Veneer Question/ NX Ottica MTM-H Frame Servo Bass Build

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BK_856er

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Re: Veneer Question
« Reply #20 on: 29 Oct 2016, 02:08 am »
I don't recall what I settled on for actual iron temp, but Joe's own FAQ states ~193F, so it might have been that.  I might not have bothered, but I had a thermocouple meter handy so it was convenient and quick - one less thing to worry about.

Good luck!

BK

Captainhemo

Re: Veneer Question
« Reply #21 on: 29 Oct 2016, 03:43 pm »
Thanks BK, I asked Joe @ Joe Woodworker about iron temp, he indicated that he had not tested for an ideal temp and most irons don't indicate temp.  He did say that the cotton settings is where most land.
Thanks AC, me too!

Best,
Ed
Here's a little table I found online. While it's  related to titebond products, you should be able to cross ref  the type of adhesive you are using I've also been reading than when using raw vener , it can be a good idea to  apply a coat of shellac to te  the backside of the veneer and letting it completely dry before applying  the adhesive, this can help prevent the possibility of bleed through



Looks like your cabinets are coming along nicely Ed :beer:

jay

ebag4

Re: Veneer Question
« Reply #22 on: 2 Nov 2016, 10:00 pm »
Here's a little table I found online. While it's  related to titebond products, you should be able to cross ref  the type of adhesive you are using I've also been reading than when using raw vener , it can be a good idea to  apply a coat of shellac to te  the backside of the veneer and letting it completely dry before applying  the adhesive, this can help prevent the possibility of bleed through



Looks like your cabinets are coming along nicely Ed :beer:

jay
Thanks for that Jay.  With regard to the shellac, are you recommending putting it on the side getting the adhesive?  If so, I wonder how this would impact the adhesive effect of the glue to the veneer?  Of course I could only apply it to the locations with the occlusions, there aren't too many so I am not too concerned about them.

Making a little more progress.  Need to do a little more sanding and will be ready for painting and veneer, I hope to start with the veneer on the bottoms of the bass units tomorrow, let them sit and see if I have any issue with splitting.  Here are a couple of pics for your amusement:





Best,
Ed

cody69

Re: Veneer Question
« Reply #23 on: 2 Nov 2016, 11:24 pm »
I've not followed this closely enough... I like the way you've designed the upper and lower cabinets with keyed slots to fit together.
Quite ingenious  :thumb:

Am sure this setup is going to play amazing... can't wait for your feedback on how they play.

mlundy57

Re: Veneer Question
« Reply #24 on: 2 Nov 2016, 11:54 pm »
The edge guides on top look nice but the will not allow the monitors to be toed in without also toeing in the subs. If I remember correctly, back when the Wedgies came out there was discussion about toeing in the monitors but that the H-Frames needed to remain pointed straight ahead.  :scratch:

Mike

DeeJayBump

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Re: Veneer Question
« Reply #25 on: 2 Nov 2016, 11:57 pm »
... I like the way you've designed the upper and lower cabinets with keyed slots to fit together.
Quite ingenious  :thumb:

+1

That's (to borrow lovingly from Stuart Scott) cooler than the other side of the pillow. They look great.

Nice job, Ed.

RE: toe-in as mention by Mike above, maybe the top of the H-frames where the MTMs are slotted in could incorporate some rotate-ability--as long as structural integrity/solidity is maintained-- like a lazy Susan type effect to address any potential difference in toe-in between them?

ebag4

Re: Veneer Question
« Reply #26 on: 3 Nov 2016, 12:12 am »
Thanks guys, I like the transition better with the angle.

Mike, I have my H frames toed in currently even though my Wedgies are sitting on separate stands, so no concerns for me.  Of course the V series and the Serenity 7 don't have that adjustment either.

The angled platform the Ottica MTM is sitting on/in is not part of the bass unit, it will sit on top of the sub buffered by Herbies Tenderfeet.  I did it this way in case I wanted to use the subs with a full Ottica or another future speaker.

Best,
Ed

mlundy57

Re: Veneer Question
« Reply #27 on: 3 Nov 2016, 12:34 am »
Ed,

OK good to know. They can look a little funny with the monitors twisted.

What type of edge profile do you have on the edges, it looks like a big chamfer or a bevel cut on the table saw. Actually it looks more like a bevel cut.

Mike

ebag4

Re: Veneer Question
« Reply #28 on: 3 Nov 2016, 12:55 am »
That's a bevel cut, I used a jig to hold the board up at an angle on the table saw to get the 10 degree.  I actually ended up doing it twice, i took the angle too close to the edge on the first set.

Best,
Ed

glynnw

Re: Veneer Question/ NX Ottica MTM-H Frame Servo Bass Build
« Reply #29 on: 3 Nov 2016, 05:26 am »
My subs are aimed at listening seat - I find no problem with this.

ACHiPo

Re: Veneer Question
« Reply #30 on: 3 Nov 2016, 03:21 pm »
Thanks for that Jay.  With regard to the shellac, are you recommending putting it on the side getting the adhesive?  If so, I wonder how this would impact the adhesive effect of the glue to the veneer?  Of course I could only apply it to the locations with the occlusions, there aren't too many so I am not too concerned about them.
I'm not Jay, but I did talk to Joe about fillers when I was doing my build.  I was concerned about imperfections in the substrate telegraphing through the veneer, so I asked Joe about suitable fillers.  I was thinking Bondo, but Joe recommended against it saying that it's important that the moisture from the glue and veneer softener be able to diffuse into the substrate.  Given that I'd recommend against shellac on the substrate.  I ended up using sawdust and PVA glue to fill the divots.  Seemed to work well.

Nice looking cabinets!

Plund

Re: Veneer Question/ NX Ottica MTM-H Frame Servo Bass Build
« Reply #31 on: 4 Nov 2016, 12:36 am »
Ed,  I like your choice of adding that bevel...very nice lines! 

Captainhemo

Re: Veneer Question
« Reply #32 on: 4 Nov 2016, 03:21 pm »
I'm not Jay, but I did talk to Joe about fillers when I was doing my build.  I was concerned about imperfections in the substrate telegraphing through the veneer, so I asked Joe about suitable fillers.  I was thinking Bondo, but Joe recommended against it saying that it's important that the moisture from the glue and veneer softener be able to diffuse into the substrate.  Given that I'd recommend against shellac on the substrate.  I ended up using sawdust and PVA glue to fill the divots.  Seemed to work well.

Nice looking cabinets!

Hey guys,  sorry I missed that  reply / question  of Ed's
I've seen posted in a couple different wood cworking forums where guys recommended  the shellac on the back side of raw wood venner (not the substaright) to prevent bleed through of adhesive or possible  later with regards to finish   interacting with   the adhesive.
Just thought it was worth mentioneing as i have seen it come up a few times in fdifferent discussions.

Once again Ed, the   cabinets are really looking good  :beer:

jay

ebag4

Re: Veneer Question/ NX Ottica MTM-H Frame Servo Bass Build
« Reply #33 on: 5 Nov 2016, 12:53 am »
Thanks Pete, AC, much appreciated.

Thanks for the clarification Jay,I appreciate it.

Haven't started veneering yet, I was sidetracked by one of those great ideas that turns out to be more trouble than it's worth  :lol:.  I wish I would have thought of it one step earlier, before I glued the the top piece of the MTM base, it would have made things easier. 

I was thinking about what I was going to do with the crossover, I decided I liked the clean look of the MTM and thought I would hide the crossover in the MTM base.  Because the base is already built I had to do this freehand, not perfect but will get the job done.  Here is a pic for your amusement:




I realize all my inductors are in the same plane, but I didn't have enough height to vertically mount them, so I chose distance.  They are all at least 7" from each other and this actually puts the inductors further apart than if I had added a crossover board in the back of the MTM.

The inner part of the base will be painted black and the components will be hot glued in.

Best,
Ed

mlundy57

Re: Veneer Question/ NX Ottica MTM-H Frame Servo Bass Build
« Reply #34 on: 5 Nov 2016, 03:26 am »
That's an interesting way to do it.

Mike

cody69

Re: Veneer Question/ NX Ottica MTM-H Frame Servo Bass Build
« Reply #35 on: 5 Nov 2016, 09:46 am »
Quote
That's an interesting way to do it.

Most certainly is. That's what I love about this forum, sharing lots of different ideas and approaches.
I would have never thought about routing space for the network in the base.

jimbones

Re: Veneer Question/ NX Ottica MTM-H Frame Servo Bass Build
« Reply #36 on: 5 Nov 2016, 07:06 pm »
I like it I think thats plenty of separation.

Danny Richie

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Re: Veneer Question/ NX Ottica MTM-H Frame Servo Bass Build
« Reply #37 on: 8 Nov 2016, 05:28 pm »
That looks real good Ed, and that is plenty of separation.

Folsom

Re: Veneer Question/ NX Ottica MTM-H Frame Servo Bass Build
« Reply #38 on: 8 Nov 2016, 06:53 pm »
I really like how the MTM fits into the subwoofer. Inspired by Thrax?

ebag4

Re: Veneer Question/ NX Ottica MTM-H Frame Servo Bass Build
« Reply #39 on: 9 Nov 2016, 12:56 am »
Thanks guys, much appreciated.  Jeremy, I am not familiar Thrax, it is really the result of trying to minimize the immediacy of the transition between the bass and MTM sections, the goal was for it to appear as a speaker as opposed to two separate speaker modules.  I tried a similar approach with my wedgie/wedge shaped bass unit.

Below is a pic of the pair, ready for veneer.  I added the neutric mounting block and now am ready to veneer all sections, I likely won't start until this weekend.

For your viewing pleasure  :lol::




Best,
Ed