Recommended speakers for classical music

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jimdgoulding

Re: Recommended speakers for classical music
« Reply #100 on: 29 Mar 2012, 01:42 am »
As some posters here have implied, not all classical music is the same.  Large-scale orchestral works, opera, and some choral, especially of the Romantic, Late- and Post-Romantic eras has huge dynamic range -- think of those crescendos where the tympany and every other instrument plays the same note fortisimo a the same time.  :)

On the other hand chamber music, (which I listen to a lot), has much more in common with acoustic Jazz.  Also, Classical era orchestral, (think Haydn & Mozart), especially "HIP" performances, is much less demanding than the above Romantic stuff in terms of the huge dynamics.

Speaking of Magneplanars, first, these are what I've got and love; see my setup here.  Maggies are certainly among the great choices for acoustic music in general. With adequate amplification they do justice to all but the hugest Romantic-style crescendos.  Well there is an exception: the smallest Maggies, the MMG and maybe MG 12, just won't do it uless you use suwoofer set to a high, say 80 Hz, crossover, (both low and High bass).
Hi, Feanor.  Nice post, however your link isn't working.

Ericus Rex

Re: Recommended speakers for classical music
« Reply #101 on: 29 Mar 2012, 03:42 pm »
I heard the Reference 3a Grand Veenas at a show, playing orchestral music, and I thought the sound was excellent!  Very airy and open and one of the most musical speakers for classical I've ever heard.  To my ears, they bested speakers in other rooms that were several times the price.  I'd say they're a steal at their $8k asking price.  If you listen to rock music at all I'd recommend a home audition before buying; not sure how well they'd ROCK!  But Classical and small scale acoustic they do in spades.

Mike82

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Re: Recommended speakers for classical music
« Reply #102 on: 7 Apr 2012, 10:54 pm »
I’d recommend any of the Ohm speakers. Their quasi-omnidirectional presentation gives and expansive sound suitable for classical music. 

I’ve owned/reviewed these over the past 40 years and by far prefer the Ohms.

Wharfedale W60, EPI 150, Braun L710, DCM Time Window, Spendor SP1/2, Mirage M3-si, Monitor Audio Studio 6, APL Serenade, JM Labs Daline 3.1, Micron Karat, Wisdom Audio 50, Clements 206di, Shamrock Eire, Equation 7, 9, Silverline S12, SR15, SR17, Panatella, Sonatina, Sonata, Galante Rhapsody, SAP Quartete, Klipschorn, Klipsch Belle, Heresy, KG4, Shahinian Obelisk, Omega Super 3, Harbeth C7II, Lamhorn,  Altec Valencia, JM Reynaud Twin, Trente, Offrande, Magneplanar 1.2, GPA 604-8H, Ohm Micro Walsh, 100, 3000.


FireGuy

Re: Recommended speakers for classical music
« Reply #103 on: 7 Apr 2012, 11:42 pm »
Axiom has just introduced their new Omindirectional, DPS controlled tower...the LFR1100.   At $2800 (Pre-order) you may want to give these a look. 

jimdgoulding

Re: Recommended speakers for classical music
« Reply #104 on: 8 Apr 2012, 12:14 am »
I heard the Reference 3a Grand Veenas at a show, playing orchestral music, and I thought the sound was excellent!  Very airy and open and one of the most musical speakers for classical I've ever heard.  To my ears, they bested speakers in other rooms that were several times the price.  I'd say they're a steal at their $8k asking price.  If you listen to rock music at all I'd recommend a home audition before buying; not sure how well they'd ROCK!  But Classical and small scale acoustic they do in spades.
That's one that would be on my short list for my current room with the DeVore Nines.  Efficient enough for tube amps, too.  Bigger room, bigger amp . . Magnepan 3.7's. would get an audition, absolutmente.  I listen predominately to recordings made on location.  Purity of instrumental tone and body, articulation and dynamic sweep, and 3D seperation of instruments and a stage I can walk around in or is realistic to memory from a distance bout sums it up for me.  I'm pretty good to go as is, but could appreciate a grander scale.  The volume control and my speaker placement works pretty well for me considering that my speakers are on the small side.

