[Osadu]

James Tanner,
How about a CD transport and high resolution PCM, DSD and DXD inputs via USB all in one box (call it BDP-X). And a DAC to process red book CD, high resolution PCM, SACD, DSD and DXD all in one box (call it BDA-X).  That way, you have all digital bases covered.

[RDavidson]

While I'm not sure that I agree with PS Audio's approach to DSD everything with their Direct Stream, what I think is really genius is the upgradability of the unit via downloadable software. I think people would pay to upgrade via software versus hardware upgrades every so often.

[Grit]

The BDP does have upgradable software, and Bryston has improved the interface and added features several times. I'm quite happy that the quality of the playback though isn't changing.

I think the reason quality changes for the PS Audio unit is that they are converting the data from one format to another. They are probably optimizing that process, which is where they "upgrades" are probably from.

[R. Daneel]

Most of all, I'd like to see scrolling text and elapsed time on the BDP display. As a concept, the BDP is really excellent. As a product, it has it's quirks but none of them are related to audio quality so that's good too.

Cheers!
Antun

[RDavidson]

Right. Exactly.
The proprietary hardware and software are designed in-house by PS Audio and thus are optimized together.....in the same way Apple products are designed. Except for the most esoteric brands / designs, PS Audio is the only company I know of that isn't using an off-the-shelf DAC chip or is using a reconfigured DAC chip.

I guess what I'm wondering is if there's a way to take an off-the-shelf DAC chip (to keep costs lower), but still implement software upgrades in a similar fashion as PS Audio, which can evolve. To some extent, all DACs are limited to their hardware capabilities, but PS Audio has taken control of this aspect. How long they choose to support the Direct Stream via free software is completely up to them. I have no idea what they expect the lifespan of the product to be, but wouldn't it be cool to have a DAC that can last for years and be up-to-date with current tech (in terms of audible performance) for the next 5-10 years, versus being on this constant flavor-o-the-month DAC swap? Maybe the software isn't always free (depending on how big of a performance leap is). It'd be a leap from software version A to version B, maybe not version A.1 to A.2 ; The same way computer operating systems are updated. This way Bryston can continue to develop software and recoup those development costs along the way.

Of course, people will always swap gear. But, I think there are many out there who wouldn't swap so much if the gear we buy (DACs particularly) could be designed to last and be used longer even in light of new DACS coming to market. Imagine if Bryston designed something like the Direct Stream, but the user had the choice of decoding method (PCM or DSD or whatever the future might hold) at the press of a button. That'd be slick.

Not to mention, this whole idea plays into the fact that Bryston makes gear to last (per their 20 year warranty).

[R. Daneel]

Except for the most esoteric brands / designs, PS Audio is the only company I know of that isn't using an off-the-shelf DAC chip or is using a reconfigured DAC chip.

What PS audio is doing has been in the postulates Sony set for DSD standard years ago. The recent Sony HAP-Z1ES player is using a similar configuration with no commercial DACs inside. It is close to Meitner MA-1 DAC in that respect, and so is PS. Meitner costs the same as PS in fact. These are all FPGA-based and there are others as well. Chord is one of them as well.

Cheers!
Antun

[RDavidson]

Yes, I thought Chord had proprietary tech. I was lumping them into my "esoteric brands" statement. Do Chord and Meitner have upgradeable software, like PS Audio? My guess is that they don't.

This is what makes PS Audio's approach unique. What is a DAC? A computer, right?
It makes complete sense to me that PS Audio has "Apple-ized" DAC development and moved into this territory of system development (hardware AND software) that hasn't been fully realized before, that I'm aware of.

Sure, electronics have firmware updates. That's normal. But firmware updates are still tied to the original operating system. What PS Audio has done is make the operating system (which can greatly affect performance) upgradeable. So, as long as the hardware architecture is powerful and robust (as I think even off-the-shelf chips for audio purposes are), it seems to me that PS Audio's approach can be duplicated (but not centered around DSD protocols).

That's the "bigger picture" idea I'm trying to get at.

[Phil A]

Do Chord and Meitner have upgradeable software, like PS Audio? My guess is that they don't.

I can answer for the Meitner - it does have firmware updates.  Had one for DSD back in 2012 and I recently did a firmware update for their new MDAT2 engine (the latest is not on their website but there is a thread at the Computer Audiophile -http://www.computeraudiophile.com/f6-dac-digital-analog-conversion/meitner-emm-labs-firmware-upgrade-7-2014-%3D-sonic-bliss-21200/index5.html) .

