[Folsom]

Would running a dedicated 20 amp circuit to my listening room clean things up?

The dedicated circuit would come from a second breaker box which is in the garage and separate from the main breaker box (in the master bedroom) that is currently feeding power to the lights and outlets in the listening room. The lights and regular outlets would still be powered from the main box.  Only the AV equipment would be powered from the new circuit.

It's hard to say that you'd get a big improvement. Service to the mini box may have a lot of noise generators, particularly on safety ground because it may be shared with main service routes. Loops get bigger on mini service too, since safety and neutral aren't tied.

[gregfisk]

RFI is radio frequency interference. It picks it up through the air.

So the RFI is infiltrating Mike's in line filter because it's not shielded or grounded?

I personally don't spend a lot of money on cables for any part of my system. What I do do is purchase every cable including my Power cables, Speaker cables, digital cables and RCA interconnect cables dual shielded. I learned what non shielded and single shield cables can pick up when I ran regular RG6 in a house on Queen Anne hill in Seattle many years ago. The hill has 3 local TV towers on it and the ghosting on the TVs was incredible. So we reran all of the cables with RG6Q which is duel shielded and the problem was gone. We even had to make up our own short interconnect cables from the cable box to the TV because even a 3' run of RG6 was causing ghosting.

[mlundy57]

It's hard to say that you'd get a big improvement. Service to the mini box may have a lot of noise generators, particularly on safety ground because it may be shared with main service routes. Loops get bigger on mini service too, since safety and neutral aren't tied.

Not sure what a mini service is. When we moved into this house it had 200 amp service at the meter but only a 100 amp service panel since the house is heated by natural gas.  That panel was full so we had an electrician install a second 100 amp service panel in the garage. The (wiring for this panel goes back to the meter box, just like the original one.

Is this what you are talking about?

[Danny Richie]

So the RFI is infiltrating Mike's in line filter because it's not shielded or grounded?

I personally don't spend a lot of money on cables for any part of my system. What I do do is purchase every cable including my Power cables, Speaker cables, digital cables and RCA interconnect cables dual shielded. I learned what non shielded and single shield cables can pick up when I ran regular RG6 in a house on Queen Anne hill in Seattle many years ago. The hill has 3 local TV towers on it and the ghosting on the TVs was incredible. So we reran all of the cables with RG6Q which is duel shielded and the problem was gone. We even had to make up our own short interconnect cables from the cable box to the TV because even a 3' run of RG6 was causing ghosting.

I have compared a lot of shielded verses non-shielded cables and found across the board that non-shielded cables can sound a lot better even when using the same cable and just added or taking away the shield. However, not all applications for non-shielded cables work well. Some applications require the shielding.

[HAL]

Try wrapping the crossover box with either copper foil or aluminum foil and ground it.  It will at least lower the RFI getting to the internal connections.

[Folsom]

So the RFI is infiltrating Mike's in line filter because it's not shielded or grounded?

I personally don't spend a lot of money on cables for any part of my system. What I do do is purchase every cable including my Power cables, Speaker cables, digital cables and RCA interconnect cables dual shielded. I learned what non shielded and single shield cables can pick up when I ran regular RG6 in a house on Queen Anne hill in Seattle many years ago. The hill has 3 local TV towers on it and the ghosting on the TVs was incredible. So we reran all of the cables with RG6Q which is duel shielded and the problem was gone. We even had to make up our own short interconnect cables from the cable box to the TV because even a 3' run of RG6 was causing ghosting.

His filter is a weak spot, and it's possible for the parastic capacitance due to the construction to cause some radiation. A grounded box would reduce RF incoming, and there for less to radiate. It has to be grounded to the RCA's ground however or it'll still radiate.

[Folsom]

Try wrapping the crossover box with either copper foil or aluminum foil and ground it.  It will at least lower the RFI getting to the internal connections.

No, for the reason I just stated it doesn't work. At least not for any benefit at the levels in a house.

[mlundy57]

So the RFI is infiltrating Mike's in line filter because it's not shielded or grounded?

I personally don't spend a lot of money on cables for any part of my system. What I do do is purchase every cable including my Power cables, Speaker cables, digital cables and RCA interconnect cables dual shielded. I learned what non shielded and single shield cables can pick up when I ran regular RG6 in a house on Queen Anne hill in Seattle many years ago. The hill has 3 local TV towers on it and the ghosting on the TVs was incredible. So we reran all of the cables with RG6Q which is duel shielded and the problem was gone. We even had to make up our own short interconnect cables from the cable box to the TV because even a 3' run of RG6 was causing ghosting.