Paul_Bui

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Re: Recommended speakers for classical music
« Reply #105 on: 8 Apr 2012, 12:39 am »
Hello Paul,
  If your stereo sounds good with one type of music (Jazz) but not with another (classical) I would be tempted to look at your source first. The difference between classical and Jazz is in most cases the actual number of instruments playing at one time. I don't know what equipment you have but assume that it is very revealing, a good quality two way speaker can sound nice enough with all types of music without getting in the way too much.  :D

Yes, I changed the source and things have gotten much better.  A SBT (Squeezebox Touch) modded by Bolder Cable's Wayne, powered by Teddy Pardo's TTouch PS, feeding a Teddy Pardo's DAC.  Preamp is Single Power MPX3 SE, soon replaced by Dodd Audio's latest active preamp.  Thank you.

Paul_Bui

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Re: Recommended speakers for classical music
« Reply #106 on: 8 Apr 2012, 12:47 am »
How big is your room?  How loud do you listen?  What kind of classical music do you have compliant about?  Is this just an itch to get new toys? 

As you know Paul, I have the original pair of FTA-2000s.  They are driven in a nearfield setup by similar chip amps to yours in a 8ft x 13ft x 22ft room.  I'm still a proud papa and in fact am scheduled to have the drivers "EnABLE'd" by Bud Purvine himself.  Bud has stated that these AlNiCo drivers are perhaps the most accurate in the world.  But I acknowledge the itch to get sexier speakers versus staring at those plain 8 inch drivers.

For readers not familiar with the FTA-2000s google Bob Brines.  Bob's taste runs towards the Baroque so they're great for all kinds of smaller ensembles, they reach below 30 Hz (even the raw driver is factory rated flat to 30 Hz), and the rated peak output in my room/setup is 109 dB. 

To go from the ideal point source to a planar or vertical array would be a big change (and IMO a big step backwards) in terms of detail and the type of imaging you'd hear.  Your speakers are transmission lines, so the bass is tight/low/musical with roll off matching room gain and doesn't have any boxy artifacts in the midrange.  But the smaller VMPS speakers with one (or maybe two) ribbon midrange drivers, with their extended frequency range, provide much of coherency of single driver designs.  So one of my favorite multi-driver designs is the VMPS 626.  With all the options and stands they cost about the same as the FTA-2000s, but would need a good sub, active crossover, and multiple amps to match up. 

I've noticed that orchestral or symphonic music lacks individual/separated sound sources through the FTA-2000s.  This could be a factor of the recording/mixing methods used or just a comparision to the smaller ensembles.  I know that when I attend such live presentation (not often enough) that I can't hear individual performers either, no matter how close I sit or how hard I've tried (with the visual cues to help).

Hi Jeff,

I think my Patek SE, although very good, perhaps not powerful enough for playing classical music on the FTA-2000s, which have been much better after the filter's components upgraded to better quality.  Not everyone will approve this component upgraditis, but I like what I hear.  I'm thinking of getting a good class D amp, thanks to this AC forum.

bakufu

Re: Recommended speakers for classical music
« Reply #107 on: 17 Apr 2012, 04:46 pm »
i replaced my 15 year old apogee divas with a pair of emerald physics open-baffle speakers.  90% of my listening is classical, about evenly divided between the genres (choral, opera, orchestra, chamber, instrumental).  so far, and especially after the first 200 hours for break-in, i am more than satisfied. 

i can't entirely discount the difference made by the associated electronics.  in the case of the apogee, a krell fpb600 amp and, as a source, the krell kps25 cd player/preamp.  for the emerald physics cs1.3s, DEQ and room-correction via spatial computer and a prism orpheus preamp/dac.  tri-amped, but in total half the weight and a fraction of the cost of the krell gear.

i can't think of a single dimension where i prefer the divas, or indeed any of the speakers i've used over the years (B&W 801, martin-logan sequel II).

not entirely trusting my own impressions, i hosted a small group of musicians this last weekend for a listening session.  although i've spent a good deal of time in the concert hall, i wanted a reality-check from people with experience making and listening to music in a range of venues.  we even did a small "is it live experiment", a recorded george garzone solo vs. a live take from one of my friends.  the giveaway was that garzone is a much, much better sax player (no surprise there), but other than that, they were shockingly similar.


Tyson

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Re: Recommended speakers for classical music
« Reply #108 on: 17 Apr 2012, 05:00 pm »
Agreed, high efficiency open baffle speakers with good tonality are awesome with classical!

