Line Source Arrays

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Don_S

Line Source Arrays
« on: 12 Apr 2017, 08:00 pm »
I was not quite sure where to put this.  Facilitator, please feel free to move.

Some of the best speakers I have heard have been line-source arrays. The best had open-baffle design for the tweeter and sometimes the midrange as well.  They cost more than the total cost of several new cars. Needless to say, not for me.

Can anyone mention brands that are more modestly priced. e.g. less than the cost of 1 car.   :lol: They do not have to be partial OB although partial OB or full OB would be preferred.   I am having a hard time finding any to even look at. As many shows as I have been to, none come to mind.

S Clark

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Re: Line Source Arrays
« Reply #1 on: 12 Apr 2017, 09:11 pm »
The obvious choice are the LS6 and LS9 speakers designed by Danny Richie.  These are the fore runners of his open baffle designs, and share a similar open quality, if for no other reason than each driver is doing so little work.  These come up for sale used on a fairly regular basis.  They take a lot of space, can be challenging to make work in a room, but are stunningly good. 
The LS6's often go for under $4000.  The LS9's are better, not as common, and were still available new from member Hugh at Angel City Audio.  Don't know if he still has them at around $8+K   I'd sell you mine, but I'd have to kill you and take them back.  When they do come up used, expect around $6K, maybe $4K if someone is desperate.

Just saw that a pair sold on US Audiomart for $2300.  Needless to say, they're gone.  Deals happen, but I'd expect to pay more. 

JohnR

Re: Line Source Arrays
« Reply #2 on: 13 Apr 2017, 02:47 am »
You could ask Rich Hollis about the line array he is working on, I'm not sure if it's going to be a commercial offering or not though: http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=142716.0

Rick Craig has done a number of arrays, not sure about availability as this page is on his site but not linked to the menu: http://www.selahaudio.com/arrays/

Danny Richie's NX-treme is kinda a line array (single tweeter): http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=145270.0

If you're feeling adventurous you could have a look at these:

http://www.parts-express.com/audio-artistry-cbt36k-line-array-speaker-pair-kit--301-980

Looks like the smaller version (full range drivers only, no tweeter line) is available prebuilt as well:

http://www.parts-express.com/epique-cbt24-line-array-speaker-system-pair--301-982
Kit: http://www.parts-express.com/epique-cbt24k-line-array-speaker-kit-pair--301-984

Off the shelf:

http://www.funkaudio.ca/store/p7/Funk_Audio_Line_Array_Pair.html

Christie Digital make some although they are designed for cinemas I guess (curved) : https://www.christiedigital.com/emea/cinema/cinema-products/cinema-speakers/screen-channel-loudspeakers

Pricing example: https://www.avalive.com/Christie-Digital/145-102104-02/207252/productDetail.php

Not exactly a line array... :
http://www.newformresearch.com/index.php/products/our-models/super-module
http://www.newformresearch.com/index.php/products/our-models/ribbon-pyramid-45


Overall, line arrays seems to be less popular than they were a few years ago... (?)

PDR

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Re: Line Source Arrays
« Reply #3 on: 13 Apr 2017, 05:15 am »
I've a couple of Ricks....Selah....arrays.
The Symmetricas for the fronts of my HT
and the Sedonas for the rears....

Yep, arrays for HT are the bomb..... :o

The Syms are really an incredible speaker, they were my 2 ch daily for a long time.


Rusty Jefferson

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Re: Line Source Arrays
« Reply #4 on: 13 Apr 2017, 12:53 pm »
So, only dynamic driver line array speakers?  Not planer with OB woofers, etc.

S Clark

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Re: Line Source Arrays
« Reply #5 on: 13 Apr 2017, 02:19 pm »
Well, I heard Danny R's prototype planar array, and it was the best sound I ever heard by far.  But the OP was asking about options that cost less than several new cars.  I also heard Rick's array that he designed with Parts Express, and thought it quite good- and that might be a good option.
As for Rich's experiment... knowing Rich, it will be cutting edge great sound, but if it is ever more than a one off, it won't be cheap.
Hence, my recommendation that the AV123/GR-Research LS6 is the best used option at the right price. 

Don_S

Re: Line Source Arrays
« Reply #6 on: 13 Apr 2017, 02:47 pm »
So, only dynamic driver line array speakers?  Not planer with OB woofers, etc.

Rusty,  Not sure what you mean.  The speakers I liked but could not afford used ribbons for mids/tweeter.  I am not sure how low the ribbons played.

John, Thanks for the suggestions.  I was hoping for something more mainstream and available.  For all the times I was at CES and T.H.E. Show Newport, I can't remember any line sources except Scaena and Perfect8.

http://scaena.com/
http://www.perfect8.com/force.htm  (forget about multiple cars, these cost more than my home)

HAL

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Re: Line Source Arrays
« Reply #7 on: 13 Apr 2017, 04:35 pm »
You might give a listen to the GT Audioworks GTA3R speaker.  They are planar/ribbon hybrid open baffle line arrays.  They maybe in your price range.  Add a pair of the dual OB servo subs and it is a great sounding system.  Heard them for 3 days at CAF2016.

http://www.gtaudioworks.com/

Greg Takesh of GTA made the ribbon tweeter array for The Megaliths that I built in the thread posted by JohnR. 

Since I am waiting on the completed dspMusik 16 channel digital crossover to complete my design, it is still an experimental speaker. 

Good luck with your search.

Rusty Jefferson

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Re: Line Source Arrays
« Reply #8 on: 13 Apr 2017, 04:49 pm »
Rusty,  Not sure what you mean.  The speakers I liked but could not afford used ribbons for mids/tweeter.  I am not sure how low the ribbons played.....
Most of the links provided were for dynamic driver line array speakers. I was just curious if planers (like Maggies/GT Audioworks) or electrostatic  (like Kingsound) were in consideration, or if you were looking for something similar to the provided links.

Don_S

Re: Line Source Arrays
« Reply #9 on: 13 Apr 2017, 05:18 pm »
Most of the links provided were for dynamic driver line array speakers. I was just curious if planers (like Maggies/GT Audioworks) or electrostatic  (like Kingsound) were in consideration, or if you were looking for something similar to the provided links.

Rusty,  While technically planar-magnetic and electrostatic speakers are OB they are usually classified by themselves and panels are not usually thought of as line-source. But I don't want to argue that point because I concede it might be muddy. To clarify, I am looking for non-panel speakers. As I said, I am having trouble thinking of any line-sources readily available.  Quad, Kingsound, and Maggies are well known. I have heard each on multiple occasions.

I am also considering OBs since line-source speakers are so rare. At least with OBs I can find some companies and models time-tested with affordable new speakers readily available. But that is another circle. I am not looking for one-offs or "hobby" builders.

Hugh

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Re: Line Source Arrays
« Reply #10 on: 13 Apr 2017, 06:06 pm »
The obvious choice are the LS6 and LS9 speakers designed by Danny Richie.  These are the fore runners of his open baffle designs, and share a similar open quality, if for no other reason than each driver is doing so little work.  These come up for sale used on a fairly regular basis.  They take a lot of space, can be challenging to make work in a room, but are stunningly good. 
The LS6's often go for under $4000.  The LS9's are better, not as common, and were still available new from member Hugh at Angel City Audio.  Don't know if he still has them at around $8+K   I'd sell you mine, but I'd have to kill you and take them back.  When they do come up used, expect around $6K, maybe $4K if someone is desperate.

Just saw that a pair sold on US Audiomart for $2300.  Needless to say, they're gone.  Deals happen, but I'd expect to pay more.

Thanks for the recommendation Scott.

We only have 1 LS9 pair left and that is it.

Scotlynn

Re: Line Source Arrays
« Reply #11 on: 13 Apr 2017, 07:24 pm »
I second HAL's recommendation on GTAW's GTA3R's. http://www.gtaudioworks.com/ I took deliver of my pair about 3 weeks ago and couldn't be happier.



I listen to a big range of different musical styles - classical, classic rock, singer-songwriter, post rock, female vocals, electronic, some jazz, lots of blues, etc - and Greg's speakers handle it all well. They're extremely versatile, with clear mids and highs, and they'll go down to 40hz on their own, but adding subs puts their performance within reach of speaker systems costing many times the price of an average car, IMO.

Greg delivered mine to my house just north of NYC, but there is a dealer located in Massapequa, New York. He has them set up with OB subs. Here's a pick Greg sent me while I was waiting on my pair:



They sell for $10K, but when he was over at my place Greg told me if I knew anyone interested he'd take the price off the airfare for anyone who auditions and buys a pair. You might want to check them out.

Rick Craig

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Re: Line Source Arrays
« Reply #12 on: 14 Apr 2017, 02:08 am »
Well, I heard Danny R's prototype planar array, and it was the best sound I ever heard by far.  But the OP was asking about options that cost less than several new cars.  I also heard Rick's array that he designed with Parts Express, and thought it quite good- and that might be a good option.
As for Rich's experiment... knowing Rich, it will be cutting edge great sound, but if it is ever more than a one off, it won't be cheap.
Hence, my recommendation that the AV123/GR-Research LS6 is the best used option at the right price.

Thanks but the CBT-36 wasn't my design. Don Keele and Marshall Kay built those for Audio Artistry. Don also has a new CBT array that is being sold by Parts Express. I collaborated with a friend in Texas to design a new CBT that he'll be showing in a few months at the annual Midwest Audio Fest in Dayton.

S Clark

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Re: Line Source Arrays
« Reply #13 on: 14 Apr 2017, 03:35 am »
Thanks but the CBT-36 wasn't my design. Don Keele and Marshall Kay built those for Audio Artistry. Don also has a new CBT array that is being sold by Parts Express. I collaborated with a friend in Texas to design a new CBT that he'll be showing in a few months at the annual Midwest Audio Fest in Dayton.
Oops.  Sorry, Rick.  I head a P.E. line array at the RMAF several years back and thought you were the designer.  Your other arrays definitely look interesting.  I heard one of your models (??- but not line array) in Austin a few years back and was very impressed.