The OFFICIAL Super-7 thread

0 Members and 2 Guests are viewing this topic. Read 39741 times.

bernardo

  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 55
Re: The OFFICIAL Super-7 thread
« Reply #200 on: 23 Oct 2017, 03:02 pm »
corndog71-
Thanks for the suggestion but I am not a DIYer. I want to try a Class A solid state amplifier such as one of the First Watts before considering a tube amp.

bernardo

  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 55
Re: The OFFICIAL Super-7 thread
« Reply #201 on: 23 Oct 2017, 03:07 pm »
S Clark-
Thanks for the reply. I'm a little hesitant to try another Dodd component based on my experience with the preamp. Also I believe the Dodd amps are tube and in some cases mono-blocks, neither of which I want to try at this point. Nothing against mono-blocks just trying to minimize the number of rack shelves.

Tyson

Re: The OFFICIAL Super-7 thread
« Reply #202 on: 23 Oct 2017, 03:23 pm »
I've heard and/or built most of the First Watt amps.  IMO the Aleph J and the J2 are the nicest sounding amps.  However, the very best amp Nelson ever designed is not on the product page - it's called the Burning Amp 3 (or BA3 for short).  IMO, it gives you the musical enjoyment and tonal beauty of the Aleph and J2, while also keeping the transparency and punch of the F5 amp.  After trying a bunch of them on my Super 7's, the BA3 was the clear winner, IMO. 

Danny Richie

  • Facilitator
  • Posts: 11750
    • http://www.gr-research.com
Re: The OFFICIAL Super-7 thread
« Reply #203 on: 23 Oct 2017, 04:06 pm »
HAL,
I better let Danny answer that one (LS-9 or LS-X?). All I know is that they are terrific speakers.

The Super-7's are also terrific speakers. Are they better than the 9/X? Perhaps, but I don't know how anyone could tell since no one listens to speakers, only audio systems in vastly differing environments. I have made my system sound different (mostly better) by changing: speaker wires (now using Marigo); solder (ditto, Marigo); amplifier output and driver tubes; speaker crossover components; speaker placement (mains and subs); sub PEQ settings; phono cartridge loading, VTA, AZ. And I ain't through yet! Maybe new amps? Clearly there are impedance-matching problems with my Atma OTLs. Would solid state amps be better? Maybe biamping with an electronic crossover? Hmmm? Oh yeah, and what about . . . ?

I've always felt like that amps were holding those back. And wiring all the drivers in series totally shifted the crossover point much higher and the values of the crossover were way off because of the impedance change.

If you go to a new set of amps then be sure to go back and re-wire the drivers into the correct series parallel groupings. You should note a significant improvement.

And I wouldn't even consider an electronic crossover with these.

Danny Richie

  • Facilitator
  • Posts: 11750
    • http://www.gr-research.com
Re: The OFFICIAL Super-7 thread
« Reply #204 on: 23 Oct 2017, 04:11 pm »
Looking for any help other Super-7 owners can give me. First Watt J2s and F6s are appearing for sale in various websites. I have been contemplating trying either of these but have never had the opportunity to hear them. I currently have a Marantz SC11S1 and Dodd tube preamp. For whatever reason the Dodd is not compatible with my Marantz SM11S1 amp (long story) so I have thought about getting something that would be an improvement over the Marantz amp and hopefully allow me to use the Dodd with it.

In the long run I intend to audition the LIO DHT, ARC REF6, and Ayre KX-5 Twenty preamps to replace my current preamp. I had considered a FW F7 at one time but I am concerned with its low impedance spec which indicates it may not work well with tube preamps. I realize I may be putting the cart before the horse here but its due to the cost of the FW amps being much much lower than the preamps I am considering. Also hope that I may be satisfied using the Dodd with the FW amps.

Any advice you guys can offer will be appreciated.

I still own a pair of Super-7's and one of my favorite amps with them are these little chip amps that I built for next to nothing.

http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=124981.msg1317309#msg1317309

And with the high sensitivity of the Super-7's the low powered chip amps go a long way.

Danny Richie

  • Facilitator
  • Posts: 11750
    • http://www.gr-research.com
Re: The OFFICIAL Super-7 thread
« Reply #205 on: 23 Oct 2017, 04:14 pm »
So what about the Super 7 is difficult to duplicate? It uses Neo 10s, Neo 3s, and GR OB subs. Are all the drivers standard available versions? So it would be the waveguide, crossover, and enclosure dimensions that matter. I know Danny can't offer it as a kit, so waveguide dimension and construction would be the most difficult part.