Russell Dawkins

Re: Recommended speakers for classical music
« Reply #109 on: 2 May 2012, 05:09 pm »
i can't think of a single dimension where i prefer the divas, or indeed any of the speakers i've used over the years (B&W 801, martin-logan sequel II).

not entirely trusting my own impressions, i hosted a small group of musicians this last weekend for a listening session.  although i've spent a good deal of time in the concert hall, i wanted a reality-check from people with experience making and listening to music in a range of venues.  we even did a small "is it live experiment", a recorded george garzone solo vs. a live take from one of my friends.  the giveaway was that garzone is a much, much better sax player (no surprise there), but other than that, they were shockingly similar.

I am curious as to the response of your musician friends to your Emerald Physics.

Photon46

Re: Recommended speakers for classical music = Orions
« Reply #110 on: 2 May 2012, 05:52 pm »
Linkwitz Orions... about as close to the real performance as your source will allow.  IME, this is true across a wide range of musical styles, but whether it's piano, string quartets, voice, huge orchestra and chorus, the Orions do classical extremely well.

If you want pipe organ at realistic levels, you might eventually add Thor subwoofers, but many (like me) are happy with the bass capability of the standard Orions.

http://www.linkwitzlab.com/index.html

Good luck with your quest,
Peter

I spent a bit of time listening to the Linkwitz Orions at AXPONA in Jacksonville and was quite impressed with them. Definitely one of the best sounding rooms at the show IMO. (They were being driven with Pass amplification.) I also heard Tidal speakers at Axpona and was smitten by their sound as well. I recently added a set of Tidal Piano Ceras to my setup and am amazed by their performance. The majority of my listening is classical music and all size ensembles, whether solo performer, string quartet, opera, or full blown orchestral, sound breathtaking.

jerryleefish

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Re: Recommended speakers for classical music
« Reply #111 on: 1 Jun 2012, 04:35 am »
I feel some speakers are more suited to classical music and simply don't cut it with rock and high volume selections. Use of indirect bass especially folded horns ie Klipsch do not accurately reproduce the floor thumping quality of modern percussion. Bass content in most orchestral works has a subtle nature which is derived from the ensemble playing of lower strings. This then is the realm of indirect low frequency drivers.

Elmo

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Re: Recommended speakers for classical music
« Reply #112 on: 25 May 2013, 02:37 am »
Hi everybody, my first post on AudioCircle   :)

I find that when auditioning speakers I have in mind the genres of music I play most.  For me a balance of attack and the ability to be graceful is what I look for, which is often a difficult balance.  Speakers that lack verve, in my view, weaken the drama of classical music.  Some speakers often recommended for classical to my ears sound too laid back or dry. 

The most challenging aspect for a speaker IMHO is getting the subtleties of bass from say string sounds like deep dark cello passages, especially when they are very soft.  A speaker for classical music needs to display the details and colours of the different instruments very clearly.

Rob Babcock

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Re: Recommended speakers for classical music
« Reply #113 on: 31 May 2013, 08:20 am »
Welcome, Elmo! :thumb:

Ericus Rex

Re: Recommended speakers for classical music
« Reply #114 on: 31 May 2013, 10:51 am »
Hi everybody, my first post on AudioCircle   :)

I find that when auditioning speakers I have in mind the genres of music I play most.  For me a balance of attack and the ability to be graceful is what I look for, which is often a difficult balance.  Speakers that lack verve, in my view, weaken the drama of classical music.  Some speakers often recommended for classical to my ears sound too laid back or dry. 

The most challenging aspect for a speaker IMHO is getting the subtleties of bass from say string sounds like deep dark cello passages, especially when they are very soft.  A speaker for classical music needs to display the details and colours of the different instruments very clearly.

Yes, welcome, Elmo!

So what have you found that works well for classical music?

ThuanDB

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Re: Recommended speakers for classical music
« Reply #115 on: 26 Feb 2014, 12:55 am »
My latest and hopefully last set up for classical (and pretty much everything else) includes Linkwitz's Pluto 2.1+, Dodd's variable gain preamp, Teddy Pardo's DAC, modded SBT or JPLAY/JKspdif3 as discless transport.  I am a happy listener now.

