telescope help for a beginner

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GT Audio Works

Re: telescope help for a beginner
« Reply #20 on: 18 Aug 2014, 10:10 pm »
Good call...This is a nice scope for the money..It will show a lot more than a 90mm refractor will.
Its not too big..will fit in a car and a closet for storage.
keep the end covered when not in use to reduce dust buildup on the mirror.
I think you will enjoy the intelliscope feature, your son will be able to move it without the aide of motors to explore the sky.
Kids like hands on.
Don't sweat the accessories, some basics...a red filter flashlight to keep your night vision , a beginners intro to the night sky... Don't bother with the barlow..it doubles the magnification of your eyepiece, but it also reduces the field of view.
Better to spend the money on a nice wide field eyepiece. The eyepieces that come with it will not be the greatest..but fine to start out on.
The moon filter at 6"of aperture is optional..while the moon will be bright to the eye..it will not so bright as to make you squint like a larger scope would. Forget about the skyglow filter...pretty useless....Do yourself a favor and load load Stellarium on a laptop its free and great to see what's out there.  Enjoy.

rif

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Re: telescope help for a beginner
« Reply #21 on: 24 Aug 2014, 03:02 pm »
Ugh! My used Orion xt6i from amazon fell through. Luckily they have amazing customer service.

So I'm now looking at a new xt6 (no computer), an Orion StarBlast 6, and something interesting I stumbled into - Astronomers Without Borders OneSky. All have approx the same aperture (6" and 130mm). I emailed AWB requesting some more info.

I guess I put the StarBlast 6 on the list since my experience with the used xt6i disappointed. I know that's not rational :-(    and the OneSky is just intriguing, and inexpensive ($200).













rif

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Re: telescope help for a beginner
« Reply #22 on: 27 Aug 2014, 12:34 am »
Yes!!!! I made my decision. Now I'm going to exercise some restraint and order later this week. To make sure I got it right.

Orion StarBlast 6i
A 6" tabletop reflector with 750mm focal length and push-to capabilities ($460)
It blows through the budget, but isn't it always like that? And my budget didn't include accessories like bags....

And a big bonus... My father is giving me his Nikon d60 DSLR with some Nikkor lenses. I'm sure you camera buffs won't think this is a great camera, but from what I've read its pretty good and should meet my needs.

Thank you all for your help and patience! I'll be looking into all the info you provide.

Guy 13

Re: telescope help for a beginner
« Reply #23 on: 27 Aug 2014, 02:07 am »
Yes!!!! I made my decision. Now I'm going to exercise some restraint and order later this week. To make sure I got it right.

Orion StarBlast 6i
A 6" tabletop reflector with 750mm focal length and push-to capabilities ($460)
It blows through the budget, but isn't it always like that? And my budget didn't include accessories like bags....

And a big bonus... My father is giving me his Nikon d60 DSLR with some Nikkor lenses. I'm sure you camera buffs won't think this is a great camera, but from what I've read its pretty good and should meet my needs.

Thank you all for your help and patience! I'll be looking into all the info you provide.

Hi rif.
Will you buy an adaptor to mount your Nikon D60 on your telescope?
If your answer is : Yes,
then I hope you will post some pictures of the infinity and beyond,
well talking for myself, I would like to see in pictures the ring od Saturn.
Keep us posted, I am really interested in your new hobby.
Thanks.

Guy 13


rif

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Re: telescope help for a beginner
« Reply #24 on: 27 Aug 2014, 02:16 am »
Here is the adapter mount. I was surprised that was all I need. Intuitively it doesn't seem strong enough to hold the camera





http://www.telescope.com/catalog/product.jsp?itemUUID=99f1083aedae48978fb665771c8d164e&subCategoryId=62&parentCategoryId=0&categoryId=4&quantity=1&productVariantId=146775&productId=5205

richidoo

Re: telescope help for a beginner
« Reply #25 on: 27 Aug 2014, 03:12 am »
My kids have the smallest Orion XT4.5 reflector. It has survived little kids' abuse for a decade. My youngest is getting more serious about astronomy than the other kids did so this year I cleaned the mirror for the first time, collimated it for the first time, aligned the finder scope with a distant branch outside. Doing all that improved it 100%. Maybe it was this good when it was new, but I was surprised what the maintenance did.  +1 for Orion dobs.  I'd like a finder computer and more light sometimes, but my kids are content for now.

