AudioCircle
Industry Circles => Bryston Limited => Topic started by: James Tanner on 14 Feb 2011, 01:50 pm
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Hi folks
A number of dealers have asked me about doing a very high quality headphone interface given the large number of young folks who listen on headphones these days.
Any input appreciated :)
james
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<<<<-------- Please make sure it works with these. :green:
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Hi James,
Been out of the headphone loop for a while but I think my biggest proposal way back http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=13425 was for an amp with enough current and gain to drive some of the better AKG, Sennheiser and Grado headphones.
Now that my son’s not a preschooler napping all the time but a preteen (scary how time passes) my AKG 501/701, Grado 325i’s and Sennheser 580/600s have been gathering a little bit of dust.
Robert
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Hi folks
A number of dealers have asked me about doing a very high quality headphone interface given the large number of young folks who listen on headphones these days.
Any input appreciated :)
james
Not too mention the amount of us baby boomers who will not be able to cart our gear into the old folks home later on down the road. :green:
Robert
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A new series of components in MPS-1 size chassis with mini C-series cosmetics ...
Headphone amp
SSD for BDP-1
Brystiny amps .04-B SST3, .07-B SST3, .28-B SST3 ...
Just kidding :o :D
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A high-quality head amp capable of doing a superb job with Sennheisers would be most welcome. Put a man on it, James!
D.
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A high-quality head amp capable of doing a superb job with Sennheisers would be most welcome. Put a man on it, James!
D.
Won't happen. It would need tone controls to correct the bass emphasis and that's something James won't do.
Nap. :jester:
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Won't happen. It would need tone controls to correct the bass emphasis and that's something James won't do.
Nap. :jester:
You are an awful, awful man, Nap...an awful man. :lol:
D.
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You are an awful, awful man, Nap...an awful man. :lol:
D.
Resistance is futile. We both know that, unless you're into cavernous bass, or James straightens up and includes tone controls, in the end you'll have to get these:
(http://)
nap. :thumb:
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Resistance is futile. We both know that, unless you're into cavernous bass, or James straightens up and includes tone controls, in the end you'll have to get these:
(http://)
nap. :thumb:
Mmmmmm...cavernous bass....
That will increase my enjoyment of that crazy hippety-hop. I'd best get me some of these, dawg !
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=42857)
D.
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Hi James,
Been out of the headphone loop for a while but I think my biggest proposal way back http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=13425 was for an amp with enough current and gain to drive some of the better AKG, Sennheiser and Grado headphones.
Robert
My my main concern back in 2004 was getting enough steam to get these guys cooking.
AKG K501s
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=42858)
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My AKG 701's do great out of the BP 25 ( could use a bit more gain but otherwise a very satisfying listen.) :eyebrows:
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Mmmmmm...cavernous bass....
That will increase my enjoyment of that crazy hippety-hop. I'd best get me some of these, dawg !
May I suggest a pair of Skullcandy Skullcrushers and a ButtKicker LFE installed under your chair?
Nap. :no_see:
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The headphones would have the option of being driven by an internal battery - or - from the Bryston MPS-2 power supply.
Also no problem driving a broad range of impedances.
Would call it (BHA-1) for Bryston Headphone Amp :)
james
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The headphones would have the option of being driven by an internal battery - or - from the Bryston MPS-2 power supply.
Also no problem driving a broad range of impedances.
Would call it (BHA-1) for Bryston Headphone Amp :)
james
James, you conveniently forgot to tell us what you're planning to accept at the other end - the input. Will this be an iBHA (white, plastic) thing? :lol:
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James, you conveniently forgot to tell us what you're planning to accept at the other end - the input. Will this be an iBHA (white, plastic) thing? :lol:
Hi Nap,
Sorry you mean the input connector from the preamplifier to the BHA-1?
james
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Hi Nap,
Sorry you mean the input connector from the preamplifier to the BHA-1?
james
It won't have even a preamp? I thought you were going to do something like this except with better amplification:
(http://)
Nap. :scratch:
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An option for crossfeed.
Include balanced outputs.
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So it won't have a preamp?
Nap. :scratch:
No you would come out of the tape out on your preamp to the rca input on the BHA-1.
james
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An option for crossfeed.
Include balanced outputs.
Crossfeed we are looking at - balanced outs to where - you mean an XLR output for the headphones? - if so that's covered :)
james
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No you would come out of the tape out on your preamp to the rca input on the BHA-1.
james
Confess it James, you're thinking full size unit? Not a portable one?
I guess a portable one would have more appeal.
Nap.
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Crossfeed we are looking at - balanced outs to where - you mean an XLR output for the headphones? - if so that's covered :)
james
Balanced XLR ... connects to the Sennheiser HD 800 Balanced headphones hated by Napalm.
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Confess it James, you're thinking full size unit? Not a portable one?
I guess a portable one would have more appeal.
Nap.
Hi Nap,
Yes I was thinking of a quality piece that could be added to an existing system rather than an independent unit.
james
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Hi Nap,
Yes I was thinking of a quality piece that could be added to an existing system rather than an independent unit.
james
Well, I already have a 4B near my preamp, and since it's there I would play the speakers instead of the headphones....
How about smaller thing that you could also take with you in the office or while traveling/commuting?
Nap.
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How about smaller thing that you could also take with you in the office or while traveling/commuting?
Nap.
Nap
This is what ya need http://www.bestbuy.ca/en-CA/category/mp3-players/22573.aspx :P
Larry
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Balanced XLR ... connects to the Sennheiser HD 800 Balanced headphones hated by Napalm.
Naahh... I don't hate them... I only hate unpleasant compulsory stuff like taxes....
Nap. :D
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Nap
This is what ya need http://www.bestbuy.ca/en-CA/category/mp3-players/22573.aspx :P
Larry
Thank you, for a really light setup I have these:
(http://)
(http://)
(Shock and horror! NAPALM HAZ SENHEIZR!)
(they work better without the ear pads lol)
Now when James said "amplifier" I was thinking full size big mofo headphones.
Nap.
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James,
It seems like a very good idea to have two different power supply options, so the unit can be used by folk who don't own BP25/26. Also, BP25/26 owners would benefit from powering the headphone unit via MPS2. As there are more and more volk who listen only quality source via top headphones today (no amp and speakers), I believe the unit could have positive effect on BDA-1 sale, which is great for you.