The tweeters were a custom version made just for Serenity Acoustics. But our new GR Neo 3 tweeters are made just like them and would work as drop in replacements. And I have a lot of them in stock now.

If you guys can find someone to replicate the cabinets then I do have everything else that you'd need.

Danny Richie

  • Facilitator
  • Posts: 11750
    • http://www.gr-research.com
Re: The OFFICIAL Super-7 thread
« Reply #206 on: 23 Oct 2017, 04:18 pm »
Is Serenity Acoustics still in business? I thought I read before that the kit issue was because SA owned the design. If they are no longer an entity, what's the harm?

The drivers became un-attainable for nearly two years. All of their designs used those drivers. So they call it good. It is a tough market in those price ranges anyway. And too much of that segment of the market isn't about performance, but status and prestige.

Danny Richie

  • Facilitator
  • Posts: 11750
    • http://www.gr-research.com
Re: The OFFICIAL Super-7 thread
« Reply #207 on: 23 Oct 2017, 04:30 pm »
LOL, kind of a  half breed,  yeah the  SL9's were in ported boxes, not open but he LSX used a different version of the woofers  (IIRC),  I think  Danny had a  small run of them mdade for the  LSX pair   buklt for Mocking bird.  I like the   LS(X     :)

for yo uguys wanting super 7's, don't overlook the NX  line.  Danny has commentd  that he feels they  meet even better the Super 7 in some  regards .  Yeah, the  7's  will be faster in the mids withe Neo 10's but   likely don't have the midrange punch of the  NQ's nor the deep waveguide of the  NX line that allows the Neo 3 to play  down deep.   A draw back is you need separate subs but if you've got the space.....

I'm not  playing down the   S7's  at all, I know they are amazing  ,  just saying   don't  under estimate the NX, talk to Danny about them

jay

Jay's right. The Super-7's, NX-Otica and NX-Treme are all really good but different. Speed advantage in the mid-range goes to the Super-7 but not by a lot. It is a sharper and crisper mid-range than the NX-Otica or NX-Treme. The NX models have a little more body in the mid-range and more of an analog sound compared to the Super-7's.

And the NX models play lower and cross to the subs lower. Not a big deal on the surface as they both produce a flat response real easily. But drums and other instruments in the 100Hz to 200Hz range have a little more nature sound and a little more body, but also a lot of speed.

The waveguide in the NX models is bigger and it allows the tweeter to play a lot lower. So there is some advantage there. And while the off axis response (horizontally and vertically) are great with both, the NX models are a little smoother horizontally.

But for me a real advantage for the NX models is the smaller baffle size and improved imaging and sound stage layering. I am really into that transparent layered sound stage.

Like I said, all are really good, but just different. Personally though I am more in love with listening the NX models. Imaging and vocal ranges do it for me more in those.
« Last Edit: 31 Oct 2017, 06:28 pm by Danny Richie »

WC

Re: The OFFICIAL Super-7 thread
« Reply #208 on: 25 Oct 2017, 04:13 am »
The tweeters were a custom version made just for Serenity Acoustics. But our new GR Neo 3 tweeters are made just like them and would work as drop in replacements. And I have a lot of them in stock now.

If you guys can find someone to replicate the cabinets then I do have everything else that you'd need.

I could replicate the cabinet pretty close from photos. It doesn't look all that difficult. The waveguide would be the most difficult. I guess that changing the dimensions too much would change the sound.

Danny Richie

  • Facilitator
  • Posts: 11750
    • http://www.gr-research.com
Re: The OFFICIAL Super-7 thread
« Reply #209 on: 25 Oct 2017, 04:39 pm »
If you guys really get serious about wanting to build some Super-7's then I do have a prototype baffle that I can send to whoever has the ability to replicate it.

I also can make a deal on a finished pair that I still have in stock.