Cheers!

jimdgoulding

Re: Recommended speakers for classical music
« Reply #116 on: 26 Feb 2014, 01:23 am »
When it comes to listening to live music in a concert hall, nearly everything you hear no matter what seat you are in is due to the acoustics of the hall itself. In Boston Symphony Hall, about 89% 16 feet from the performing stage and increasingly more as you sit further back. Unfortunately this sound is not on the recording to any significant degree and there's no way to reproduce it if it were. Virtually all recordings are made with the microphones far closer to the instruments than anyone in the audience is, usually no more than a few feet away and they generally have a cardiod pickup pattern which favors sounds coming from the direction they are pointed in. The result is a very "dry" non reverberant sound compared to the real thing. The one exception are binaural recordings where the mikes are where you'd sit but reproducing it though headphones sounds like the source is inside your head and reproducing it through speakers makes it sound like they are in a tunnel and you are on the outside. I think the abilitiy to reproduce live concert hall sound is still well beyond the state of the art.

My biggest beefs with recording techniques are overly loud and shrill piccolos and highlight miking soloists when the balance engineer exaggerates their loudness compared to the rest of an orchestra.
Favorite classical recordings of mine typically use very discreet microphoning.  Check out Stavinsky's The Firebird Suite and don't miss the flip side The Song of The Nightingale from Reference Recordings.  Expensive but worth it.  You are believably in the hall itself.  I adjust my seat in the hall with judicious use of my volume control which you should be able to do, too, if your speaker positioning and room are sympathetic.

Freo-1

Re: Recommended speakers for classical music
« Reply #117 on: 26 Feb 2014, 02:21 am »

Loudspeaker limitations that are tolerable or even unnoticeable on other types of music are more likely to be intolerable on classical.  So it's not so much that special speakers are required for classical; rather, it's that less-special speakers are acceptable on most other types of music.

Well stated.  Classical has upwards of 40 db of dynamics, and it is not amplified, so it's more demanding across the board. 

For my case, I found that speakers like those made by ATC (with serious over engineered drivers), along with a subwoofer, can get the listener a lot closer to what one would expect classical to sound like.  The electronics connected to the speaker makes a difference as well.  For example, I recently obtained a 6AH4 preamp to use with 1625 mono blocks.  The 6AH4 is a low mu tube with a lot of drive, and makes for one damn fine sounding preamp. 

S Clark

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Re: Recommended speakers for classical music
« Reply #118 on: 26 Feb 2014, 03:27 am »
Although this is an old thread (the original poster hasn't checked in for a couple of years), it is worth reviving.  "Best" for classical is such a hard thing to nail down.  Jimd's rig sounds awfully good on much of the classical that I've heard on it... a mtm with a sub in a medium room.  Yet if I want Rossini overtures in full volume, I'll take my giant LS9's in a large listening room.  If it's Spanish guitar, I go to my Neo2x rig in my den (or even a pair of Zigmahornets that usually reside in a closet-they do solo guitar amazingly well).  But, in my experience so far, nothing does big orchestra like big speakers.

alfajim

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Re: Recommended speakers for classical music
« Reply #119 on: 27 Feb 2015, 03:43 am »
Although this is an old thread (the original poster hasn't checked in for a couple of years), it is worth reviving.  "Best" for classical is such a hard thing to nail down.  Jimd's rig sounds awfully good on much of the classical that I've heard on it... a mtm with a sub in a medium room.  Yet if I want Rossini overtures in full volume, I'll take my giant LS9's in a large listening room.  If it's Spanish guitar, I go to my Neo2x rig in my den (or even a pair of Zigmahornets that usually reside in a closet-they do solo guitar amazingly well).  But, in my experience so far, nothing does big orchestra like big speakers.

Clark glad that you picked up this thread as I read all the way through and was hoping it didn't end a year or so ago. I have gotten back into vinyl and have been aquiring a lot of classical LP's to listen to. It seems that all the previous posters are saying that you have to have real expensive speakers to listen to classical? I am listening to my LP's through a pair of older Technic SB-2520 three way with 10" woofers driven by a JVC RX-6020 AV amp 100WPC in 2 channel mode, and they make the music live with great soundstage like you are in the hall stage front with lots of detail. They also present the big band swing stuff the same.
Have no complaints about what I get from this setup, my front end is a JVC AX-1 TT and Cambridge 540p pre amp, on the digital side I have a Panasonic BD player for the CD's and movies. Listen to all in 2 channel.

Jim