AudioCircle

Industry Circles => NuPrime Audio => Topic started by: rustydoglim on 3 Nov 2016, 10:50 am

Title: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: rustydoglim on 3 Nov 2016, 10:50 am
When we embarked on developing our next generation standalone music playing platform, we want something revolutionary. The standard approach by all other vendors have been to take a motherboard (embeded Windows, Linux, Android), change the DAC and headphone amp, improve the power supply. The most advance portable players from Sony, A&K etc are all taking this approach.
For high end system, we have computer (PC, Mac, Windows) sending out USB audio to external DAC+headphone amp. Music comes from local HD, network DLNA and online streaming and all goes through different route to reach the DAC.

So what can we do to fundamentally improve the entire system? How can we do something that leapfrog the competition?
As we progress through the development cycle of Omnia in the past 18 months, we got more ambitious and we kept raising the bar.
Here we are, almost ready for the release of Omnia.  And it is time to disclose a few very cool features.

(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=152973)
(rendered image)

(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=152974)
(photo taking from prototype board)

Motherboard and Omnia Audio Processor Unit (OAP Unit)
It is an open Android OS so it is possible to install other Apps (streaming app, office software, etc). The main board is customized for playing music so graphics intensive games are not recommended. Watching 1080P video is ok.
The most innovative feature that sets it apart from any music playing computing platform is the isolation of audio processing from degradations due to high CPU utilization or signal drop-off resulting from wireless congestion. The OAP Unit does the following:
The implication of this design is that we have to implement the low level audio API and the Omnia app. So this is a complete redesign work from motherboard to firmware to operating system layer API.  But in order to ensure that other Apps work and Android OS can be upgraded, only the NuPrime implemented Omnia app is able to take advantage of the custom hardware. For example, if you use some other music player, the OAP Unit will be bypassed.


DAC & headphone amp board
This is now a customer replaceable module  :thumb:
Omnia will be shipped (in January 2017) with ES9018K2M by default, but if you prefer the slightly warmer AK4490EQ, it is also available. You can also buy both modules just for fun. 

(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=152977)
Omnia P1 is capable of replacing a high-end desktop DAC and headphone amp owing to separate professional true-balanced 3-pin XLR left and right outputs through a NuPrime-designed OPA chip with high output current for ample desktop power.
It is THE ONLY portable product that I know of with two separate 3-pin XLR outputs.  Other portable products that support XLR output has a single 4-pin output. 400mW x 2 of custom OPA chips!

(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=152976)
Ultra-low-noise power supply with super capacitor (470,000µF) for fine detail and deep bass.

Other features:
USB-C port for high speed external drive • Internal SD card • Internal battery for 7.5 hours listening • HDMI GDI & Optical output • Multi-zone streaming • Stereo streaming at 32-bit/384kHz or DSD256 between two Omnia P1 • AllPlay, AirPlay and DLNA based standard • 5” touch screen (IPS 1280x720)

There is a companion Omnia H1 dock that has HDMI, Optical output, Stereo RCA outputs, RJ45, 3 x USB-C port.
Just to be clear, this is not a portable DAC replacement and it is not meant to be connected as a DAC to the computer (what's the point, after all the work to redesign the motherboard). You use it as a stand alone music server (therefore 3 x USB-C port), music player, streamer, receiver.

Omnia P1 (send) ----- stream ----> Omnia P1 / WR-100 or SONOS (via AirPlay)
Omnia P1 (as DLNA) --- stream ---> Omnia P1 / WR-100, or any other streamer and receiver
Omnia P1 also appears as network (SAMBA interface) hard drive so you can drag and drop music files onto it from your computer
Omnia P1 --> Optical output --> high-end DAC to music system. This is only required if you have many other digital sources. Otherwise just connect Omnia to power amp.

Omnia iOS app is planned to mid 2017. The use of iOS app is not necessary at this point even if you have an all Mac/iOS system. Omnia P1 is a standalone system, and you can stream to it via AirPlay, or share the music library with your Mac (remember that Omnia can appear as a network drive).  iOS or Android app can be used to control other future "screen-less" Omnia devices.

Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: rustydoglim on 3 Nov 2016, 10:58 am
Shipping mid January 2017, samples available for review mid December 2016.
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: zwizardofoz on 3 Nov 2016, 01:29 pm
Support for Roon maybe?
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: rustydoglim on 3 Nov 2016, 01:58 pm
Roon provides META DATA for the music and it runs on Mac or PC, with Android client.

Omnia is an open platform so naturally it supports ROON. You can download your roon client on Omnia to control your roon server.
If someday Roon releases an Android server, then you can install it on Omnia
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: zwizardofoz on 3 Nov 2016, 02:53 pm
I meant as a Roon certified endpoint not a control or server
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: Armaegis on 3 Nov 2016, 03:38 pm
I'm assuming you have a special cable/dongle to output 3-pin XLR?
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: SFDude on 3 Nov 2016, 03:59 pm
I'm assuming you have a special cable/dongle to output 3-pin XLR?

Waiting to see more pics of this connector. The actual unit renderings look pretty thin to accommodate.

But this sounds like it might be the first portable music player I may drop $$ on, as long as it's not in the price range of A&K's higher end stuff, which I sort of find to be ridiculously astronomical for portables pricing.
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: rustydoglim on 3 Nov 2016, 04:07 pm
I'm assuming you have a special cable/dongle to output 3-pin XLR?

Yes, there is a dual 3.5mm to dual XLR cable as accessory that comes with the product.
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: rustydoglim on 3 Nov 2016, 04:13 pm
Waiting to see more pics of this connector. The actual unit renderings look pretty thin to accommodate.

But this sounds like it might be the first portable music player I may drop $$ on, as long as it's not in the price range of A&K's higher end stuff, which I sort of find to be ridiculously astronomical for portables pricing.

Still working on cost, but should be around $1250 MSRP.  Because of the fully integrated design, it can outperforms a component system. We have done our own comparison.
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: mervinpearce on 4 Nov 2016, 01:11 am
Where can I pre-order? :thumb:
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: ameger on 4 Nov 2016, 06:36 pm
Cool - I want to pre-order too!
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: rustydoglim on 4 Nov 2016, 11:38 pm
Thanks but pre-order is not necessary. When we ship in January there will be enough stocks to go around.
Obviously we have listened to it already and it is incredible.  The long delay is due to the software and mechanical fit and finishing.
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: Eisener Bart on 5 Nov 2016, 12:37 am
Shipping mid January 2017, samples available for review mid December 2016.

Cool!
I'd like to write a review.
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: Tubegem on 9 Nov 2016, 11:17 pm
Still working on cost, but should be around $1250 MSRP.  Because of the fully integrated design, it can outperforms a component system. We have done our own comparison.
Could you please clarify. Are the P1 & H1 two separate products or one? The estimated $1250 is for which part?
The P1 has no internal disc, but will support an external disc.
Assuming the H1 can be purchased separatly, it can be connected to a DAC-9
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: rustydoglim on 10 Nov 2016, 09:34 pm
Could you please clarify. Are the P1 & H1 two separate products or one? The estimated $1250 is for which part?
The P1 has no internal disc, but will support an external disc.
Assuming the H1 can be purchased separatly, it can be connected to a DAC-9

P1 is the device. H1 is the docking hub.  $1250 is the price for P1. We have not determine the H1 price, but should be very affordable.
P1 has internal SD card slot.
You connect to external disk through the USB-C port on P1, or two ports on H1.
P1 or H1 has optical outputs that can be connected to DAC-9.

I think you will get better performance connecting H1's RCA output to DAC-1 analog in.
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: mr_bill on 11 Nov 2016, 09:01 pm
Jason,

Can this be used as portable player and stream Tidal and Pandora, etc through wifi?

Can this take the place of a Streamer/Dac 10 into my integrated amp?  Is it at a high enough performance level?
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: rustydoglim on 11 Nov 2016, 09:38 pm
Jason,

Can this be used as portable player and stream Tidal and Pandora, etc through wifi?

Can this take the place of a Streamer/Dac 10 into my integrated amp?  Is it at a high enough performance level?

Yes to all three questions.
The performance should be off-the-chart.
But as we published in an article of what makes a high end DAC (like DAC-10 etc), there are a lot of other things than digital to analog conversion, especially the preamp.  But if all you need is source (regardless of where it comes from) to DAC to analog out to amp, Omnia has the advantage (as described in the design description).

When you are playing Tidal or Pandora on Omnia, you can take advantage of the DAC and headphone amp, but not the audio processing unit, which does the one-of-a-kind buffering of music data right before the DAC.  It is pretty complicated to do this.

Best performance:
Omnia app playing music from DLNA or internal SD card through OAP Unit (which does the buffering and some other good stuff) -> DAC -> analog out

Other app (Pandora, Tidal, etc) playing music will go through DAC -> analog out. 
The alternative is to connect an external DAC to your PC or smartphone where there are more noise and interference.

Omnia is not a full featured DAC replacement where you must have multiple inputs and outputs.  On the other hand, for a single device performance, we think you will find that it is superior than anything else on the market today, due to the unique design.

There are many good engineers and they can all design good DACs, power supplies and preamps. So Omnia has to come up with "new tricks" to out perform. There is no voodoo magic, or special material.  It is just a lot of hard engineering work on software and hardware.
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: Cliff B. on 14 Nov 2016, 03:02 pm
When you are playing Tidal or Pandora on Omnia, you can take advantage of the DAC and headphone amp, but not the audio processing unit, which does the one-of-a-kind buffering of music data right before the DAC.  It is pretty complicated to do this.

Best performance:
Omnia app playing music from DLNA or internal SD card through OAP Unit (which does the buffering and some other good stuff) -> DAC -> analog out

Other app (Pandora, Tidal, etc) playing music will go through DAC -> analog out. 
The alternative is to connect an external DAC to your PC or smartphone where there are more noise and interference.
Would you explain how we would control and play music with DLNA? For example, could I have Jriver on a pc on the same network as Omnia, control Jriver with some other android or apple device and have  the music go through the OAP? Could we not also stream Tidal in the same way and have it take advantage of OAP?
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: rustydoglim on 14 Nov 2016, 10:57 pm
Omnia by itself is a standalone Android computer customized to play music.

If you use PC to download or manage music, you could simply manage your music on the network drive of Omnia. And then just play the music on Omnia instead of going through JRiver as DLNA server.  Omnia itself is also a DLNA server.
Ok, but go back to your setup - in this case you can just use the App running on Omnia to get the music from JRiver DLNA server (remember that Omna has a 5" screen). Or you can run the Omnia app on your smartphone or tablet (we plan to run it on PC, Mac, iOS and Android).

Lets compare these cases:

PC ---USB cable---> DAC-10H ---> Amp       (noise from PC, CPU has to be dedicated to playing music, noise from cable)
DLNA ---WiFi ---> [streaming DAC] ----> Amp           (WiFi congestion, noise, jitter)
Once you start playing music, it happens in real time

In the case of Omnia using Omnia App
DLNA --WiFi---> OAP Buffer ---> Omnia DAC ---> Amp
Local hard disk ---> OAP Buffer ---> Omnia DAC ---> Amp

In the case of Tidal/Spotify/Qobuz/etc running on Omnia
Online music --WiFi--> Omnia DAC ---> Amp
In the future release, if we integrate the online music API into Omnia, then
Online music --WiFi--> OAP Buffer ---> Omnia DAC ---> Amp

The reason is that Omnia device has custom hardware that needs custom audio device driver.  But since all other apps such as Tidal are written to use the operating system's audio device driver, they can not take advantage of the audio processor. But they can still get very good sound from the Omnia DAC and other hardware such as the powerful onboard 400mW x 2 balanced headphone outputs.
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: rustydoglim on 14 Nov 2016, 11:11 pm
Other than performance, we want Omnia to simply your system.
Keep in mind that Omnia has USB-C port to connect to very fast hard drive. And since Omnia has SAMBA protocol, it will appear as a network drive.  So if you are using PC or Mac to manage your music, you simply store the music library on the Omnia drive directly. In that case, you can store some frequently listened music on the Omnia internal SD card drive, and the rest on the bigger external driver.
You take Omnia with you and you have a high end system in your pocket. When you go home you dock it with the Omnia H1 hub.
And you can still use your high-end DAC to connect to the H1 Hub.

This setup will also work if you still want to keep PC and Omnia separate:
PC -------> USB input of DAC-10H
Omnia --->optical input of DAC-10H

Or you can dump your PC and just use Omnia. Every popular music service runs on Android.
So if you think about what Omnia has become:  Computer, DAC, headphone amp, portable player, DLNA server, streamer
It is really cheap.
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: vkohl on 26 Nov 2016, 08:21 am
All this "digital mumbo-jumbo" has my head spinning ! :scratch: ...i just bought a Nuprime IDA-8 [with bluetooth dongle]...what more do i need to do to stream music from my phone/computer/sirius radio ??? HELP !!!
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: John Casler on 26 Nov 2016, 06:17 pm
All this "digital mumbo-jumbo" has my head spinning ! :scratch: ...i just bought a Nuprime IDA-8 [with bluetooth dongle]...what more do i need to do to stream music from my phone/computer/sirius radio ??? HELP !!!

With the "bluetooth", dongle you can listen to ANYTHING you can stream from your bluetooth enabled smart phone, tablet, or computer.

If you want better quality/resolution, you should look at the WR-100.

But for just bluetooth streaming, the dongle works fine.
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: vkohl on 26 Nov 2016, 11:27 pm
With the "bluetooth", dongle you can listen to ANYTHING you can stream from your bluetooth enabled smart phone, tablet, or computer.

If you want better quality/resolution, you should look at the WR-100.

But for just bluetooth streaming, the dongle works fine.
The WR-100 would be a necessary add-on to the IDA-8 ?
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: rustydoglim on 28 Nov 2016, 10:48 am
WR-100 provides WiFi receiver feature to IDA-8 or other components.
Starting from IDA-8, we started to provide a special SPDIF port, that looks like USB. It has SPDIF signals, power and gnd pins.
For a single port is used to power WR-100 as well as receiving its SPDIF output. Standard microUSB cable that comes with WR-100 is used to connect to IDA-8 directly, just one cable for power and data.

Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: bmichels on 1 Dec 2016, 05:35 pm
Congratulation for bringing such innovative technologies to the DAP market.  I have 2 questions :


- Internal storage:  full size SD   :)   or...  MicroSD   :nono:   ?    And what is the on-board installed storage capacity ?

- What is HDMI out for ???   wouldn't USB-Digital out have been more useful ?
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: rustydoglim on 2 Dec 2016, 07:51 pm
MicroSD. If you are concerned about performance, as explained in the architecture design, it doesn't matter because the audio processing unit has a buffer before the DAC.  Onboard installed capacity is a lowly 16G.  We expect user to install microSD card, and the capacity has been growing every year.

The HDMI is for display, just in case you want to watch video (720p) or control it from another tablet or phone while it is docked.
Remember that there are Omnia Renderer, Omnia Media Server, and Omnia Player running on this device.
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: bmichels on 6 Dec 2016, 09:14 pm
MicroSD. If you are concerned about performance, as explained in the architecture design, it doesn't matter because the audio processing unit has a buffer before the DAC.  Onboard installed capacity is a lowly 16G.  We expect user to install microSD card, and the capacity has been growing every year.

The HDMI is for display, just in case you want to watch video (720p) or control it from another tablet or phone while it is docked.
Remember that there are Omnia Renderer, Omnia Media Server, and Omnia Player running on this device.

No, I was wondering about storage.  With only 16 Gb + max 256 Gb with the microSD, this is really NOT ENOUGH for any serious music library !

It is very inconvenient to have to select which part of our library to take with us each time we go mobile. And I suppose that an external USB-C HD will draw a lot of the Omnia's battery and in addition this will add bulk and a fragile USB-C Cable hangling loos from the device.

So may I suggest that a "high end" version of Omnia is proposed with an internal 512 Gb storage for those ready to pay for this extra ? Or that an optional "storage" module that "click" under the DAP (without any loose cable and with an internal battery) is offered in various capacities (up to 1 To)

 This DAP incorporate many very exciting features and technologies, but this limited capacity is in my eyes a very important flaw (may be the only one).  Expecially for a DAP that want to also be also positionned as a server !

but anyway, congratulation for this new entry in the DAP market.
 
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: rustydoglim on 11 Dec 2016, 03:32 pm
I think microSD card storage capacity will increase over time so for most people, a single card is enough. Ha ha, by the time we ship in volume, 512GB microSD card might be common.
I think a nice feature (for future software release) is to have all the music in the Playlist "cache" in the player.
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: bmichels on 13 Dec 2016, 10:47 am
Today I have in my "old" AK100  two uSD with 200 Gb in each : total 432 Gb full of music !  Can't go back to - 300 Gb total !
 
Why don't you release a "pro" or " HD " version with 512 Gb internal memory. This will be a "First" in the DAP market !  and will differentiate you from the crowd of the other DAPS.

I know it will cost a lot, but some people will be prepared to pay for it, and the others.... will buy the 64 Gb version.  This will be just an added opportunity for NuPrime to make extra money, just like Apple who has several capacity for it's iPad & iPhone.  People choose... everybody win  :icon_lol:
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: rustydoglim on 13 Dec 2016, 11:11 am
Hardware development takes time. Worst is when we are doing new hardware and software at the same time.
We have to mitigate the risk. Even the hardware and software have been updated several times.
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: rustydoglim on 2 Jan 2017, 10:12 pm
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=155757)
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=155758)

For those of you who are not technical:
Omnia SP1 - a single platform that does everything, supporting up to 32-bit/384kHz and DSD256 decoding including streaming (depending on receiving devices). Incredible desktop level power for 400mW x 2 headphone amp. High-end upgradable DAC daughter board!

Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: rustydoglim on 2 Jan 2017, 10:17 pm
For the technical people, these applications that are running on Omnia SP1:

Omnia Media Server - DLNA server streaming music from local (Micro SD or USB 3.0 connected hard drives). It can also stream to Apple devices through AirPlay.

Omnia Renderer - receives streaming music from another Omnia or other devices

Omnia Player - plays music from Omnia Media Server or other DLNA servers, including Apple devices (through AirPlay)

Spotify, Qobuz, Tidal, and other streaming Apps running on Omnia SP1 with high-end hardware for better performance

NuPrime streaming App running on Omnia SP1 supporting Spotify, Qobuz (March 2017) and Tidal (t.b.d.), Omnia Media Server and other DLNA servers.
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: rustydoglim on 2 Jan 2017, 10:22 pm
Omnia SP1 replaces the following devices in your system:
* Computer
* High-end DAC
* High-end headphone amp
* Media Server
* Streaming Server
* Re-Streaming device
* Portable Music Player

No kidding! This is crazy.  I just spent the past 3 days working with engineering team to test and debug with multiple media servers (Synology, PC, Mac, two Omnia SP1), smart phones, WR-100 running on a network.
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: triumph on 3 Jan 2017, 08:00 am
I have no doubt that Omnia will be great, and for most of the customers who want plug and play, this will be the perfect addition to those sound bars and wireless systems that are becoming popular.

In my case, it can't replace my computer. I need to drive multiple channels and I am using convolution to adjust my speakers to my room. I wouldn't be able to go back to simple EQ sliders.

But like I said, I am an odd case and I'm sure most will be pleased with this new toy on the block!
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: RafaPolit on 3 Jan 2017, 06:00 pm
I believe there is market for it, yes.

But people that go for the more refined sound do tend to want the DAC, the AMP, the SERVER, etc., separated so that it gets easier to upgrade components.  For instance, I could upgrade to 'tomorrows' whatever new format changing my DAC but the analog output will be the same and I don't need to change the Amp.

Also, I could ensure a great CPU resampler and send it to the DAC of my choice.  Or headphone amp.  The fact that the Omnia does everything except the Amp is an interesting gamble.  Lets see how people react to it.

For my tastes and setup, it has no use.  I now have a RaspberryPi doing the bit perfect audio and resampling.  And a DAC+Amp (all in one) that receives the inputs from the TV, a multi-room Airport Express and the RPi3.  So I would move to separate DAC and Amp in the future, not into 'combining' more stuff into a single item and loosing versatility.

Also, I prefer the command on my phone, tablet, computer, or whatever I choose, rather than a touch screen on the item itself.  So, in contrast with most other products in the NuPrime lineup, this is the least appealing to me.

I could be wrong, of course! :)

Best regards,
Rafa.
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: rustydoglim on 7 Jan 2017, 05:26 am
Gee, I wonder why nobody pay attention (even with repeated emphasis) that the DAC on Omnia is upgradable  :thumb:
Omnia is designed to be modular and will appear in multiple forms: server only, server+player.
Someone might be willing to pay for the super expensive ESS9038Pro, while others will be happy with ESS018 or AK4490.
I can run a streaming app on Omnia and stream to multiple WR-100 receivers.
Technically it is incorrect to say that Omnia replaces a computer, because it is a computer with high-end audio hardware.

Oh, the Omnia app will run on iOS, Android, Linux, Windows and Mac. Obviously it doesn't make sense to touch the screen when it is docked.
A server only version of Omnia will be in the 9-series chassis.

And for those people who prefer Windows PC, we are working on streaming DAC that is a fraction of the price of Auralic.
If you like NAS or other cheap PC, we are going to release hardware system for you to plug in Raspberry Pi or embedded Synology NAS.
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: RoadTripper on 7 Jan 2017, 04:24 pm
As a guy with no plans to move away from my DAC, would there be any benefit for me to own/use the Omnia? I can't seem to make that out from all the comments on the thread.
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: mr_bill on 7 Jan 2017, 05:07 pm
Very very cool Jason

If I use the upgraded new 9038 Pro ESS Dac chip in Omnia I don't see why I need anything else for a streamer, Dac for my high end system?! Correct?

Stream Tidal, Pandora, play hard drive attached files, all through top line internal Dac and then analog out to integrated amp - do I have this right?
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: rustydoglim on 17 Jan 2017, 06:34 pm
Very very cool Jason

If I use the upgraded new 9038 Pro ESS Dac chip in Omnia I don't see why I need anything else for a streamer, Dac for my high end system?! Correct?

Stream Tidal, Pandora, play hard drive attached files, all through top line internal Dac and then analog out to integrated amp - do I have this right?

Yes. And no. You still need a DAC if you have multiple digital and analog inputs.
We tried 9028 and it doesn't sound any difference than 9018.  We have yet to try 9038Pro.  There might be some, but keep in mind that a good DAC chip's performance is so high that the sound quality of a DAC is now mainly determined by the preamp and switch:
See http://www.nuprimeaudio.com/index.php/guides/learning/what-is-high-end-dac.html (http://www.nuprimeaudio.com/index.php/guides/learning/what-is-high-end-dac.html)

But if we come out with Omnia SHDP1 (Server + headphone amp + DAC + preamp) with multiple inputs, then you really do not need anything else except amp.
Or a very cheap version of Omnia S1, higher performance version of S2.  All with upgradable DAC.

Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: rustydoglim on 17 Jan 2017, 06:36 pm
As a guy with no plans to move away from my DAC, would there be any benefit for me to own/use the Omnia? I can't seem to make that out from all the comments on the thread.

You can use it as a high end headphone amp, player, streamer, media server, wifi audio receiver (also known as renderer)
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: bmichels on 28 Jan 2017, 09:15 pm
availability soon ?   ;-)
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: witchdoctor on 28 Jan 2017, 09:47 pm
My compliments on your teams innovation. I would love to have the "one device" that binds them all together. It is a PIA having to build a system piece meal (and expensive). Looking forward to the release. I hope you make the Omnia MQA friendly.
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: rustydoglim on 8 Feb 2017, 07:20 pm
Still a lot of software bugs. I think by the time we can get through fixing the bugs, and go into production, the shipping date should be around mid May.
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: bmichels on 17 Feb 2017, 09:17 pm
Take advantage of this extra-time to make a "Plus" version with 256 or 512 Gb internal for those ready to pay for the extra storage  :wink:
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: GBouillon on 28 Feb 2017, 10:05 pm
I am currently testing the DAC-10H, ST-10, DAC-9, HPA-9 and STA-9 monoblocks at home. I am doing all sorts of combinations and for now, I am torn between DAC-9/HPA-9/STA-9 monoblocks and DAC-10H/monoblocks.

The streaming part of this system is an Auralic Aries Mini which I don't like and I will return. I am still looking for a good streamer to act as a source for Tidal, Deezer and my NAS via iPad and iPhone.

Would the Omnia (S2 or SHDP1) be a good solution in this case?

Omnia -> DAC-9 -> HPA-9 -> STA-9's

Thanks!
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: rustydoglim on 2 Mar 2017, 06:52 pm
Yes. We have made more progress with Omnia testing (I am not ready to announce the "all clear" status yet).

Here's the performance stacks with Omnia and I think on the market this is as good as you can get:

1. Tidal (or other stream app running on Omnia) - digital music goes through Android audio layer and then decoded by Omnia's DAC and headphone amp (or line out through the dock) to external preamp and amp. This will sound very good.

2. The BEST performance is this: Bubble uPnP app (Omnia Player app will also be released but you can choose to use either one,  we decided to bundle Bubble because it is very popular) reads high resolution music from Omnia Server (running on the same device), then "stream" to Omnia Renderer (running on the same device or remotely on another Omnia).  When music is streamed to Omnia renderer, the renderer uses additional custom API and hardware (re-clocking, extended buffering, sampling rate converter etc) on the Omnia DAC board for maximum performance. 
This is where we are able to "re-architect" the standard digital music decoding from computer USB audio to DAC to preamp/amp.
By taking control of the software layer, we are able to create custom hardware architecture but yet still offer an open platform for streaming app.

I am pretty sure all the Player or Server out there don't go this far.  Most of the Players run on Linux (a few with Android) with a good DAC and headphone amp, but not going as far as redesigning the audio API and audio path.  Omnia takes too much work, but we think it is a good approach to build a platform for the next generation of devices.


Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: bmichels on 5 Apr 2017, 10:31 am
Any update ?  still shooting for May ?
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: rustydoglim on 7 Apr 2017, 09:31 pm
Probably shipping in late June, or even July. 
Because we put server, renderer and player on the same device, the software gets a bit more complicated.
For example, if you don't use NuPrime Player app, but prefer to use Bubble uPnP, what happen when there is no WiFi? How is the player find the DLNA server and renderer? In this case, turn on HotSpot on Omnia SP1.  Ok, just got this to work this week.
If you are using NuPrime Player, then it will know where to look for its own DLNA server and renderer when WiFi is off, so no need to turn on Hot Spot.
Anyway, we are making progress but it is not done yet.  We should be able to ship samples to distributor in May 2017. That will be our final field trial and QC before production release.  The good thing with getting all these software layer to work is that they can work on future generation of server and player hardware.
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: bmichels on 28 Apr 2017, 11:02 am
Still on line for MUNICH's working demos ?  I am looking forward looking/listening to this new DAP  :P
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: Mr.tangco on 29 Apr 2017, 04:38 pm
Just realised that Omnia may be the solution to my problem of finding a standalone headless player for playing ripped SACD ISOs - especially if in the sta-9 chassis. If running android, it might be possible to open the HibyMusic app, output native DSD to the uDSD inside - and voila! Or perhaps even hdmi i2s output is possible to standalone DACs?  Please tell me if that's the case? Can't wait to see what's in store!
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: rustydoglim on 5 May 2017, 06:38 pm
These two working products will be showing at HIGH END Show, Hall 1 C05 in Munich, Germany from May 18 to 22.
Note that Omnia is sold together with the dock. MSRP has not been decided.
The Omnia media server and renderer are automatically started when the device is powered up. They are part of the system integrated with low level device API and firmware.  In order to prevent users from "breaking" the device, we won't open up the Play store. If you want to use any Apps, we have to certify the app and then make it available for Omnia to download. Popular music services like Tidal, Spotify, Qobuz, etc will be available on the device by default.

(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=161860)
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: bmichels on 17 May 2017, 08:34 pm
One question regarding TIDAL streaming:  will OMNIA also offer TIDAL off-line mode ?
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: rustydoglim on 22 May 2017, 07:04 am
Tidal and other streaming apps will be running directly on Omnia so the off line mode will work.
It doesn't work for other devices because they are running the native app.
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: DanM66 on 22 Jun 2017, 02:07 am
Rustydoglim,
I just purchased a IDA-8.  I have a portable hard drive with about 400 high res albums on it.  Is the Omnia able to simply take the hard drive and plug into the amp?
Sounds easy.....  haha
Appreciate any info!
Dan
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: rustydoglim on 23 Jun 2017, 05:28 pm
Yes, exactly.  Plus more:
- It functions as your NAS
- You can just run your streaming apps (Tidal, Spotify, whatever) on it and play the offline downloaded music
- And when you leave home just take it with you.

It is going through weekly bug fixes and getting very close.

Oh there is already an Omnia S1 (server version, no screen, no headphone amp, no built-in DAC, in the 9-series case) being ready for release 2 months after Omnia SP1.
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: Tom Davis on 23 Jun 2017, 06:12 pm
Two questions:

Do you have a release date and MSRP for the CDP-9?

And will the S1 version of the Omni interface with my IDA-16?

Thanks much in advance.

Tom



These two working products will be showing at HIGH END Show, Hall 1 C05 in Munich, Germany from May 18 to 22.
Note that Omnia is sold together with the dock. MSRP has not been decided.
The Omnia media server and renderer are automatically started when the device is powered up. They are part of the system integrated with low level device API and firmware.  In order to prevent users from "breaking" the device, we won't open up the Play store. If you want to use any Apps, we have to certify the app and then make it available for Omnia to download. Popular music services like Tidal, Spotify, Qobuz, etc will be available on the device by default.

(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=161860)
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: rustydoglim on 6 Jul 2017, 07:43 pm
CDP-9 MSRP is $1595.
Omnia S1 is expected to retail for $649 (unlike Omnia SP1, it has no DAC inside) and output to coaxial, HDMI (for i2S).
RJ45, USB ports (for hard disk) are expected. It might have a decent DAC for analog output. We have not finalise the features yet.
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: slash71 on 7 Jul 2017, 08:07 am
Hi, CDP-x without DAC stage is also on your production forecast?


enrico
(Italy)
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: Tom Davis on 7 Jul 2017, 03:22 pm
Thanks so much for the information.

Are you planning on a fall release date?