Greg,

I discovered the the problem was not in the inline filter like I originally thought. It turned out that it didn't matter whether the filter was in or out, whether I was using solid state or tube amplification, which DAC I used, whether the music was a digital file played from the computer or a CD played on the OPPO, or what interconnects were connected where. Sometimes there was static coming from the tweeters and other times there wasn't.

I was ready to pull the rest of my hair out, both of them 

Now that I am no longer waiting for coats of polyurethane to dry, I need to leave this problem alone until I finish the Wedgies and 3x8 Wedge bass units I'm building.

[Folsom]

Not sure what a mini service is. When we moved into this house it had 200 amp service at the meter but only a 100 amp service panel since the house is heated by natural gas.  That panel was full so we had an electrician install a second 100 amp service panel in the garage. The (wiring for this panel goes back to the meter box, just like the original one.

Is this what you are talking about?

I'm just saying mini service in place of anything that isn't the main panel. Code is to tie neutral and safety at the main panel but never at subsequent panels. I'm not sure if it's per building or just per service location from power pole.

The issue with safety ground is that it's common to daisy chain it every which way to Sunday, so potentials, noise, etc can really become a problem for your secondary service panels, as it's possible to be down the line on the chain of noise from safety ground being connected all over prior. It still works as safety, but not for your objectives.

[mlundy57]

His filter is a weak spot, and it's possible for the parastic capacitance due to the construction to cause some radiation. A grounded box would reduce RF incoming, and there for less to radiate. It has to be grounded to the RCA's ground however or it'll still radiate.

What do you mean by a ground box and how would I connect all the RCA's to it?  Only my subwoofer cables have grounds attached.

[mlundy57]

I'm just saying mini service in place of anything that isn't the main panel. Code is to tie neutral and safety at the main panel but never at subsequent panels. I'm not sure if it's per building or just per service location from power pole.

The issue with safety ground is that it's common to daisy chain it every which way to Sunday, so potentials, noise, etc can really become a problem for your secondary service panels, as it's possible to be down the line on the chain of noise from safety ground being connected all over prior. It still works as safety, but not for your objectives.

That is very likely here. The original house wiring follows no logical pattern as I learned it.

[Folsom]

Hal suggested safety grounding it, but that won't work. Grounding it to the RCA's would. Because all the grounds are connected on the jacks, I'd just remove the inside insulating ring. With a plastic box it won't do too much, but with a metal box it'll prevent incoming RF from radiating so much.

As practice I recommend doing the output jacks, which doesn't always matter but because the inductance is higher after the caps, I'd do it on those two. Then I'd stat ground to them from in and sub-out jacks.

[Folsom]

That is very likely here. The original house wiring follows no logical pattern as I learned it.

Power conditioner can help. There's a few ground isolating things that can help that aren't hard to implement or such. You can stop ground noise over RCA's following my little controversial device without the volume, in lab section. It could be in your new metal box. And then you could use Schurter DENO inductors on grounds for equipment/power distribution. That said, some filtration would help on the hot/neutral, because it's always better even in the most problem free houses. 

[bdp24]

Battery powered electronics are starting to look worth investigating, aren't they?!

[Captainhemo]

 

Battery powered electronics are starting to look worth investigating, aren't they?!

Oh my, I'm just discovering

[Folsom]

Battery powered electronics are starting to look worth investigating, aren't they?!

Personally, no.

[Captainhemo]

Personally, no.

I just made the switch and I'm extremely impressed.
Extremely black  and  dynamic,  I'm only playing with about 10wpc, quite stunning actually

-jay

[HAL]

My suggestion was to ground the shielding of crossover box to the RCA grounds.  I did not say a safety ground. 

As also suggested, the RCA cables should be well shielded to reduce the RFI if that is the cause.

The best way is to isolate the RFI source and disable it. 

[G Georgopoulos]

I just made the switch and I'm extremely impressed.
Extremely black  and  dynamic,  I'm only playing with about 10wpc, quite stunning actually

-jay

Jay,I'm very happy for you,I know what you mean

[Captainhemo]

Jay,I'm very happy for you,I know what you mean

Thanks Greg, me too 

jay