Mini astronomy karma giveaway:  I have a brand new copy of "Understanding Foucalt" by David Harbour. Free, shipped for the first taker... PM only plz!!! Don't hijack rif's thread. thx
Rich

JerryM

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Re: telescope help for a beginner
« Reply #26 on: 27 Aug 2014, 03:14 am »
I've had a few telescopes in the past. They're great! I've bought two of them from Edmund Scientifics. They have tons of cool shit, and a lot of telescopes, too. They have a no BS guarantee, and walk the walk.

Just another option.  :thumb:

Have fun,

Jerry

Guy 13

Re: telescope help for a beginner
« Reply #27 on: 27 Aug 2014, 03:28 am »
Here is the adapter mount. I was surprised that was all I need. Intuitively it doesn't seem strong enough to hold the camera





http://www.telescope.com/catalog/product.jsp?itemUUID=99f1083aedae48978fb665771c8d164e&subCategoryId=62&parentCategoryId=0&categoryId=4&quantity=1&productVariantId=146775&productId=5205

Hi rif.
Thanks for getting back to me with that info.
I was next expecting so much (Picture) but now that you have posted it,
I thank you.
Now, I will wait for some outstanding extraordinary sky pictures
to look at and enjoy.
Thanks again.

Guy 13

When I look at good quality, high resolution pictures I'm like hypnotists.

Speedskater

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Re: telescope help for a beginner
« Reply #28 on: 27 Aug 2014, 01:22 pm »
The local astronomical club is having a program next month:

Cleveland Astronomical Society

'How to Buy and Sell Used Telescopes'

Gain experienced advice on how to navigate the world of used astronomy equipment whether looking for a classic 1950s telescope or last year’s latest and greatest.

7:30 – 9:30 p.m.

GT Audio Works

Re: telescope help for a beginner
« Reply #29 on: 27 Aug 2014, 01:59 pm »
I just got back from the Black Forest Star Party bfsp.org.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pb2rzfRB3-A
The weather for the party was dreadful, but Monday night was awesome.
Almost perfect weather conditions. DARK DARK SKY. Milky Way from horizon to horizon. As I said in previous posts, a place like this is the best place to get a hands on look at many types of telescopes. Here is a pic of me at the event from a few years back with a smaller but high quality refractor I owned 
Greg




dwk

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Re: telescope help for a beginner
« Reply #30 on: 27 Aug 2014, 02:05 pm »
Here is the adapter mount. I was surprised that was all I need. Intuitively it doesn't seem strong enough to hold the camera





http://www.telescope.com/catalog/product.jsp?itemUUID=99f1083aedae48978fb665771c8d164e&subCategoryId=62&parentCategoryId=0&categoryId=4&quantity=1&productVariantId=146775&productId=5205

Hmmm, photography wasn't on your original list of desires when you started asking about a telescope. Astrophotography and visual observing are really 2 rather different pursuits, even though to a beginner it may seem like the 'should be' similar. Your Starblast 6 is not a greatchoice of scope if you want to try to take pictures of anything other than the moon and maybe some planets.  (although to be fair, there really isn't anything in your original budget that is workable for astrophotography in the first place)
 You can certainly try to hook your camera up, but I'd caution you to keep your expectations very low to start with - in fact you might not even be able to achieve focus with just a t-ring.  If you can, then taking stills of the moon or else using it as a video camera to try to take some sequences of planets (which you then post-process/stack to get a single usable image) would be the place to start.
 Visual astronomy is generally a pursuit that doesn't need a lot of $$$ to pay back. A decent Dobsonian for ~500 is a fantastic start.  Astrophotography of 'deep sky objects' though is a different beast altogether - there are times where it makes even audio seem sane and reasonable (of course, then I come back to an audio forum....). If it's something you're interested in, then definitely start with some research - it's a big topic.
 

dwk

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Re: telescope help for a beginner
« Reply #31 on: 27 Aug 2014, 02:16 pm »
I just got back from the Black Forest Star Party bfsp.org.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pb2rzfRB3-A
The weather for the party was dreadful, but Monday night was awesome.
Almost perfect weather conditions. DARK DARK SKY. Milky Way from horizon to horizon.
[cut]
Interesting - I had no idea there was a big dark zone right in the middle of PA. I was looking at the dark sky maps yesterday and it's almost comical how the US is divided in half at the Mississippi - east of that dark zones are hard to come by. Edit: looking again, the dividing line isn't actually the Mississippi - it's well west of that running north from Dallas through Oklahoma up to Fargo.  Very cool overlay for google maps here http://djlorenz.github.io/astronomy/lp2006/overlay/dark.html