Personally, I would like to have more serious headphone amp to drive my Grado RS-1 and as you are company which knows how things should be amplified, I would be very interested to own BHA-1 or whatever you call it.. :)
Best,
oz.
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Thank you, for a really light setup I have these:
(http://)
(http://)
(Shock and horror! NAPALM HAZ SENHEIZR!)
(they work better without the ear pads lol)
Now when James said "amplifier" I was thinking full size big mofo headphones.
Nap.
I was having a good day until someone mentioned taxes.
Here's an option for portable headphone amps that will drive bigger headphones:
http://www.headphone.com/headphone-amps/amplifiers.php
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I was having a good day until someone mentioned taxes.
Here's an option for portable headphone amps that will drive bigger headphones:
http://www.headphone.com/headphone-amps/amplifiers.php
James, can you make it the size/shape of a BR-2?
Nap.
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Napalm,
this might suit your military taste... :)
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=42864)
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May I suggest a pair of Skullcandy Skullcrushers and a ButtKicker LFE installed under your chair?
Nap. :no_see:
You may. In fact I would expect no less from you than a suggestion like that, Nap. :lol:
But let's face it- nothing says " cavernous bass " like Dr. Dre Beats. ( Or would it be "Beatz",yo ) Manufactured by Monster so you know it's got to be good ! :roll:
D.
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Hi Nap,
Yes I was thinking of a quality piece that could be added to an existing system rather than an independent unit.
james
James: I like the idea of a unit which I can run out of the tape loop on my existing preamp. I could probably live without it being tied to an MPS2 because there's a limit to what I would want to invest in a head amp when there are already a lot of nice units out there which would run a lot less $ than your proposed head amp/power suppy combo. The idea of devoting a full rack space to a head amp also would dampen my enthusiasm a fair bit, I'm afraid. I understand why you'd want to go full-size from the point of view of standardization but a head amp with a 17" or 19" faceplate and accompanying footprint would certainly set you apart from the competition in the head amp market and not necessarily in a good way IMHO. Just sayin'... :dunno:
D.
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James: I like the idea of a unit which I can run out of the tape loop on my existing preamp. I could probably live without it being tied to an MPS2 because there's a limit to what I would want to invest in a head amp when there are already a lot of nice units out there which would run a lot less $ than your proposed head amp/power suppy combo. The idea of devoting a full rack space to a head amp also would dampen my enthusiasm a fair bit, I'm afraid. I understand why you'd want to go full-size from the point of view of standardization but a head amp with a 17" or 19" faceplate and accompanying footprint would certainly set you apart from the competition in the head amp market and not necessarily in a good way IMHO. Just sayin'... :dunno:
D.
Hi Dog,
At this point the BHA would only have to be about 4 inches wide by 6 deep and about 2 inches high. I was thinking of a small faceplate that would match the BP-26/MPS2 look?
james
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Hi Dog,
At this point the BHA would only have to be about 4 inches wide by 6 deep and about 2 inches high. I was thinking of a small faceplate that would match the BP-26/MPS2 look?
james
Now you're talkin' ! :thumb:
D.
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Napalm,
this might suit your military taste... :)
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=42864)
Must be from Saddam's cache 8)
(http://)
nap.
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There is a GROWING trend for headphones or HeadFI :D even out here in Asia~! I think the good old tube and vinyl is getting "fashionable" too :eyebrows:
James will it look like this?
(http://)
(http://)
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There is a GROWING trend for headphones or HeadFI :D even out here in Asia~! I think the good old tube and vinyl is getting "fashionable" too :eyebrows:
James will it look like this?
(http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?
action=gallery;sa=view;id=55254)
(http://)
I was thinking soup can :D
James
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I was thinking soup can :D
James
I'd save those for speakers:
(http://)
Nap. :green:
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James, how about offering upgrades on the BP 26 headphone amplification section so folks can save some space on the rack?? :)
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James, how about offering upgrades on the BP 26 headphone amplification section so folks can save some space on the rack?? :)
I don't think it's doable because it's a completely different circuit and op amp we are going to use.
james
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I'd suggest having the DAC card like in the B100 as an option, James. I see this on a lot of the most recent ones, like Red Wine Audio's headphone amp. I wouldn't have it as standard,but I think having the option would be a huge plus. I'm not in the market for a dedicated haedphone amp, so take that as you will.
I think the biggest factor is it's ability to drive any headphone out there.
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From Engineering - Headphone amp project so far:
Bryston Headphone Amplifier (BHA-1)
Features:
1)Battery operation – 2 rechargeable 9v lithium LiFePO4 batteries
2)External power option via MPS-2 power supply.*
3)Volume control combined with power switch – blue led ‘on’ indicator.
4)OPA2604 op amp. Ultra low Thd + noise. (<.001%)
5)Parallel op amp outputs – 3 per channel.
6)14dB gain
7)Perfect for headphones 16 ohms or higher.
8)Cross feed circuit – bypass - in out – amber Led indicator.
9)Cross feed level variable – full in - to – 20dB.
10)Gold connectors – RCA inputs - XLR out option.
11)50k input impedance
12)Rugged construction
13)Dimensions – 2” high x 4” wide x 6” deep.
* Higher output level with BMP2 supply. -
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...BMP-2? :scratch:
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...BMP-2? :scratch:
Bryston Microphone Preamp - no longer produced.
james
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From Engineering - Headphone amp project so far:
Bryston Headphone Amplifier (BHA-1)
Features:
1)Battery operation – 2 rechargeable 9v lithium LiFePO4 batteries
2)External power option via BMP2 power supply.*
3)Volume control combined with power switch – blue led ‘on’ indicator.
4)OPA2604 op amp. Ultra low Thd + noise. (<.001%)
5)Parallel op amp outputs – 3 per channel.
6)14dB gain
7)Perfect for headphones 16 ohms or higher.
8)Cross feed circuit – bypass - in out – amber Led indicator.
9)Cross feed level variable – full in - to – 20dB.
10)Gold connectors – RCA inputs - XLR out option.
11)50k input impedance
12)Rugged construction
13)Dimensions – 2” high x 4” wide x 6” deep.
* Higher output level with BMP2 supply. -
W00T no USB headphones? :lol:
And what happened to the tone controls? :wink:
Nap.
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Bryston Microphone Preamp - no longer produced.
james
Ya, I know what you mean. In the specs you really mean MPS-2.
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Bryston should just offer the NAP-1.
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Ya, I know what you mean. In the specs you really mean MPS-2.
Thanks - missed that :thumb:
james
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James : What do your engineers estimate to be the expected useable time on a charge using the battery option? IMO tying this unit to the MPS-2 basically restricts your target market to end-users who either use Bryston pre-amps ( not that there's anything wrong with that but there's lots of us who use Bryston amps and sources but have gone another way for pre-amps ) or are unwilling to make what I'm sure would be a very considerable investment in headphone listening for the amp and power supply combo. The MPS-2 is what- $1500 on it's own, no? :scratch:
D.
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James : What do your engineers estimate to be the expected useable time on a charge using the battery option? IMO tying this unit to the MPS-2 basically restricts your target market to end-users who either use Bryston pre-amps ( not that there's anything wrong with that but there's lots of us who use Bryston amps and sources but have gone another way for pre-amps ) or are willing to make what I'm sure would be a very considerable investment in headphone listening for the amp and power supply combo. The MPS-2 is what- $1500 on it's own, no? :scratch:
D.
Hi - yes the intent was the ability to use it with the MPS-2 for our customers that already had an MPS-2 if they wished. The battery power life between recharges would vary depending on the impedance of the phones but somewhere between 10 hours and 30 hours or more.
james
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For headphone related stuff, this is a great site for info http://www.headphone.com/
For portable use, maybe a Ray Samuels design will do the trick http://www.raysamuelsaudio.com/#
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Hi folks
A number of dealers have asked me about doing a very high quality headphone interface given the large number of young folks who listen on headphones these days.
Any input appreciated :)
james
James,
what's so wrong with the headphone input of the 26 preamplifier...now that you seriously think about a separate unit?
what's the difference?
al.
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James,
what's so wrong with the headphone input of the 26 preamplifier...now that you seriously think about a separate unit?
what's the difference?
al.
Low impedance phones need more current than the BP26 can supply because your just using the gain section of the preamp to drive the phones.
Also using batteries means maximum signal to noise ratios.
james
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I like the headphone out from my Bp-26 fairly well with my Sennheiser HD800s. I also own a $250 LilDotII, a several thousand $$ Singlepower (yes it is one of the brand that explodes and has killed many, many people along with maiming/blinding thousands.. at least that is the thinking of some guy over on headFi, I LOVE the notoriety, except mine is really well made.) with a pile of tubes and socket converters for another pile of tubes,(Used paid $1,000) a Rudistor mkII $2K used for $1250. A Tadac with the tubeyness knob $500 used.. So I have headphone amps....
What is going to get me to buy the Bryston one? (I am trying to have some idea why it would be special?)
And what is the target retail? for a Bryston headphone amp?
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How about a BP-7 and BP-27 with improved headphones amplification?
And since we're at it..... pls add TONE CONTROLS too!!!! :green:
Nap.
:tempted:
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:banana piano:
TONE CONTROLS YEAH
:weights:
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From Engineering - Headphone amp project so far:
Bryston Headphone Amplifier (BHA-1)
Features:
1)Battery operation – 2 rechargeable 9v lithium LiFePO4 batteries
2)External power option via MPS-2 power supply.*
3)Volume control combined with power switch – blue led ‘on’ indicator.
4)OPA2604 op amp. Ultra low Thd + noise. (<.001%)
5)Parallel op amp outputs – 3 per channel.
6)14dB gain
7)Perfect for headphones 16 ohms or higher.
8)Cross feed circuit – bypass - in out – amber Led indicator.
9)Cross feed level variable – full in - to – 20dB.
10)Gold connectors – RCA inputs - XLR out option.
11)50k input impedance
12)Rugged construction
13)Dimensions – 2” high x 4” wide x 6” deep.
* Higher output level with BMP2 supply. -
It's silly, but you may have a marketing problem if you're using op-amps. There are a lot of high end headphone amps on the market now, and generally people seem to insist at the high end that everything's discrete. Even at the low end of the market, people seem to gravitate towards discrete designs (and are willing to pay more for them). It may not make sense from an engineering perspective, depending on your viewpoint, but it will probably hamper sales.
Also, Bryston is known for such great discrete designs... why switch to op-amps for this one product?
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+1 :scratch:
D.
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It's silly, but you may have a marketing problem if you're using op-amps. There are a lot of high end headphone amps on the market now, and generally people seem to insist at the high end that everything's discrete. Even at the low end of the market, people seem to gravitate towards discrete designs (and are willing to pay more for them). It may not make sense from an engineering perspective, depending on your viewpoint, but it will probably hamper sales.
Also, Bryston is known for such great discrete designs... why switch to op-amps for this one product?
Hi Watson,
Thanks for the feedback - the idea with this headphone interface unit using OP amps/batteries etc. is (1) portability, (2) superb signal to noise ratios and (3) long term battery power. Also it is one terrific OP amp :thumb:
We will probably build a second unit which will have a more conventional approach with discrete circuits and built in power supply etc. later on.
james
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Thanks for the feedback - the idea with this headphone interface unit using OP amps/batteries etc. is
(1) portability,
I can't see how a full sized box could fit in my pocket. Surprise me, James. Maybe it's a folding one?
OTOH we may build our own and mod it to no end:
http://www.hifidiyshop.com/opa2604lm1875-amplifier-board_p248.html (http://www.hifidiyshop.com/opa2604lm1875-amplifier-board_p248.html)
Nap.
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I can't see how a full sized box could fit in my pocket. Surprise me, James. Maybe it's a folding one?
OTOH we may build our own and mod it to no end:
http://www.hifidiyshop.com/opa2604lm1875-amplifier-board_p248.html (http://www.hifidiyshop.com/opa2604lm1875-amplifier-board_p248.html)
Nap.
Sure feel free Nap :D
james
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Sure feel free Nap :D
james
With TONE CONTROLS! Yehaaaa!
:tempted:
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This would be great. I asked this question 3 years ago about Bryston manufacturing a high-end headphone amplifier. Please see below.
Quote from: mkaiser on 27 Dec 2007, 12:12 AM
Hi James and all,
Hope everyone had a great Christmas and are gearing up for the New Year.
I looked back in the Topics from a few years ago and noticed there was some people inquiring about Bryston manufacturing a high end headphone amp and possibly a DVD player. James, has there been any more talk at Bryston to take a look into this. I would love to continue the Bryston Signature sound from the source (DVD player?) to speaker/headphone.
Just thought i would bring up an old posting and see if there is any news on it.
Thanks,
Mark
Hi Mark,
No we have not looked at any headphone amp projects. We have been busy with other projects and a dedicated stereo headphone amp would have a very small market potential.
The DVD is a long way off because until the new High-Def audio and video formats get setted there is no point in looking at a DVD player.
james
I hope this idea is for real. This way i would have an all Bryston rig. Nice to hear that perhaps the market for headphones/amps has improved.
PS include balanced interconnect input on rear and if possible the front as i drive fully balanced Sennheiser HD 800's. You would not believe how good balanced headphones sound. :thumb:
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Well, I already have a 4B near my preamp, and since it's there I would play the speakers instead of the headphones....
How about smaller thing that you could also take with you in the office or while traveling/commuting?
Nap.
Nap, your talking to the wrong company for toyish portable devices. A portable headphone player will never fly with Bryston.
Bryston is serious about sound reproduction. Perhaps surf for a low/mid fi manufacturer for the device you are looking for. Grahm Slee makes a nice portable headphone player...i think it's called the Voyageur or something along those lines.
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I can actually feel the vibration of the earth as Nap's response grows nearer... :peek:
D.
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We will probably build a second unit which will have a more conventional approach with discrete circuits and built in power supply etc. later on.
james
James,
Now i'm even more excited for this one... this will be more what i'm looking for.
Also, if you down the road make this second unit please make the DAC section as optional.
Can hardly wait.... cheers!
Mark
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Nap, your talking to the wrong company for toyish portable devices. A portable headphone player will never fly with Bryston.
Bryston is serious about sound reproduction.
Then how comes the headphone output of the BP-26 (the top of the line in Bryston preamps and quite expensive by any standards) needs to be supplanted by an external unit?
And we're proposed nothing less than an opamp as the "better" way?
Any way I'm looking at it the only rational things would be:
1) fix the output in the BP-6 and BP-26 for the people using headphones at home
2) do a portable box for those that want to enjoy headphones on the go
Nap.
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We will probably build a second unit which will have a more conventional approach with discrete circuits and built in power supply etc. later on.
james
James: When do you see the two versions of the BHA going to market?
D.
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Hi James!
A Bryston Headphone Interface should be at least as good as this one (999 €):
(http://europe.beyerdynamic.com/shop/media/catalog/product/cache/5/image/900x/e5c3f25dbe2a3021345b55270d5894a1/a/1/a1_2010_1.jpg)
Input impedance. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .50 kΩ
Maximum amplification. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 18 dB
Frequency response. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 1 Hz - 100 kHz (-1 dB)
T.H.D.. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 0.001% at 170 mW / 250 Ω
Channel separation . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . > 89 dB
Output power. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 100 mW / 600 Ω
170 mW / 250 Ω
150 mW / 30 Ω
Unweighted signal-to-noise ratio. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . > 100 dB
Output impedances. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .Line Out (depending on the connected device),
100 Ω headphone output
Power consumption. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .< 15 W via internal, controlled power pack
Audio connections. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Headphone socket, 1 Line output,
2 Audio inputs (gold-plated RCA sockets)
Hand built with discrete electronic components.
I've heard this device several times together with a Beyerdynamic T1 and it was simply phenomenal! It's like if there's only music - all technology steps back and let you enjoy the pure sound. Really amazing.
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James: When do you see the two versions of the BHA going to market?
D.
Hi Diamond,
I will be auditioning the first version next week and then I would say a couple of months - I have about 10 different headphones on the way to audition. The next version a few months after that :D
james
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I have about 10 different headphones on the way to audition.
Cool, and you can audition up to 8 of them at a time:
(http://)
Let us know which you liked most.
Nap. :green:
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And don't forget to take pics. We all love headphones pics here.
(http://)
Nap. :P
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For James:
http://www.headphonereviews.org/headphone/AKG/K701
This to keep him inspired so he doesn't come up with a bass-shy amp.
Nap. :green:
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Napalm,
Wherever do you find such well-balanced images ? :lol:
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those women are 'up to something' ......
besides headphones... :nono:
Or, they are testing the cord for 'tooth mark resistance' :wink:
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Napalm,
Wherever do you find such well-balanced images ? :lol:
Lol. I'm a sucker for headphones. And pussies:
(http://)
Nap. :green:
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Will it drive these?
http://www.stax.co.jp/Export/SR007mk2.html
Thanks
-
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=45738)
james
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(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=45738)
james
Cool, when and how much?
Or I'll borrow the top left one for evaluation!
Robert
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(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=45763)
james
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Oh,sure, James... :duh: right after I blow all my $$$ on cables ( but OMG what cables ! :o)...
D.D.
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(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=45763)
james
How much do they cost James?
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Hi
Not sure yet as we are still listening and making changes :thumb:
James
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James, you got a close up picture of its front and back?? Btw, it looks cool :thumb:
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Hi James
Couple questions
What software is used to create and render the models and digital images shown
Will the LEDs on the actual prototype/production versions appear white when off as on other Bryston components
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Hi James
Couple questions
What software is used to create and render the models and digital images shown
Will the LEDs on the actual prototype/production versions appear white when off as on other Bryston components
Don’t let the anti-gravity crystal in each unit throw you off, with Brytons record in reducing noise levels it ‘s the final frontier in reducing mechanically transferred vibrations.
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=45773)
Robert
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James : Are these going to have volume remotely controllable via the BR2? That way I wouldn't have to get up to hear what my wife is shouting at me :D
D.D.
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James : Are these going to have volume remotely controllable via the BR2? That way I wouldn't have to get up to hear what my wife is shouting at me :D
D.D.
Hi DD
No remote volume (most headphone cables are only a few feet long) and I am thinking a matching power supply for those that do not have an MPS2 power supply.
James
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As opposed to on-board ? Would that do a lot to drive up the cost ?
D.D.
Yes but it provides a better noise figure and for those that already have an MPS2 it is actually less expensive.
James
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Also thinking about a fully balanced differential output for driving those phones that will allow that connection.
James
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Looking forward to it.
Be sure to send a sample to Michael Fremer.
With one of these: :kiss:
:)
D.D.
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One of the great things about a quality headphone system is you can listen to a recording on your speakers and then your headphones and really hear a direct A-B comparison between the speaker/room interface and the headphones :thumb: which will provide excellent input into how the room influences the sound.
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I am thinking a matching power supply for those that do not have an MPS2 power supply.
James
James, will there be a performance differentiation this 'matching power supply' unit (external?) as compared to the MPS2?
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James, will there be a performance differentiation this 'matching power supply' unit (external?) as compared to the MPS2?
No difference.
James
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Hi James,
I am excited to hear about the coming Bryston headphone amps. I have been a headphone enthusiast for a few years now.
In the last few years, a company by the name of “Head-direct/Hifiman” (http://www.head-direct.com/) has emerged from seemingly nowhere to garner quite a following for its highly acclaimed products catering to the portable audio crowd as well as serious headphone users. In particular, their “HE-6” Orthodynamic headphones have been making waves on www.head-fi.org with some users preferring them to flagship models from established headphone makers such as Stax (SR-007 Omega 2), Sennheiser (HD800), Beyerdynamics (T1), AKG (701/702) & Grados (PS-1000) & Ultrasone. However, these "HE-6" headphones are notoriously difficult to drive. Some experienced and serious headphone users are (subjectively) of the opinion that even some very notable high-end headphone amplifiers do not have enough power to drive them optimally. These users are resorting to driving them out of the speaker terminals of amplifiers (of course we are not talking about 28B’s!). I do not know how true the comments are as I have not heard the "HE-6" myself (but am considering a pair sometime). This search will yield many references to it: http://www.head-fi.org/search.php?search=HE6.
I know that you are testing several high-end headphones with the prototype Bryston headphone amp. If it’s not too late and if you think it’s worth the effort, could you lay your hands on a pair of “HE-6” and run some tests? Thank you
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Hi James,
I am excited to hear about the coming Bryston headphone amps. I have been a headphone enthusiast for a few years now.
In the last few years, a company by the name of “Head-direct/Hifiman” (http://www.head-direct.com/) has emerged from seemingly nowhere to garner quite a following for its highly acclaimed products catering to the portable audio crowd as well as serious headphone users. In particular, their “HE-6” Orthodynamic headphones have been making waves on www.head-fi.org with some users preferring them to flagship models from established headphone makers such as Stax (SR-007 Omega 2), Sennheiser (HD800), Beyerdynamics (T1), AKG (701/702) & Grados (PS-1000) & Ultrasone. However, these "HE-6" headphones are notoriously difficult to drive. Some experienced and serious headphone users are (subjectively) of the opinion that even some very notable high-end headphone amplifiers do not have enough power to drive them optimally. These users are resorting to driving them out of the speaker terminals of amplifiers (of course we are not talking about 28B’s!). I do not know how true the comments are as I have not heard the "HE-6" myself (but am considering a pair sometime). This search will yield many references to it: http://www.head-fi.org/search.php?search=HE6.
I know that you are testing several high-end headphones with the prototype Bryston headphone amp. If it’s not too late and if you think it’s worth the effort, could you lay your hands on a pair of “HE-6” and run some tests? Thank you
Hi
Ok thanks - I will check it out.
James
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One of the great things about a quality headphone system is you can listen to a recording on your speakers and then your headphones and really hear a direct A-B comparison between the speaker/room interface and the headphones :thumb: which will provide excellent input into how the room influences the sound.
Right on! That's one of the things I use my AKG K702s for. Whenever I want to blame my equipment for some failing, I whip out the cans to see what's really on the disc. Great for A/B comparisons.
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Hi James,
I am excited to hear about the coming Bryston headphone amps. I have been a headphone enthusiast for a few years now.
In the last few years, a company by the name of “Head-direct/Hifiman” (http://www.head-direct.com/) has emerged from seemingly nowhere to garner quite a following for its highly acclaimed products catering to the portable audio crowd as well as serious headphone users. In particular, their “HE-6” Orthodynamic headphones have been making waves on www.head-fi.org with some users preferring them to flagship models from established headphone makers such as Stax (SR-007 Omega 2), Sennheiser (HD800), Beyerdynamics (T1), AKG (701/702) & Grados (PS-1000) & Ultrasone. However, these "HE-6" headphones are notoriously difficult to drive. Some experienced and serious headphone users are (subjectively) of the opinion that even some very notable high-end headphone amplifiers do not have enough power to drive them optimally. These users are resorting to driving them out of the speaker terminals of amplifiers (of course we are not talking about 28B’s!). I do not know how true the comments are as I have not heard the "HE-6" myself (but am considering a pair sometime). This search will yield many references to it: http://www.head-fi.org/search.php?search=HE6.
I know that you are testing several high-end headphones with the prototype Bryston headphone amp. If it’s not too late and if you think it’s worth the effort, could you lay your hands on a pair of “HE-6” and run some tests? Thank you
Hi myview
Ordered a pair to try - boy the efficiency is really really low.
James
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Hi myview
Ordered a pair to try - boy the efficiency is really really low.
James
Let us know what you think of them james.
What do you normally use?
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Let us know what you think of them james.
What do you normally use?
Hi Terry
I have a pair of Grados and AKG's.
James
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I have the AKG 701's Fabulous phones but , yes, inefficient. I have to crank the preamp to about 2 o'clock for a reasonable volume level. Tell me this will be better with the new phone unit. :fishing:
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I have the AKG 701's Fabulous phones but , yes, inefficient. I have to crank the preamp to about 2 o'clock for a reasonable volume level. Tell me this will be better with the new phone unit. :fishing:
Yes lots of gain :thumb:
james
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I have the AKG 701's Fabulous phones but , yes, inefficient. I have to crank the preamp to about 2 o'clock for a reasonable volume level. Tell me this will be better with the new phone unit. :fishing:
Same here with the 701s and I also have the K501s which are even more inefficient, but the best part is when someone disengages the phones without reducing the volume!!!!!
Which is why I still use an external head-amp.
Yes lots of gain :thumb:
james
Excellent, and lots of current? Grados can be powered by about anything to reach max volume but really like lots of current to bring out the best in them.
Robert
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Hi DD
.......and I am thinking a matching power supply for those that do not have an MPS2 power supply.
James
Good idea as I would believe the largest audience would be those without an adequate stereo system to start with as a lot of head-fi users are mostly desktop oriented because they lack the space but still want to hear their music as best as possible.
Myself, I was just currently thinking of moving my head-amp behind the listening position at the back of the room (15 feet from the BP25) where my B60 plays second fiddle running surrounds and some headphone listening (the B60 needs to be cranked up to 3 o'clock, a little higher than the BP25).
Robert
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Thankyou James,............and, yeh, I'm using the BP 25 as well ( at 2 o'clock) :bowdown:
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Hi James,
Thank you. Let us know how it goes.
Hi myview
Ordered a pair to try - boy the efficiency is really really low.
James
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I use some Sony Studio monitor pros HP's 7506,don't know how ificiant they are,I do know they handle
percussion very well(especially kick drum ect.
I had a set of grados(DJ type),kept blowing them on the lowend,tried out the Sony's and all is well.
Usually I have them going to a small board with a CDP connected and also my Roland TD-20 expanded drum brain.
The highs are greay thru the phones and especially the low end.
I forget the price,nothing worse for me than spending a grand and blow the lowend out of the HP's,
NO FUN :lol: :o.
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Version 2 - rear shot of headphone amp and power supply:
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=45856)
james
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Version 2 Front view:
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=45860)
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MORE PLEASE :).
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Version 2 Front view:
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=45860)
Now your talking, looks like all the bases are covered!
My Dyns are starting to get jealous.
Robert
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MORE PLEASE :).
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=45870)
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Or as Laundrew expressed elsewhere.
:notworthy: :notworthy: :notworthy: :notworthy: :notworthy:
:notworthy: :notworthy: :notworthy: :notworthy: :notworthy:
:notworthy: :notworthy: :notworthy: :notworthy: :notworthy:
:notworthy: :notworthy: :notworthy: :notworthy: :notworthy:
:notworthy: :notworthy: :notworthy: :notworthy: :notworthy:
:notworthy: :notworthy: :notworthy::notworthy: :notworthy:
:notworthy: :notworthy: :notworthy: :notworthy: :notworthy:
:notworthy: :notworthy: :notworthy: :notworthy: :notworthy:
:notworthy: :notworthy: :notworthy: :notworthy:
:notworthy: :notworthy: :notworthy: :notworthy: :notworthy:
:notworthy: :notworthy: :notworthy: :notworthy: :notworthy:
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Headphone AMP - now in development:
Fully discrete Class A outputs and Independent power supply :thumb:
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=46078)
james
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What's the idea of the XLR type connector on the right?
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What's the idea of the XLR type connector on the right?
Hi Terry,
Some hi-end headphones offer Balanced connections.
james
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Forgive me if I'm wrong, but wouldn't the amp require two XLR output jacks for balanced headphones? Every balanced amp I've seen was configured this way.
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Forgive me if I'm wrong, but wouldn't the amp require two XLR output jacks for balanced headphones? Every balanced amp I've seen was configured this way.
Hi Chris,
In the case of headphones it is a 4 wire connection with no common ground - so 2 wires per headphone cup.
james
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Hi Chris,
In the case of headphones it is a 4 wire connection with no common ground - so 2 wires per headphone cup.
james
PS - I just realized Chris that you may be thinking this is an output to an amplifier - it is the output to the headphones.
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Forgive me if I'm wrong, but wouldn't the amp require two XLR output jacks for balanced headphones? Every balanced amp I've seen was configured this way.
I'm with you Chris, which is why I was confused.
See here...
http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews/balancedheadphones/one.html
an more here...
http://www.headphone.com/accessories/cables/cardas-balanced-headphone-cable-for-hd650-20ft.php
Deffo two XLRs
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Hi Chris,
In the case of headphones it is a 4 wire connection with no common ground - so 2 wires per headphone cup.
james
If your phones are dual xlr you'll need one of these.
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=46083)
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Hi James
Any chance of implementing a small balance control? (we want it all you know)
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=46085)
Robert
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Hi James,
The new unit looks great. Will Bryston manufacture it's own balanced cable?
I have to agree with some of the others that i have never seen a head amp with one balanced input on the front plate.
When you design the other larger head amp later on this year do you think that one will have dual plugs on the front flat to accept all formats of balanced cables?
Iam only asking because my Sennheiser HD800 only take the dual plug.
Thanks,
Mark
Hi Mark,
Do you mean a Balanced Y connector to use with the BHA-1?
james
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James
The units shown in the images do not show 'Bryston'
Will this be engraved or silk screened on production units
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James
The units shown in the images do not show 'Bryston'
Will this be engraved or silk screened on production units
Hi nikon
We will probably do the inserts like on the preamp.
james
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Yeah, I'm aware that the jack is for headphones, I just can't recall ever seeing a headphone amplifier with only one XLR output jack. Every pair of balanced headphones I've seen had two XLRs. I have a pair of AKG K702s that are not balanced, so it's neither here nor there to me, for now. I just found it odd seeing a lone XLR jack like that...
I can't see a real need for a balance control, personally. This definitely wouldn't be a feature on my headphone amp wish list. Balance control for a loudspeaker set-up makes more sense, given that speakers are often set up in asymmetrical rooms and such.
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Hi James,
Many high-end headphone owners have their headphones terminated “balanced” with 2 x 3-pin XLR. “Balanced” with 1 x 4-pin XLR is slightly less common but not rare. Getting an adaptor from 2 x 3-pin to 1 x 4-pin and vice versa is not difficult but some paranoid people are wary of using any form of adaptor for fear of degradation of sound.
As far as I know, almost all desktop/home headphone amps offer single-ended outputs. Quite a few of the better ones offer “2 x 3-pin XLR” + “1 single-ended” outputs. The occasional one will offer “2 x 3-pin XLR” + “1 x 4-pin XLR” + “1 single-ended”. If you’d like to see a list of amplifiers offering the different options, I will be happy to E-mail it to you.
I think the Bryston headphone amp should offer at least “2 x 3-pin XLR” (since it’s very common) + “1 single-ended output”. If it can offer an additional “1 x 4-pin XLR”, it will be a big bonus. What do others think?
I am eagerly awaiting pictures of more proto-types of the Bryston headphone amp!
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Yeah, I'm aware that the jack is for headphones, I just can't recall ever seeing a headphone amplifier with only one XLR output jack. Every pair of balanced headphones I've seen had two XLRs. I have a pair of AKG K702s that are not balanced, so it's neither here nor there to me, for now. I just found it odd seeing a lone XLR jack like that...
I can't see a real need for a balance control, personally. This definitely wouldn't be a feature on my headphone amp wish list. Balance control for a loudspeaker set-up makes more sense, given that speakers are often set up in asymmetrical rooms and such.
Hi Chris
Not everyone has perfect hearing in both ears or they may be affected by seasonal allergies diminishing hearing in one ear, nor are all recordings properly balanced between left and right.
Headphone amps are also used for professional monitoring in the absence of speakers and a balance control is the easiest way to check noise and levels independently for each channel.
Using dual xlr connectors came about a few years ago from those experimenting by driving their phones directly from pre-amps or processors with balanced outputs, cable manufactures soon followed, IMHO a single five pin jack would be a cleaner and more compact solution, but I guess Bryston could implement dual xlr before final production as one less adapter would be better sonically.
Robert
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Hi Chris
Not everyone has perfect hearing in both ears or they may be affected by seasonal allergies diminishing hearing in one ear, nor are all recordings properly balanced between left and right.
Headphone amps are also used for professional monitoring in the absence of speakers and a balance control is the easiest way to check noise and levels independently for each channel.
Using dual xlr connectors came about a few years ago from those experimenting by driving their phones directly from pre-amps or processors with balanced outputs, cable manufactures soon followed, IMHO a single five pin jack would be a cleaner and more compact solution, but I guess Bryston could implement dual xlr before final production as one less adapter would be better sonically.
Robert
Point taken re: balance control. I can only speak for myself when I say it's not a feature I require.
I agree that a single XLR jack would be cleaner and more compact. It's just a matter of 'swimming upstream' against what's common in the marketplace, I guess. If Bryston was going to sell the appropriate cables, that'd be helpful. It would be nice if there was a single industry standard in this regard.
What do you guys think of the XLR & 1/4" combo jacks, like this Neutrik for example?
(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/31iJK8iJtML._SL160_SS150_.jpg)
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New Pic
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=46213)
james
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Hi James,
Interesting product and one that I might purchase once it becomes available. A couple of quick questions:
1) Can BHI be used with the MPS2 power supply or does it require the purchase of the new power supply?
2) Any idea on what the price range will be?
Cheers,
John
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Hi James,
Interesting product and one that I might purchase once it becomes available. A couple of quick questions:
1) Can BHI be used with the MPS2 power supply or does it require the purchase of the new power supply?
2) Any idea on what the price range will be?
Cheers,
John
Hi John
Yes the MPS 2 could be used
Not sure on pricing yet - I am hoping around $1000
James
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Hi James
Is the 1000 approx. price for the preamp unit only or for both preamp and power supply
If power supply is separate what would approx. price :)
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Hi James
Is the 1000 approx. price for the preamp unit only or for both preamp and power supply
If power supply is separate what would approx. price :)
Change of plans - we are looking at expanding on the idea and having a single full size chassis that can accept an internal power supply or use the MPS-2 as well.
Also based on some of the suggestions we will have 3 XLR connections - 2 will be 3 Pin and 1- will be 4 pin.
james
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Excellent idea James, now there'll room for a balance control :D and dual headphone jacks, not everyone listens alone.
Also it'll be stack-able with the rest of the gear.
Robert
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Change of plans - we are looking at expanding on the idea and having a single full size chassis that can accept an internal power supply or use the MPS-2 as well.
Also based on some of the suggestions we will have 3 XLR connections - 2 will be 3 Pin and 1- will be 4 pin.
james
Good idea James, I knew you'd get there in the end :)
I guessed you coudn't meet expectations as you'd run out of front panel space.
Regarding a balance control, what about a dual gang volume control?
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I like the single chassis with internal supply idea . :thumb:
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Change of plans - we are looking at expanding on the idea and having a single full size chassis that can accept an internal power supply or use the MPS-2 as well.
Also based on some of the suggestions we will have 3 XLR connections - 2 will be 3 Pin and 1- will be 4 pin.
james
James, will this unit be the size of the BP6?
Mark
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James, will this unit be the size of the BP6?
Mark
Hi Mark,
Still looking at that - do you like the idea of matching a chassis size that we currently use?
james
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Hi James,
Yes, i think most people interested in a component like this would appreciate it fitting in with the rest of their gear and having it match. You could offer 17" and 19" faceplate option.
Mark
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do you like the idea of matching a chassis size that we currently use?
james
Hi James,
Matching chassis size gets a thumbs up from me, but with the imminent headphone amp and BDP-1 HDD enclosure you'd better think about making a Bryston Step ladder so I can reach my TT :)
A real newbie question here, news of the headphone amp as got me looking at getting either a pair of Sennheiser HD800's or the Grado GS1000I's, can I ask what improvements I'll get by using the headphone amp compared to just using the headphone socket on my BP26.
Thanks.
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Hi James,
Matching chassis size gets a thumbs up from me, but with the imminent headphone amp and BDP-1 HDD enclosure you'd better think about making a Bryston Step ladder so I can reach my TT :)
A real newbie question here, news of the headphone amp as got me looking at getting either a pair of Sennheiser HD800's or the Grado GS1000I's, can I ask what improvements I'll get by using the headphone amp compared to just using the headphone socket on my BP26.
Thanks.
Hi Vipers,
Mainly drive capability.
james
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I have a pair of Grados and AKG's.
James
Hi James,
In readiness for your headphone amp I've been researching headphones and seem to heading towards either the Grado GS1000i's or PS1000's, just wondering what model Grado's you have?
Any nearer a release date yet for the amp?
Thanks.
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Hi James,
In readiness for your headphone amp I've been researching headphones and seem to heading towards either the Grado GS1000i's or PS1000's, just wondering what model Grado's you have?
Any nearer a release date yet for the amp?
Thanks.
Hi vipers,
I have the GS1000 and the SR125's
james
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Hi vipers,
I have the GS1000 and the SR125's
james
Thanks James, I take it you are happy with the GS1000's? and would recommend them, have you tried them on the Bryston headphone amp yet?
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Hi James,
You said you ordered the HE-6 headphones a week or so ago.
Have they arrived yet and in which case, have you tried them with your new headphone amp?
Terry
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Hi James,
You said you ordered the HE-6 headphones a week or so ago.
Have they arrived yet and in which case, have you tried them with your new headphone amp?
Terry
Hi Terry,
No they have not arrived yet.
james
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Hi Terry,
No they have not arrived yet.
james
There was a review of them elsewhere.
They stated that the imaging was exception with a good "out-of-head" soundstage.
The deep bass was a bit lacking but the rest of the qualities made up for that.
They needed >> 100 hours of run-in and we pretty crappy straight out of the box.
They need quite a bit of driving and one for you James, come with a four pin XLR plug!!!
