Feb, 2005. Price - the same as Version A.

Version C: The original Vandersteen 2ce signature II. It has the same tweeter and midrange as the original cloth Quatro which I think are the same drivers as the original model 5. Year 2007. Original MSRP is $2350 including the stands. Goes for about $1500-$1600 used.

Version D: Version C but with the same mid-range as the 5A. July, 2011.  MSRP is $2550 including the stands.
 [Addendum: The change from Version "C" to Version "D" occurred somewhere between SN# 68200 - 68700 (with the number likely being 68200 or 68500, but this is not confirmed).]

I have a pair of Version A and Version C so my comments are directed towards these two models. Version A is more laid back and more forgiving of lesser recordings. Many Vandersteen critics have described the highs as sounding "veiled", but I think it is just that the upper mids that are slightly rolled off. It is a very easy speaker to listen to and will continue to improve with better upfront electronics. Version C is more lean, is more immediate and coherent and has less of the "veiled" sound people often associate with Vandersteen speakers. I have never heard Version D but I assume it is even more coherent with the improved midrange.

If price were no object and you could afford the appropriate amplification, I think Version C/D is a big improvement over Versions A/B. However, it is all about system matching and you might get better sound out of Versions A/B depending on your electronics. Depending on your budget, it might make more sense to get Versions A, B, or C and put the the rest of the money towards better electronics. I know lots of people love tube amps with Vandies, but I am of the opinion that they really start to sing with lots of power as the bass becomes more solid and tight with a noticable improvement in attack and decay. I use a tube preamplifier and I think the combination is really great for the Series 2.

If you are looking for an affordable speaker cable, you might want to check out the Alpha Core AG-1 that was reviewed in the Stereophile review of the 2ce Sig II. I've never heard them so I can't personally speak to them.
   http://www.stereophile.com/floorloudspeakers/107vandy/index.html

 If you want to spend a lot more, I can recommend Acoustic Zen Satori.


Jebe
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Sources from the Vandersteen FAQ:


Unknown (1/25/06): what period was the Model 2CE in production? Is the grill removable?

Answer: HELLO, THE MODEL 2CE WENT INTO PRODUCTION 1N FEB 1991. THE 2CE INITIALLY HAD THE 3/4" ALLOY TWEETER OF THE 2CI (IN PRODUCTION 1989-1991) BECAUSE WE HAD NOT COMPLETED THE 1" UNTIL NOV 1991. SN#56032 WAS THE FIRST 2CE TO INCLUDE THE 1" TWEETER AT THIS POINT THE TOP, BOTTOM, AND INPUT PLATE WERE THE ONLY PARTS COMMON BETWEEN THE TWO. IN 1998 THE 2CE WAS DISCONTINUED AND THE 2CE SIGNATURE WENT INTO PRODUCTION. THE LAST 3 MONTHS OF THE 2CE PRODUCTION HAD ABOUT HALF OF THE SIGNATURE PARTS INCLUDED (SN#77000 AND ABOVE) AND CAN BE UPGRADED TO SIGNATURES AT THE FACTORY FOR $380.00 PLUS FREIGHT. THE 2CE SIGNATURES ARE CURRENTLY STILL IN PRODUCTION BUT HAVE HAD YEARLY UPGRADES, THE MOST SIGNIFICANT IN FEB 2005 (SN#57374 AND ABOVE). THE GRILL CLOTH IS NOT REMOVABLE HOWEVER THE CUSTOMER SERVICE SECTION OF THIS WEB SITE HAS INSTRUCTIONS ON HOW TO GET INTO THE BOTTOM FOR SERVICE.


Jacques (6/21/07):  Is the Quatro in fact generally a Model 2 with active woofers? I ask this in the light of the perception that the 2s are absolutely magnificent speakers and that such a strategic move (design approach) would be extremely advantageous to everyone the public and yourselves.

Answer: HELLO JACQUES, THE QUATRO IS MUCH MORE SOPHISTICATED THAN THE MODEL 2CE SIG II IN EVERY WAY. ONLY THE MID-RANGE DRIVER AND THE TWEETER ARE COMMON BETWEEN THE TWO.


Jason(10/28/07): What is the difference between the 2Ce Signature and the 2Ce Signature II?  Thanks, Jason

Answer: HELLO JASON, IT WOULD BE EASIER TO MENTION WHAT IS NOT DIFFERENT. THEY INCLUDE 1 INCH BOTTOM PLATE, 3A SIG TWEETER AND MIDRANGE, AND DOZENS OF STRUCTURAL AND X-OVER CHANGES TO IMPLEMENT THEM.


Mike (7/11/11): Hello Richard, Mike here, owner of a pair of 1994 model 2 serial (59271ce) and a pair of 1991 model 3 serial (1418) has noticed the Price increase alert Price increase alert looks like you kept your promise of not being able to hold the current price levels and so Well at least the most recent model 3 to model 3a signature upgrade price increase comes with the improved model 5A midrange, but is the Model 5A tweeter included as well?  Could you explain here to the group what other changes have been made to the model 3a signature? "The 2Ce Signature, 3A signature and the fabric Quatro now have the woven composite mid range cone of the Quatro Wood and the 5A speaker."

Answer: HELLO MIKE,  THE 3A SIG AND THE 2CE SIG II HAVE THE WOVEN COMPOSITE CONE MID-RANGE AS THE 5A BUT NOT THE TWEETER EXCEPT IN THE CASE OF THE QUATRO.  THE OTHER CHANGES ARE TOO NUMEROUS TO MENTION BUT ARE REQUIRED TO MAKE THE NEW MID-RANGE WORK.
« Last Edit: 3 Feb 2013, 08:07 pm by jebe1 »