We have a small off-grid cabin in southern CO that has skies that look to be about comparable to that location, although we do get a bit of glow in the N and S horizons that probably wouldn't be there in the Black Forest park. If anyone hasn't experienced being in a dark location on a clear night with no moon, I strongly urge you to try to achieve it. Astronomy has kinda replaced audio for me as a current active pursuit, but honestly the single biggest/best experience IMHO is just getting to a dark site, looking up and being completely unable to do anything but say 'WOW'. 

rif

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Re: telescope help for a beginner
« Reply #32 on: 27 Aug 2014, 02:17 pm »
Your Starblast 6 is not a greatchoice of scope if you want to try to take pictures of anything other than the moon and maybe some planets.  (although to be fair, there really isn't anything in your original budget that is workable for astrophotography in the first place)
 You can certainly try to hook your camera up, but I'd caution you to keep your expectations very low to start with - in fact you might not even be able to achieve focus with just a t-ring.  If you can, then taking stills of the moon or else using it as a video camera to try to take some sequences of planets (which you then post-process/stack to get a single usable image) would be the place to start.


That's all I'm hoping for- moon, Saturn, Jupiter, mars. My tentative plan was to have it take a sequence of stills automatically and stack them. I'm really not expecting much, visual or photo, at first since there will be a ton of light pollution.


dwk

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Re: telescope help for a beginner
« Reply #33 on: 27 Aug 2014, 02:20 pm »
That's all I'm hoping for- moon, Saturn, Jupiter, mars. My tentative plan was to have it take a sequence of stills automatically and stack them. I'm really not expecting much, visual or photo, at first since there will be a ton of light pollution.

You should be able to get some OK results with this approach. Using the Nikon in video mode rather than still mode for planets might be a better route. This way you get hundreds of frames quickly, and since the planets are really small you don't actually give up much in terms of resolution. The good news is that planetary imaging is actually much cheaper and in many ways easier than deep-sky, although both have their processing quirks that take some time to get a grip on. Getting a dedicated astro-video cam for planets if you really get interested isn't a huge investment - $100-300.

Edit: this is as long as the Nikon has a video mode that doesn't compress the @#$@## out of things. If so, then your idea of just a sequence of stills would be better.

thunderbrick

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Re: telescope help for a beginner
« Reply #34 on: 27 Aug 2014, 02:24 pm »
in fact you might not even be able to achieve focus with just a t-ring.  If you can, then taking stills of the moon or else using it as a video camera to try to take some sequences of planets (which you then post-process/stack to get a single usable image) would be the place to start.


That's right!  The T-mount is kind of a universal accessory converter, and you'll still need a telescope/microscope adapter to "grab" the tube through which you look.  The scope and eyepiece the become the "lens" which projects the image into the camera sensor.  Whatever dial you use to focus when looking through the scope is the same one you used to focus the image into the camera.  If memory serves me correctly when you look through the scope-mounted camera the image will be REALLY dark, so don't blow your night vision checking AC on your iPad.   :thumb:

rif

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Re: telescope help for a beginner
« Reply #35 on: 27 Aug 2014, 11:01 pm »
That's right!  The T-mount is kind of a universal accessory converter, and you'll still need a telescope/microscope adapter to "grab" the tube through which you look.  The scope and eyepiece the become the "lens" which projects the image into the camera sensor.  Whatever dial you use to focus when looking through the scope is the same one you used to focus the image into the camera.  If memory serves me correctly when you look through the scope-mounted camera the image will be REALLY dark, so don't blow your night vision checking AC on your iPad.   :thumb:

Just so I know I'm buying everything I need for now: scope attaches to t-ring, t-ring attaches to dslr camera body (no camera lens). So all I need to get is a t-ring.