Captainhemo

Re: The OFFICIAL Super-7 thread
« Reply #210 on: 25 Oct 2017, 05:15 pm »
I've had a few guys asking me about doing the baffles....    if there were  some  interest  we'd  do it but to do one or two pairs  would be costly

jay

WC

Re: The OFFICIAL Super-7 thread
« Reply #211 on: 26 Oct 2017, 04:43 pm »
Maybe down the line a bit. I think I would need to build the speaker in phases. Build the OB subs first and live with them a while. It would give me an opportunity to try out a bunch of different drivers for the mids/highs to see what I like. SWMBO would not like >$3000 outlay in amps and drivers all at once to build the Super-7s.  :D

Tyson

Re: The OFFICIAL Super-7 thread
« Reply #212 on: 29 Nov 2017, 06:54 pm »
Another reason I love my Super 7's.  We're watching Mildred Pierce on the big screen last night.  There's a few scenes toward the end that feature opera singing, specifically coloratura, which is a crazy hard skill only a few sopranos ever master.  Even though it's streamed and compressed audio (via Amazon Prime video), it sounded breathtakingly beautiful. 

That's what I love about the Super 7's, they take a scene like that, which could be harsh and grating because the vocals overload the drivers, and they make it beautiful and highly emotional.

In fact, I'll go further.  I've heard a TON of speakers in my lifetime and the Super 7s are the only ones I've heard that can do operatic singing properly. Every other system, the speakers turn hard or gritty or simply overload when a soprano is going full voice and really leaning into the note.  The Super 7's not only retain their composure, they actually bring out the emotion and beauty. 

Kudos Danny, your speakers are phenomenal and continue to impress me even with ridonculously difficult material. 

Danny Richie

  • Facilitator
  • Posts: 11750
    • http://www.gr-research.com
Re: The OFFICIAL Super-7 thread
« Reply #213 on: 29 Nov 2017, 07:05 pm »
I'm glad to know you are enjoying them.  :thumb:

Tyson

Re: The OFFICIAL Super-7 thread
« Reply #214 on: 29 Nov 2017, 07:28 pm »
I'm glad to know you are enjoying them.  :thumb:

Indeed I am.  I think the 'magic' is really a result of the mids and tweeter being made of the same material, having the same shape, and being physically aligned on the baffle.  With something like opera voice or even solo violin, this makes a HUGE difference and puts the Super 7 in a different league than cone/dome speakers, or any other speaker that doesn't have that level absolute seamlessness between mids/highs. 

Danny Richie

  • Facilitator
  • Posts: 11750
    • http://www.gr-research.com
Re: The OFFICIAL Super-7 thread
« Reply #215 on: 29 Nov 2017, 07:42 pm »
Indeed I am.  I think the 'magic' is really a result of the mids and tweeter being made of the same material, having the same shape, and being physically aligned on the baffle.  With something like opera voice or even solo violin, this makes a HUGE difference and puts the Super 7 in a different league than cone/dome speakers, or any other speaker that doesn't have that level absolute seamlessness between mids/highs.

The problem then is that it tends to ruin you and nothing else is the same. So I may have contributed to making audio shows more disappointing than fun. But that is what happens when you reach this level.

orientalexpress

Re: The OFFICIAL Super-7 thread
« Reply #216 on: 29 Nov 2017, 07:52 pm »
I went to see 4 Opera this year including the last one ,the Girls of the Golden West .Nothing like a live orchestra and Opera.Here I am ?now i’m really want to hear the super 7 ,come on Jay ,make it happen.

Thanks

Lap

HAL

  • Industry Participant
  • Posts: 3825
Re: The OFFICIAL Super-7 thread
« Reply #217 on: 29 Nov 2017, 08:03 pm »
These drivers have redefined SOTA to me.  Hope Jay can make it happen for folks.

Danny Richie

  • Facilitator
  • Posts: 11750
    • http://www.gr-research.com
Re: The OFFICIAL Super-7 thread
« Reply #218 on: 29 Nov 2017, 08:14 pm »
I went to see 4 Opera this year including the last one ,the Girls of the Golden West .Nothing like a live orchestra and Opera.Here I am ?now i’m really want to hear the super 7 ,come on Jay ,make it happen.

Thanks

Lap

I still have a pair that I could let go of.


SoCalWJS

Re: The OFFICIAL Super-7 thread
« Reply #219 on: 29 Nov 2017, 08:42 pm »
I still have a pair that I could let go of.


Sigh......

They sure sounded incredible at RMAF. Combined the strengths of the Super V (Openess, Wide soundstage, Easy sense of power, OB Bass, etc etc etc) along with the airy detail of the LS6/9, and then a pure midrange on top of that.

Fantastic Speakers. Everything I heard played on them was top notch.

Still haven't hit the Lottery, but someday....  :green: