[happyrabbit]

Back in the 45 family again    This 45 SET is a mix of old and new.  The amp is based on the KORNEFF circuit (built by Oliver Sayes) using iron from Hashimoto (h-507s). My 1st SET using Hashimoto iron.   The drivers are 6p5 and powered by a 5y4.  I have attached a couple pics for your viewing pleasure..

Enjoy

Dwight

[roscoe65]

Is that brand new?  I have a 421a amp from Oliver and it uses the Hashimoto HC-203U (http://jelabs.blogspot.com/2013/12/hashimoto-hc-203u-se-output-transformer.html) transformer, which is a modern day improved version of the Tango U808.  Its not potted or as pretty as yours though.  My amp is based on Don Garber's Fi 421a and uses Jensen capacitors instead of the sweet Jupiters you have.  But Oliver leaves a lot of space under the hood so there is room to replace them if I want.  It uses a 6SL7 (or 6SN7) and a 5Y4 (or 5Y3) rectifier and a 5998 or WE 421a tube.  Nice 4wpc.

[happyrabbit]

yep it's new

[roscoe65]

Oliver has done a number of these based on that circuit.  He likes to use vintage Tamura output transformers from old Sony RTR machines.  Not the best bass in the world, but sometimes smaller transformers can have a magic the big iron doesn't.

I like the old single triode driver tubes.  I have a preamp that uses 27 or56 tubes.  I'm guessing with the 6p5 driver tubes this amp really needs a preamp to get full power out of the 45's.

[MothAudio]

Very nice Dwight. I just replaced Exotica TFT caps with Jupiter caps in my 45 amp.

[happyrabbit]

The HC-203's were my 1st choice but would not fit...I agree that 'Less is More'.   I debated on using an Oil based over the Jupiter's.  I have used Jupiter Cu's in my MHDT DAC with positive results.  6p5 use all the gain from my 14db tube preamp.

thank you roscoe65 / mothaudio for your comments and insight 

Dwight

[roscoe65]

I was envious of your outputs until your comment:  I thought they were the H-20 at first.  Yours are pretty small.  But with the 45 that isn't much of a problem since the higher impedance give you greater inductance.

My H203's are a "cost down" version of the H20.  End bells instead of potted and flying leads instead of terminals.  It also has a slightly different core which results in slightly lower inductance.  They were already installed when I bought the amp (Oliver had it in his system at the time.  I was inquiring about a 2A3 amp he was selling and he offered this as an alternative).  I believe that Don Garber now uses the H-20's in his Fi 421A, replacing the Magnequest DS-025's he originally used.  I had a pair of DS-50's about 20 years ago that I was going to use for a 4 amp.  The Hashimoto's are a bit larger and of equal or better quality. 

[sfox7076]

I live right near oliver.  I have the luxury of hearing a lot of his work before it leaves.  He has a 26->46 from his system he is considering selling.  It sounds glorious.  1.5Ws won't work for me (and I already have a 10Y to a 300B made with Slagle iron).  I think is all vintage tango iron.  Someone is going to be very lucky to own that amp.  Anyway, we spent some time listening to Slagle Iron vs tango at one point.  We didn't have Hashimoto to listen to at the time.  Would have been a fun time to listen to it all.  I must say if you can get away with 1.5W, the 46 is amazing.  Sounds better than a 45 to me.   

[roscoe65]

I live right near oliver.  I have the luxury of hearing a lot of his work before it leaves.  He has a 26->46 from his system he is considering selling.  It sounds glorious.  1.5Ws won't work for me (and I already have a 10Y to a 300B made with Slagle iron).  I think is all vintage tango iron.  Someone is going to be very lucky to own that amp.  Anyway, we spent some time listening to Slagle Iron vs tango at one point.  We didn't have Hashimoto to listen to at the time.  Would have been a fun time to listen to it all.  I must say if you can get away with 1.5W, the 46 is amazing.  Sounds better than a 45 to me.   

I remember talking with Oliver about a similar amp - he was looking for more money than I could justify for a flea power amp.  Justifiable, given the PS challenges of DHT drivers, but not in my budget.