GT Audio Works

Re: telescope help for a beginner
« Reply #36 on: 28 Aug 2014, 12:43 am »
Interesting - I had no idea there was a big dark zone right in the middle of PA. I was looking at the dark sky maps yesterday and it's almost comical how the US is divided in half at the Mississippi - east of that dark zones are hard to come by. Edit: looking again, the dividing line isn't actually the Mississippi - it's well west of that running north from Dallas through Oklahoma up to Fargo.  Very cool overlay for google maps here http://djlorenz.github.io/astronomy/lp2006/overlay/dark.html

We have a small off-grid cabin in southern CO that has skies that look to be about comparable to that location, although we do get a bit of glow in the N and S horizons that probably wouldn't be there in the Black Forest park. If anyone hasn't experienced being in a dark location on a clear night with no moon, I strongly urge you to try to achieve it. Astronomy has kinda replaced audio for me as a current active pursuit, but honestly the single biggest/best experience IMHO is just getting to a dark site, looking up and being completely unable to do anything but say 'WOW'.
The reason for the dark sky in Cherry Springs PA. is its remote location nestled between 2500ft peaks. it is designated as an astronomy state park. It has amenities like camping, bathrooms drinking water and electric , as well as a few observatories for rent. There is not anything much there but the occasional general store with a gas pump out front. Its a 4 hr drive from my house and worth the ride. The only darker sky on the east coast is in Maine.
I had similar WOW experience in the Florida Keys...there is a dark area between Key West and Marathon...I was driving down and pulled over and looked up and saw shimmering Milky Way across the sky...I woke up my 5 yr old daughter from the back seat, she got out of the car ,looked up and said WOW !!!

thunderbrick

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Re: telescope help for a beginner
« Reply #37 on: 28 Aug 2014, 12:45 am »
Almost.  T-mount replaces camera lens, and is designed to accept a whole host of generic accessories.  You can't hook the T-mount direct to the scope. 

Get something like this:  http://www.ebay.com/itm/Adapter-T2-Telescope-Camera-Eyepiece-Projection-Prime-Focus-Photo-DKA4-/380919233806?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item58b08e3d0e

and thread it into the T-mount. 

Remove the eyepiece from the scope tube, slide the tube over the scope tube, reinstall the eyepiece (I forget what scope heads call it; Barlow, maybe?) and attach camera body to the T-mount.

Ultimately the rig should look like this:  http://www.ebay.com/itm/Nikon-camera-2-telescope-eyepiece-adapter-4-Prime-focus-projection-photography-/261550222911?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3ce59bae3f

This is what I remember from dabbling in scopes some 20 years ago.

rif

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Re: telescope help for a beginner
« Reply #38 on: 28 Aug 2014, 01:49 am »
Almost.  T-mount replaces camera lens, and is designed to accept a whole host of generic accessories.  You can't hook the T-mount direct to the scope. 

Get something like this:  http://www.ebay.com/itm/Adapter-T2-Telescope-Camera-Eyepiece-Projection-Prime-Focus-Photo-DKA4-/380919233806?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item58b08e3d0e

and thread it into the T-mount. 

Remove the eyepiece from the scope tube, slide the tube over the scope tube, reinstall the eyepiece (I forget what scope heads call it; Barlow, maybe?) and attach camera body to the T-mount.

Ultimately the rig should look like this:  http://www.ebay.com/itm/Nikon-camera-2-telescope-eyepiece-adapter-4-Prime-focus-projection-photography-/261550222911?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3ce59bae3f

This is what I remember from dabbling in scopes some 20 years ago.

OK this is making more sense, and of course getting more expensive. Which is a little different than audio, where things don't always make sense but get expensive ;-)

Looking at the picture in the second link- that has to be a huge torque on the telescope! And for those with expensive cameras, a real nail biter. I don't know if this is going to work on mine, but I'm going to try. I may have to cobble together some kind of magnetic counterweight. It has a simple tabletop base.


thunderbrick

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Re: telescope help for a beginner
« Reply #39 on: 28 Aug 2014, 02:57 am »
Relax, Rif, your D60 don't weigh nuttin'!   8)  The item in the second link seemed unusually long.  A buddy of mine has a cheap scope and a camera adapter, and it's nowhere near that big.

Keep in mind that these parts haven't changed in decades, AFAIK.  There should be plenty of these things kicking around in basements of 'scope nuts.

One caveat:  I don't know if the pricier scopes use a viewing tube (?) larger in diameter than the Walmart crap, and therefore uses larger eyepieces = larger scope adapters.  Ask smarter people then me.  There's lots of 'em out there.   :thumb: