AudioCircle
Audio/Video Gear and Systems => Tube-o-phile Circle => Topic started by: eclein on 10 Mar 2011, 11:44 pm
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Hey guys I have the original Musical Paradise MP 301 and have been watching for the new version having heard things from the designer and others who contributed ideas for this version:
http://www.musicalparadise.ca/mp/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=6&products_id=75
The price is excellent, and if its anything like the original I'm saving up for one...two inputs, integrated, this is perfect for me...input for CD, input for Squeezebox....no other box in the path...just 6.5 watts of joy...LOL!!!!
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And people were trying to tell you 60 watts minimum...8)
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Originally I was going to use it exclusively as a headphone amp but had to try it with the big boys and I was pleasantly surprised. Check out the parts-not bad components at all nice in fact and the designer is easily accessible through DIY forum and helps mod his amps...that to me is becoming the real fun part, the tweaking!! :thumb:
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Damn you and your evil temptations, Mr Lein. I am very tempted to get in the queue. Would be nice to hear some feed back.
Doesn't yours run 6V6 for outputs Ed?
Jake
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Yep---I got some Tung Sol's on the recommendation of the group here, very nice...today was the first day back home where I really aired it out some...it sounds really good to me, I'll save for the new version for the: Two Inputs, Headphone Jack on front now-PITA on the back, Speaker switch and it uses some different tubes I think...I'm a novice but I know what sounds good and for the money I say this is a wonderful piece...the parts used are good quality...I'm juggling what to do with my Rent Rebate Check--this amp or ipad 2 ??? Decisions, Decisions...LOL..fun ones this time though...
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(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=46170)
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=46171)
Musical Paradise MP-301MK2 and its 6.5 watts of audio bliss has just crossed the border headed my way, the designer of this piece told me that this amp is much better than my first version he also designed and should drive speakers better (I had zero problem with the 1st one driving anything)
I bought some Tung Sol Tubes for the first one that both ended up being bad tubes so I sent them back for a refund which I quickly spent on some Mullard EL34's for the new one along with some RCA tubes for the pre-amp portion of MK2. Some folks have had these in hand for a little while now and so far all reports point to another bargain priced but well made item. I'll let you guys know how it sounds after I get it up and running--I'm sooo Pumped!!!
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Cool little amp, Ed! I ABSOLUTELY LOVE the K.I.S.S approach. A good pair of speakers/headphones and a line-level source are all you need with this baby to rock and roll! Keep us informed on it.
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Hey guys I have the original Musical Paradise MP 301 and have been watching for the new version having heard things from the designer and others who contributed ideas for this version:
http://www.musicalparadise.ca/mp/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=6&products_id=75
The price is excellent, and if its anything like the original I'm saving up for one...two inputs, integrated, this is perfect for me...input for CD, input for Squeezebox....no other box in the path...just 6.5 watts of joy...LOL!!!!
Thanks for the link. They also seem to sell a single ended 300B design at 7-8 watts/channel for about $650! Wow! Hot for mods.
:thumb:
Anand.
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The cool thing is Garry Huang is the designer and he hangs out on DIY website and helps guys make modifications to his stuff. This version 2 of the MP301 is made up almost entirely by upgrades or mods people were doing or could do, in otherwords he took everybodies suggestions and designed the MK2 based in part on those ideas....thats cool that the average Joe has a bit or can have a bit of direct input into the design of this companies products.
The other day he sent me an email and I noticed he was online through gmail and had a 20 minute gmail chat with him like I just dropped into the shop or something.....its fun, its not a ton of money, they sound very good to my ears and thats all that matters.
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Get the new one yet?
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On its way!!!! Monday or Tuesday I figure, left Canada this morning.
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Finally! I thought they were going to hold id hostage forever. :green:
Peace,
Lee
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Stock tube 6J8P--Replacement sizes- 6SJ7, 5693, 6AC7, 6SK7, 6SD7, 6J4P, 6*4, 6*8
Stock Tube 6L6---Replacement sizes- 6P3P, 5881, EL34
So being the good audiophool I've got some tubes on the way to roll, but I need suggestions from the pros here.
I have Mullard EL34's on order and RCA in the other type...LOL...not sure what size...I'm easy.....
So do you guys have any super selections for the above replacement sizes, I think the 6L6 and subs are the power tubes and the 6J8P and subs are the pre-amp tubes, unless I'm totally wrong (which is entirely possible). :thumb: :thumb:
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The new design is much slicker looking than the original, that's for sure! I'm starting to look around at my house and say "Hmmm. Could I use a second system in this room?." I need an excuse to git me one!
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I did a chat with the designer the other day on Gmail and he told this version was designed with emphasis on the speaker segment or whatever you call it. I told him I run some old vintage JBL's on it and he said this version will make them sing.
The price is excellent, designed well I believe, good parts were sourced and it wasn't just thrown together....Ericus-come on over to the Dark Side.
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Ericus-come on over to the Dark Side.
:rotflmao:
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So do you guys have any super selections for the above replacement sizes, I think the 6L6 and subs are the power tubes and the 6J8P and subs are the pre-amp tubes, unless I'm totally wrong (which is entirely possible). :thumb: :thumb:
You're right, Ed!
I tried a few different brands of new production EL34s and never really loved what I heard. I always preferred the Gold Lion KT66s in my amps (I don't know if your new amp will support that tube, though). Then I bought some Siemens/RFT EL34s and think they sound so much better than the other EL34s I've owned. While they are NOS they were made in the early 80's (I think) and so they're not nearly as expensive as NOS Mullards and the like. I've seen them on the 'bay for $50-60/pair. I can't vouch for the sellers though. Surely some of the tube dealers have some fully tested and matched, maybe for under $100 a pair.
Those Russian 6L6s also sound pretty good and are uber-cheap! They are the 6N3CE (or 6P3SE) and I've seen them for $12 pair. I don't know how they'd compare to the Mullard reissues though.
Happy rolling!
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Ericus I got the Mullards (Pair) shipped for like $50ish I think from my guy Jon at The Tube Store...
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Very interested to hear some impressions on this little thing. I'm *this* close to buying one as a HP amp and secondary amp in my main setup.
Its ability to drive speakers isn't a concern for me because at one point I hooked up my dearly departed little 2.5wpc Miniwatt integrated to my dearly departed SongTowers and felt like I might end up joining some of my dearly departed loved ones because it sounded so good. :D
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If you are looking into a SET tube amp at a great price this is the one. irishsammy, what happened to the ST? I have had the MP-301 for two weeks now and love it. Break-in not completed yet for a review. I have read to roll output to EL34's.
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Like many audiophiles, I suffer from Audio ADD...a crippling disease that distances me from pieces of audio gear as soon as I get bored with them. I loved the ST's with a passion but I decided to sell them in favor of a pair of Fritz Carbon 7's. I don't regret my decision but man, are there times I miss the elegance of the sound of my old Consonance tube integrated with the ST's. I got rid of the Consonance when we moved and I'm looking to bring some tubey goodness back to my life. The 301 might be that ticket...
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irishsammy- Check out the thread at head-fi and others here, the early buuyers are experiencing some hum with the power tubes that ship with the unit, it was very noticeable at first and then calmed a bit and I have since changed power tubes for some other ones and its pretty much gone now just make sure you read as much as you can on these before you jump.
Mine sounds great, no hum and is really quiet now.
Just a heads up.
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irishsammy,
You sold your SongTower for the Fritz 7? Wow. And you like the Fritz 7 more? How's the imaging, timbre, and bass extension between the two? (Whoops, I'm a bit OT but am indeed curious as the ST are so highly rated.)
Thanks,
UL
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I got an MP-301 MK2 recently and I just plugged it into my system about 1/2 hr ago. Excellent. Drives my North Creek Borealis (~86 dB) very well although the bass does not have the impact it had with my Eico HF-87 or any other of the higher powered digital amps I have. Cannot imagine a better value. A tube amp with a headphone output plus a preamp for $260 + SH; it just screams value. The type of product that makes no apologizes for its price. It is just good sounding. I am sure it will be even better after the tubes have run in for a few hours and when I try it with any of the other speakers I have of higher sensitivity. What a bargain!
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By the way, no hum whatsoever even when turned up past 1 o'clock. Sounds better now than when I posted a few minutes ago. :)
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irishsammy- Check out the thread at head-fi and others here, the early buuyers are experiencing some hum with the power tubes that ship with the unit, it was very noticeable at first and then calmed a bit and I have since changed power tubes for some other ones and its pretty much gone now just make sure you read as much as you can on these before you jump.
Mine sounds great, no hum and is really quiet now.
Just a heads up.
Yeah, I perused the entire 301 MkII thread and I'm only mildly worried about the hum issue. It seems like Garry's pretty good about customer service and you "early adopters" have ferreted out the issue. So game on. :thumb:
irishsammy,
You sold your SongTower for the Fritz 7? Wow. And you like the Fritz 7 more? How's the imaging, timbre, and bass extension between the two? (Whoops, I'm a bit OT but am indeed curious as the ST are so highly rated.)
Thanks,
UL
Not to get too far into it but personally, I find the C7's to be a more dynamic speaker overall. They don't have the midrange magic of the ST's but they're a remarkably capable bookshelf. I find the soundstage in particular to be a marked improvement over the ST's. Bass extension is also better and stronger. The transmission line cabinet does put out some remarkably clean and potent bass but the C7's just have more punch and authority down low.
So is everybody just stopping at EL34's for power tubes with the 301M2? My mind has been wandering since ordering mine and I'm wondering if I could pop in maybe some KT77's. Better ask Garry.
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irishsammy, I just got into tubes and sent the list of replacement tubes (Did you see that yet?) to thetubestore.com and said I'd like some Mullards and they hooked me up with the EL34's, they are quiet so for now I'm good and breaking this baby in and finding I really, really like the way its sounding here. Its got a nice punchy low end, tight and right for me-I like tight bass. I had the first version also and this one just has more balls. I tend to go over the top when posting about stuff I like...LOL. but the sound for me, here, with my JBL's is wonderful!!!!! :thumb: :thumb: :thumb:
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I had the mk2 and it wasn't my cup of tea. For cheap tubes, I preferred the miniwatt.
Also, it sounds like some of you might be considering buying the mk2 to tube roll. This is a mistake. You can, as Ed mentioned, change the power tubes, but folks have had a lot of problems messing with the drivers. This is too bad, since the drivers are where you can most impact the tonal characteristics.
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I agree that it's a shame the driver tubes are so finicky but I think it all depends on your expectations. For something to play around with or for something for a secondary setup, the Mk2 seems like it's right there with the MiniWatt. IIRC, the Miniwatt isn't overly tube-rolling-friendly, either...at least in terms of different types of tubes. Add in the fact that the Mk2 gives you a can amp and more power than the MW and the fact that it's about $100 less...that all makes it a pretty good bargain.
Look at me...talking up this thing before it even shows up. Guess my expectations are showing...sorry guys. :oops:
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Sorry, I just thought someone with experience should curb some of the hyperbole.
To be clear, I preferred the Miniwatt N3 to the MK2, based soley on how they sound in stock set up. I wasn't saying that the Miniwatt is better because of its tube rolling ability, although, from the boards, it sounds like you can use pretty much any EL84 or 12ax7, including NOS.
If I hadn't heard either and just looked at them, I would surely prefer the MK2.
Better part selection, bigger transformer, sturdier tube inputs, real binding posts, and, as Irish mentioned, cheaper price. Problem for me was that the MK2 was just too dark sounding on all 3 of my speakers (omega single driver fostex,
klipsch horns, vmps ribbons). With brighter, slightly less efficient speakers, I might have liked the MK2. It does have pretty good PRAT.
FYI, you can get the old Miniwatt S1 (which I haven't heard) new on ebay for around $250. Its called "APPJ."
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Better part selection, bigger transformer, sturdier tube inputs, real binding posts, and, as Irish mentioned, cheaper price.
I noticed that the MP-301 MK2, although it does have 5-way binding posts, does not have both 4 and 8 ohm transformer taps like the Miniwatt S3. How does that relate to speaker matching and the listening results in your case, or for others with different speakers?
Steve
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How does that relate to speaker matching and the listening results in your case, or for others with different speakers?
I'm not sure I can give you the answer you're looking for, but I'll tell you what I know. The miniwatt, the N3 in my case, has separate 4, 6, and 8 ohm taps, while the mk2 only has one set of posts. The mk2 has a stated output impedance of "4-8 ohms". I imagine the power rating on higher than 4 ohms is lower than 6.5 wpc, but I really don't know. 2 of my speaks are 8 ohms, the other is a tough 4. I only listened to the miniwatt on the 8 ohm speaks, but I did try out the mk2 on the 4 ohm to see whether the humming and other noise diminished on these speakers. (It did.)
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Sorry, I just thought someone with experience should curb some of the hyperbole.
To be clear, I preferred the Miniwatt N3 to the MK2, based soley on how they sound in stock set up. I wasn't saying that the Miniwatt is better because of its tube rolling ability, although, from the boards, it sounds like you can use pretty much any EL84 or 12ax7, including NOS.
If I hadn't heard either and just looked at them, I would surely prefer the MK2.
Better part selection, bigger transformer, sturdier tube inputs, real binding posts, and, as Irish mentioned, cheaper price. Problem for me was that the MK2 was just too dark sounding on all 3 of my speakers (omega single driver fostex,
klipsch horns, vmps ribbons). With brighter, slightly less efficient speakers, I might have liked the MK2. It does have pretty good PRAT.
FYI, you can get the old Miniwatt S1 (which I haven't heard) new on ebay for around $250. Its called "APPJ."
It's cool. I didn't mean to shoot you down. Lord knows I haven't even heard this thing yet and I did really like my MiniWatt.
I think I just have this irrational belief (or hope?) that stuff like the Mk2 doesn't fall into that "too good to be true" category. :eyebrows:
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I run 8 ohm JBL-S38ii's with mine that are 89db sensitive 3 -ways and they sound great. Plenty of power for me and my setup. The hum in my case went away when I put tube config of stock tubes up front and Mullard EL34's in the back, its extremely quiet now. I cannot tell its on by listening to no signal, there is no sound at all, totally black background. So for 5 or 6 days I had a hum and once it left and the amp started to break in more it has worked out well for me in my setup.
Mine was a gift which I am very grateful to have received and I'm enjoying this amp thoroughly. :thumb:
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(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=47165)
:P
This integrated amplifier is a gem!! Unheard price of $306.00 including shipping. Now I need to cut the grass and take down a hornets nest. Yeah me!
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I wonder if this amp would power my soon to arrive VSA VR-33's? 90db sensitivity, 8 ohm average. Not looking for high volume, just some low listening tubey goodness.
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MCA, this amp will do you just fine. I use this amp to drive Axiom M22v3's with a sen of 93dp. I wake up the dead. Listened to Martina Mcbrides concert this morning and it brought tears to my eyes. :thumb:
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(http://)
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Very promising. Mine is in the US now...but that's all I know. :|
Any hum problems so far, Milford?
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Has anyone heard it's big brother, the MP-401?
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Irishsammy did your amp arrive? Thoughts??
Hey I hooked up with a reviewer over on head-fi (skylab) and he had some Mullard pre-amp tubes for this that he never got to try as they arrrived after he sent the review unit back so he sold them to me for hardly anything and man they sound sweet-as in good not syrupy...very dynamic presentation now.
So I have reissue Mullard EL34's(2) from Russia they say and some Mullard 6SK7GT (2) from Holland (probably Phillips I'm told)and they cost me a total of around $70 for all and this is hard to describe, it sounds more like real instruments than recorded instruments....No Hum, No Noise at all, very quiet, so the stock pre-amp tubes can be replaced and still be super quiet. Very neat and always amazing how tubes change the sound, like a new amp showed up...LOL..
Irish let us know!!!
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I am considering buying the MK2 and it will be my first tube amp. I am very interested in hearing their reviews as well! I am concerned about the taps or lack of selector and I will be using 8 ohm speakers (GR N3) so knowing it is set for 4 or 8 oms would be reassuring. My speakers sensitivity is fine at 90.5 db @ 1 Watt/1 Meter so I'm not worried about volume output, however MK2 seems to hum more using these 8 ohm speakers compared to 4 ohm as others have noted. I have no experience with Tube amps and I was looking at some of the other Chinese brands such as the Audioromy FU29, Music Angel Meng Series EL34b and the Yaqin 10L. They are all comparable in price to the MK2, but they have much more wattage. I was wondering if anyone with experience has compared these?
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This amplifier will still drive 8 ohm speakers at 6.5 watts per channel, according to Gary it was designed for 8 ohm speakers!
I'm not sure I can give you the answer you're looking for, but I'll tell you what I know. The miniwatt, the N3 in my case, has separate 4, 6, and 8 ohm taps, while the mk2 only has one set of posts. The mk2 has a stated output impedance of "4-8 ohms". I imagine the power rating on higher than 4 ohms is lower than 6.5 wpc, but I really don't know. 2 of my speaks are 8 ohms, the other is a tough 4. I only listened to the miniwatt on the 8 ohm speaks, but I did try out the mk2 on the 4 ohm to see whether the humming and other noise diminished on these speakers. (It did.)
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The MK2 arrived yesterday! All I can say is "Wow" it sounds fantastic! I'm just in shock from the level of build and sound quality at this price point! Absolutely no hum with Cans or Speakers. I was concerned about detail being diminished somewhat compared to my digital and Solid State amplification, but this is not the case, as I am hearing more detail. Not to say my Digital or Solid State amplification is high end but lower midlevel quality! I was also concerened about the 6.5 watts of single ended power not being enough to drive my GR Research N3 speakers or my Less efficiant 86 db bookshelves? Rest assure this amp drives them well above levels I can tolerate. I measured the N3s at 90.5 db @ 1 watt/ 1 meter outputting a level 90 db at 15'! It's just hard for me to understand not knowing much about Tube Amps how so few watts can be this loud! My Marantz puts out 120 watts to the front channels and the MK2 is louder? This amplifier sounds just fantastic out of the box so I am anxious to
see what tube rolling can accomplish!
Thanks for the recommendation Ed, I am just elated by this amp!
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Glag to hear it Zero!! I have had my MP-302 MK2 for a while now. I was just listening with my Beyerdynamic DT-990 600 ohm phones. The amp with the 990's just fills your head with unblievable sound its hard to discribe. I rolled the power tubes to Shuguang EL34-B's. The power output increased the db's even further. Enjoy!!
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All right!!!!! Thanks for letting us know, I got what I think are newer Mullard Labelled tubes in the back for power-EL34's right? And some real Mullards the fella "Skylab" was going to use but never did for his review-they are the smaller ones up front and I love this thing. It seems to get stronger and cleaner as time goes on but that could be my wishful thinking.....I was wondering if it handle N3's and thats good news because I think this amp with those speakers and a Squeezebox touch would be a great sounding system...easy, efficient, but musical for around a $1000 ish...... :thumb: :thumb: :thumb:
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I forgot to add this to my last post. I also rolled the preamp tubes to (NOS) Rauland's 6SK7GT's This roll elimanated the last remaining hum. :D Rock on my friends!
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Yes, the N3s were my biggest concern as I bought the amp mainly for the Floorstanders! I almost didn't get them because of SkyLabs review on HeadFi and he didn't think the amp would drive floorstanders in a big room. I called Gary and after telling him what the speakers were, he said it would sound excellent and should drive them to 95 db! So here I am thinking these measly 6.5 watts are going to call for the volume control to be maxed out... Wrong! With the MK2 adjusted halfway I was measuring 90+ db at 15 feet! In my opinion these speakers are excellent to begin with but this amp makes them come to life and seems more musical and all the instruments playing are much
more prominent! Soundstage, Imaging, depth and all the other qualities
improved! Details diminish with a tube amp especially the lower ranges? Not so with what I am hearing, in fact I hear more detail and the only thing I can compare it to, is being in a live venue as it's completely natural sounding, like I am hearing what I am supposed to be hearing, rather then listening to something unnatural? Milford, yes I agree about the headphones, it made a huge difference compared to my Marantz AVR. My Cans (Speaker Company HD Pro7) are cheap probably entry level quality and they sound so much better.
I hear what your saying on the Tubes, especially the Power Pentodes. Anyone want to give me their Treasures! My Friend, Robert purchased the amp as well and said it is superior all around compared to his much higher powered Yaqin 20L, he wants to try the Russian tubes and I am leaning towards Genelax Gold Lion? Heck I might not do anything at all since it sounds so darn good out if the box! If I were going to Roll tubes, I'll try to emulate what you have Ed! The last few recommendations seemed to work excellent. Hopefully I can find those tubes since they are so hard to get! Gotta go listen to some Porcupine Tree!
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Ed, I forgot to mention the N3s and the MK2 sound superb and much better then what I was using, but for Digital to Analog Conversion I am using the HRT Music Streamer II and StraightWire USB cable! I did hear the DAC in the Squeezebox was very good, but I am very happy with the analog quality of the MSII!
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Zero- I think your setup is probably sounding awesome!!! Good stuff, I was just saying in my post that if your like a new person interested in this hobby you can get really great sounding gear and do it very cost effectively. When I first came here for whatever reason I kept seeing these huge $$$$ amounts that folks were spending. I had just bought my car for 13K and the first week I was on board here checking stuff out somebody paid that much for a set of speakers and It really blew my mind, this hobby is like everything we just come into for the first time, cost look out of this world, and they can be or you can do like I do and find as many great bang for the buck ideas as you can and let other folks know!!!!! Enjoy Zero!!!!! :thumb: :thumb: :thumb: :thumb: :thumb:
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Milford I am getting the same hum via the headphones, but nothing from any speaker I have tried. it is very slight! As soon as I turn the volume up slightly it eliminates the hum. However I noticed this getting worse and found the stock 6L6 tubes to be defective and redplating the metal shield in the center of the tube! Gary applied the credit towards the EL34Bs and they are on the way down as south as you can go! I can't wait to hear them, I am also contemplating Genelex Gold Lion KT77 reissues or JJ Electronics KT77. I read good things from both brands but there is a big price differences and not sure the "You get what you pay for" phrase is going to apply here?
Thank you on the heads up for the PreAmp tubes, I may take a look into that if the hum is not eliminated by installing properly working power tubes!
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Zero what kind or brand of EL34's?? My hum lasted about a week and is now totally gone, so maybe time will be on your side here..