[happyrabbit]

EML 45 Plate in operation 

[sfox7076]

Yes.  Cost is hard.  That said, I find myself (in the past, not now), wishing I had spent more on the amp and less on the tubes.  Properly designed, swithing the tubes is like tuning the amp a bit.  The iron does what you want it to and gives you that awesome tone.  The tubes refine it.  My 300B collaboration with Oliver has some mild changes with different 300Bs and 10s, but nothing as significant as changes in out put iron or the like.  We listened to a 10Y-->300B with Tango iron and with Slagle iron side by side.  Same tubes.  Were there differences?  Absolutely.  Was it big?  Not at all.  Kind of a neat experience. 

[FullRangeMan]

Congratulations Dwight. Whats your speakers?
Whats are your sound impressions?

[sonicboom]

Yes.  Cost is hard.  That said, I find myself (in the past, not now), wishing I had spent more on the amp and less on the tubes.  Properly designed, swithing the tubes is like tuning the amp a bit.  The iron does what you want it to and gives you that awesome tone.  The tubes refine it.  My 300B collaboration with Oliver has some mild changes with different 300Bs and 10s, but nothing as significant as changes in out put iron or the like.  We listened to a 10Y-->300B with Tango iron and with Slagle iron side by side.  Same tubes.  Were there differences?  Absolutely.  Was it big?  Not at all.  Kind of a neat experience.

Can you please elaborate a bit on the differences heard between the Tango and Slagle iron? Were the two OPT's similar in size, load impedance and wattage?

[happyrabbit]

FullRangeDude !

currently using Raven's from Birch Acoustic.  lovely speakers.  Vapor meets Omega.

To me , the 45 is holographic + resolved with a touch of romance 

YMMV

Dwight

[FullRangeMan]

Wow great FR line array speakers, I though they had only the Robin, its site is odd to surf.
How they sound w/only 2W?

[happyrabbit]

6p5 provides enough gain to get the job done but I could always use the 6j5 if more is needed.   The Raven's are 96db which is workable with the 45.  I also broke down and had a custom stand made..having your set amp on da floor is silly

Dwight

[MothAudio]

I also broke down and had a custom stand made..having your set amp on da floor is silly

Dwight

Agree. I cringe whenever I see expensive tubes exposed sitting on the floor like that. Plus I admit, as a visual artist, I enjoy the view too much to have them down low.

[MothAudio]

Can you please elaborate a bit on the differences heard between the Tango and Slagle iron? Were the two OPT's similar in size, load impedance and wattage?

Curious how these stack up to what I'm using... Electra-Print BE5KB 3k OPT

[roscoe65]

Curious how these stack up to what I'm using... Electra-Print BE5KB 3k OPT

That would have to be tested in an identical circuit.  There are transformer shootouts from time to time (the most recent I've seen is a budget transformer shootout over at JELabs between Edcor and Noguchi transformers) but not as frequently as there were about 20 years ago or so, when SET's were mostly DIYor custom.  The problem is that a real shootout of all or most available transformers would require us to have $5,000 of iron available to swap into a circuit.

Given a reputable hand winder and the materials and tech that are accepted to perform well, it becomes a matter of choice.  Your Electraprint iron is of good reputation but does fall into the lower (but not lowest) price range.  One advantage of EP iron is like many US manufacturers you can specify exactly the iron you would like within the confines of their factory capabilities.  The partial silver secondaries seem to be a particular bargain.

20 years ago we could choose from the big Japanese names (Tango, Tamura, etc.), Audio Note, Bartilucci, Magnequest, Lundahl, Electraprint, and some custom options available from Cary (Audio Electronics Supply - probably Edcor), Edcor and a handful of others.  Today, Tango is gone (RIP 2013), AES no longer exists, but we have access to a large Chinese manufacturing sector (for better or worse) and newer players have come on the scene, such as James (Taiwan) and the renewed availability of Hashimoto/Sansui (Japan).  We can pick almost any price point and specification from $50 to $750 for the typical 2A3/300B transformer.

Personally I like Hashimoto, but Shindo uses Lundahl and others like Wavelength use Magnequest.  Decware uses Edcor (I think) and Fi has switched from Magnequest to Hashimoto.

But to speak more directly to your question, this test hints at the relative quality of Electraprint:  http://www.meta-gizmo.org/Tri/vtv-se.html

[FullRangeMan]

You can try Ogonowski from Poland, he also supply trafos for Lampizator amps, very inexpensive OPTs:
http://www.ogonowski.eu/transformers/single-ended/
Or AC member E55l2 from Netherlands an expert w/+20years experience for the best custom made as nanocristaline or M6 0,01mm:
http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?action=profile;u=88078