If I had a wish list, it might be for the BDP-1USB to do more than 30,000 files.  Not sure why that is limited.  I don't see limitations in the published specs via USB for the BDP-2 and of course I'd love to see JRiver for Linux as an option.

I am not sure how many DACs going forward will allow DSD via something other than USB but it would be nice to have players that do it much like the Sonore Signature Rendu.

[Norton]

I am not sure how many DACs going forward will allow DSD via something other than USB but it would be nice to have players that do it much like the Sonore Signature Rendu.

The Chord Hugo, Qute etc all accept DSD over SPDif (DoP).

Somewhat surprisingly, my BDP2 also outputs DSD over SPDif, but only when used as a renderer.  No idea why this is.

[Phil A]

The Chord Hugo, Qute etc all accept DSD over SPDif (DoP).

Somewhat surprisingly, my BDP2 also outputs DSD over SPDif, but only when used as a renderer.  No idea why this is.

That's good to hear.

[Norton]

James Tanner,
How about a CD transport and high resolution PCM, DSD and DXD inputs via USB all in one box (call it BDP-X). And a DAC to process red book CD, high resolution PCM, SACD, DSD and DXD all in one box (call it BDA-X).  That way, you have all digital bases covered.

Not sure I understand, apart from the fact that the CD drive is external, isn't this a description of the current BDP and upcoming BDA3?.  I can confirm that the BDP2 plays 24/192, DSD 64 & 128 and DXD via USB and CD via an external drive.  I think the BDA3 will also cover all the above formats.

[R. Daneel]

Yes, I thought Chord had proprietary tech. I was lumping them into my "esoteric brands" statement. Do Chord and Meitner have upgradeable software, like PS Audio? My guess is that they don't.

FPGA acronym stands for field-programmable gate array. FPGA is therefore programmable "in-the-field" which is another term for not having to return the product to factory for a software upgrade. Instead, user can do it at home by following instructions.

FPGAs have been around for years. Industrial installations, the robots and fine automated machinery are all driven by FPGAs. This is how engineers can visit the factory, install the system within two days and then spend a month educating the workers on the new functions of the equipment. If it was buried within Wondows for example, reprogramming would take months.

PS audio is as expandable as it's hardware will allow it. Since the release of first PerfectWave DAC, it has seen two major upgrades, including the new DirectStream. Each upgrade was a hardware and software based but only recently they moved to FPGA. Each time it was costly I might add.

DirectStream costs as much as a Meitner MA-1 and more than the Chord QBD-76HD so I don't think I follow you. Esoteric might be something affordable and it usually is. The difference is that it might not be available in some parts of the world for different reasons which is what makes is esoteric. It has nothing to do with the cost.

Still, I like PS audio and Paul's charm when he introduces new products.

Cheers!
Antun

[vklyushnikov]

If I had a wish list, it might be for the BDP-1USB to do more than 30,000 files.  Not sure why that is limited.  I don't see limitations in the published specs via USB for the BDP-2 and of course I'd love to see JRiver for Linux as an option.

+1 for JRiver option. I'm not sure that Bryston will ever implement integration with it, but IMO this is a way to win. I know lot of people that like BDP sound and build quality but dislike software quality. I'm tired of struggling with BDP album database too. Plus JRiver has some very important features for me - DSD to PCM playback, elumination of dropouts between sample rate changes and reliable IOS remote control app.

[Phil A]

+1 for JRiver option. I'm not sure that Bryston will ever implement integration with it, but IMO this is a way to win. I know lot of people that like BDP sound and build quality but dislike software quality. I'm tired of struggling with BDP album database too. Plus JRiver has some very important features for me - DSD to PCM playback, elumination of dropouts between sample rate changes and reliable IOS remote control app.

I agree, they probably will keep the software proprietary and deal with issues in house (but someone can wish) vs. a third party software (I have JRiver on my PC and two music servers).  I absolute love the remote control App.  I actually was considering a BDP-2 for the main system but called an industry insider who is a good friend (and about as much as an admirer of Bryston products as one can have - he owns a BDP-1 and a Bryston DAC and amp and preamp too) and I knew I could get an honest answer to my concerns.  He expressed the same concerns of the album database and Apps.  He asked me about JRiver (which was a shock to me and he us up on computer audio as much as anyone is anywhere and he also complained about the software and Apps which also was a huge shock to me).  I sent him the special they were doing on the JRiver master license and last I spoke to him he was probably going to get it (have not followed up since but will at some point).  So I ended up buying another music server similar to what I had for the main system for a secondary system (and I could always rotate things to another back-up system down the road if things change).