Tom



CDP-9 MSRP is $1595.
Omnia S1 is expected to retail for $649 (unlike Omnia SP1, it has no DAC inside) and output to coaxial, HDMI (for i2S).
RJ45, USB ports (for hard disk) are expected. It might have a decent DAC for analog output. We have not finalise the features yet.
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: rustydoglim on 12 Jul 2017, 10:42 pm
CDP-9 is in production and expected to ship early September.
Same for Omnia SP1.
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: slash71 on 15 Jul 2017, 09:30 am
CDP-9 MSRP is $1595.
Omnia S1 is expected to retail for $649 (unlike Omnia SP1, it has no DAC inside) and output to coaxial, HDMI (for i2S).

hi rustydog,
omnia s1 support external  dac usb ?
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: rustydoglim on 16 Jul 2017, 05:14 pm
I am not clear about your question. Omnia has a coaxial output for external DAC.
It is not a USB DAC to connect to computer, we already have other USB DACs that do that. Omnia replaces a computer, media server, and player.
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: slash71 on 17 Jul 2017, 12:08 pm
I am not clear about your question. Omnia has a coaxial output for external DAC.
It is not a USB DAC to connect to computer, we already have other USB DACs that do that. Omnia replaces a computer, media server, and player.

I have both the big brother DAC-10H  and  uDSD  ,  the little one is in my project lab to test USB virtualisation protocol for audio ...

some DAC does coax but some DAC's doesn't    ,  uDSD for example cannot be used with Omnia S1 ?

Thanks.
Enrico
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: rustydoglim on 17 Jul 2017, 06:21 pm
uDSD is meant to be a USB audio DAC.
It is not a general purpose DAC.
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: DanM66 on 15 Sep 2017, 12:06 am
Any news on the Omnia release?
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: rustydoglim on 15 Sep 2017, 04:14 pm
The player+dock has been pushed out to next year, instead we are focusing on Omnia S1 (i.e. a server version without the screen) before end of the year, but you can connect the HDMI to monitor, USB to keyboard and mouse, so you can still run streaming apps etc on the server.
The player consumes too much power and play time is not ideal, it gets hot too, so we don't want to release it. On hindsight, trying to release a player that run as a server is a little too challenging for us.

Omnia S1 would work better with the other products within the family.

Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: Cliff B. on 3 Oct 2017, 03:43 pm
The player+dock has been pushed out to next year, instead we are focusing on Omnia S1 (i.e. a server version without the screen) before end of the year, but you can connect the HDMI to monitor, USB to keyboard and mouse, so you can still run streaming apps etc on the server.
The player consumes too much power and play time is not ideal, it gets hot too, so we don't want to release it. On hindsight, trying to release a player that run as a server is a little too challenging for us.

Omnia S1 would work better with the other products within the family.
Jason,
I'm trying to find a music server solution for my RV. Low power or battery powered is preferred because we mostly boondock and run off of a large battery bank and Inverter.
There are lots of small servers out there, the Aries Mini comes to mind, but they have to be controlled over wifi. That's ok if the server can act as an access point, eliminating the need for a router. Does the S1 require wifi for remote control? Can it be an access point? You mentioned the ability to plug keyboard and mouse into the USB ports, could this accommodate a wireless USB keyboard/mouse with a usb dongle?
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: rustydoglim on 5 Oct 2017, 08:39 pm
For low power use, why not just get the Raspberry Pi with Plex DLNA server ?
I think the S1 will consume little power, but it comes in the 9 series case, so it takes up too much space.
There is a plan to make cheap Omnia server, but not within the next few months.

For the first time, we completed the following test this week:
Android phone running Omnia server and renderer streaming to/from Omnia SP1 (that's the S1 with screen that we are not releasing).

Android phone with free Omnia apps:
Omnia server - allows the Android device to become a DLNA music server to stream music from its storage - FREE
Omnia receiver (renderer) - allows Android phone to receive or stream to another DLNA device (doesn't have to be Android)
Omnia player/controller - allows Android phone to control another Omnia device
*** The above are all FREE

NuPrime Omnia hardware (including future integrated amp or DAC with Omnia inside):
Omnia server - able to take advantage of custom hardware for better performance
Omnia receiver - allows Omnia device receive or stream to another DLNA device, able to take advantage of custom hardware for better performance
Omnia player - runs on device that has a screen

If you just want to have a music server and receiver in your car, you can just get the free Omnia apps on an Android tablet.

Our project has suffered delayed due to the amount of work required for such a complete system. We don't want to develop a half way solution, there are too many of those on the market today.


Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: Cliff B. on 5 Oct 2017, 10:57 pm

The designated cabinet is large enough to accommodate the 9 series, it would likely share the cabinet with my IDA8. I would love to see a video of this unit in operation, being controlled headlessly by an android device.
Title: Re: A few jaw dropping features of Omnia
Post by: rustydoglim on 8 Oct 2017, 04:07 pm
as soon as the Android app is ready for beta test, I will contact some of you.