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new guy here. so if you are going to run a balanced line to a headphone amp are you running single ended to your speakers ? as my bp-26 only has one set of balanced out.by the way i've got a 4-bsst2,bcd-1 and bdac-1 also ,driving martin-logan aerius speakers.i;m looking to upgrade to salk speakers anyone have them in southern ont.
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new guy here. so if you are going to run a balanced line to a headphone amp are you running single ended to your speakers ?
Hi Won Ton On,
You should be using the tape outs, which I guess today should be called "pass-through" or "record-out" for those who have never used a tape deck; going from the pre-outs, balanced or unbalanced, adds an additional variable gain stage which increases the noise level and could overdrive your headphone amp.
Robert
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rob80b well my bp-26 doesn't have balanced tape out either. so how is everyone running balanced to headphone amp.not with a bryston i guess.i'm going to get speakers first then a bdp-1 more than likely.have to wait for the headphone amp and phones till later. thinking about grado gs1000i,ps 1000's or sennhieser 800's maybe a graham slee amp or the bryston
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rob80b well my bp-26 doesn't have balanced tape out either. so how is everyone running balanced to headphone amp.not with a bryston
Potential obstacle if you'd liked to run balanced, I'm currently running unbalanced tape out from my BP25P at the front of the room to a BR60 at the back of the room for headphone listening and surrounds direct from the blu-ray for the rear surrounds, so 2 sets of 25' unbalanced cable without problems, but balanced would be nice if running long cable lengths.
Robert
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rob80b so what other equipment do you have scott
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rob80b so what other equipment do you have scott
Hi Scott
Listed here.
http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?action=gallery;area=browse;album=7227
Robert
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nice...... bryston 4bsst2 ,bp26mc,bcd-1,bdac-1,martin-logan-aerius.nak.zx-9.oracle delphi with linn ittok and supex mc. cartridge (in need of a major update )senn. 580 headphones black diamond racing cones and pits all around,furutech line cond.and power cords and cardas inter and speaker wire,thats what i have here. bryston stuff all new in 2010
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Hi Folks,
Latest pics of the new Headphone interface with a BP26/MPS-2
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=47345)
james
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Looks nice!
Seems the XLRs and the silk screening is swapped.
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Hi James,
Have the HE-6 headphones arrived? Have you tested them?
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Hi James,
Have the HE-6 headphones arrived? Have you tested them?
Yes - they were a little bright sounding at first but are breaking in nicely. Also have the top Grados coming.
james
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Yes - they were a little bright sounding at first but are breaking in nicely. Also have the top Grados coming.
james
The HE6s need a lot of driving, no problems with your Bryston headphone interface?
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The HE6s need a lot of driving, no problems with your Bryston headphone interface?
Hi Terry,
You mean the brightness could be not enough juice from the headphone amp?
james
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Nope, James.
Here's the spec:
Freqency Response: 8 to 65 KHz
Impedence: 50 Ohm
Efficiency: 83.5 DB
Weight: 502 g
You need lots of drive due to the low efficiency (like other orthos eg LCD-2)
At least 2 watts at 50 ohms is good.
What can the Bryston provide?
The brightness is due to lack of run-in.
Terry
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Hi Terry,
You mean the brightness could be not enough juice from the headphone amp?
james
There was a review of them here:
http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews/hifiman2/1.html
They mention how much drive is required.
Basically, they conform to the K1000 standard of 4 pin XLR and low efficiency.
The deep bass was a bit lacking but the rest of the qualities made up for that.
They needed >> 100 hours of run-in and were pretty crappy straight out of the box.
They need quite a bit of driving and one for you James, come with a four pin XLR plug!!!
Can your headamp drive AKG K1000's James?
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There was a review of them here:
http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews/hifiman2/1.html
They mention how much drive is required.
Basically, they conform to the K1000 standard of 4 pin XLR and low efficiency.
The deep bass was a bit lacking but the rest of the qualities made up for that.
They needed >> 100 hours of run-in and were pretty crappy straight out of the box.
They need quite a bit of driving and one for you James, come with a four pin XLR plug!!!
Can your headamp drive AKG K1000's James?
Have not tried the 1000's - what are the specs on them?
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=47292)
james
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Have not tried the 1000's - what are the specs on them?
james
Specifications
Type: Moving coil headphones
Impedance: 120 Ohms
Sensitivity: 74dB for 1mW free field
Frequency Response: 30Hz to 25kHz
Power Requirement : 100mW for 1Pa
Distortion at 400mW: around 100dB
- 2nd harmonic <0.5% 200Hz to 2kHz
<1.0% 100Hz to 200Hz
Power Rating: 1000mW (test tone DIN 45582) corresponds to approx 104dB
Headband: force exerted on 140mm wide head 3.5N (DIN 45580)
Weight: 270g without cord, 370g with cord and connector
Test Conditions: free space
Accessories Supplied: wooden case, 10-foot extension lead.
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Also have the top Grados coming.
james
Loving the new look of the Headphone amp James, really look forward to hearing your thoughts on the Grado's, I take it you are talking the PS1000's, they are on my shortlist :)
Any Idea of a rough release date yet?
Thanks.
-
Loving the new look of the Headphone amp James, really look forward to hearing your thoughts on the Grado's, I take it you are talking the PS1000's, they are on my shortlist :)
Any Idea of a rough release date yet?
Thanks.
Hope about 60 days.
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=47347)
BHA-1 with Internal power supply
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=47346)
BHA-1 with External MPS-2 power supply
james
-
James,
Will there be two versions? With internal PS and without?
Tony
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James,
Will there be two versions? With internal PS and without?
Tony
Hi Tony,
Yes.
james
-
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=47350)
james
-
The head amp looks excellent James. Just as i hoped it would look. Available in 19" face?
Mark
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The head amp looks excellent James. Just as i hoped it would look. Available in 19" face?
Mark
Hi Mark,
I assume so as we have had major interest from the pro studio guys.
james
-
Hope about 60 days.
james
Excellent, the next million dollar question, roughly, How Much James?
It will be interesting when it is ready for release if you can list some of the headphones that you've tested that you feel work particularly well with the BHA-1 as I can't make my mind up what to go for :dunno:
Thanks.
-
Any inside shots?
-
Hi James,
Will the head amp have the option of having an internal DAC? Also can you take a rear shot of the unit.
Thank you,
Mark
-
Hi James,
Will the head amp have the option of having an internal DAC? Also can you take a rear shot of the unit.
Thank you,
Mark
Hi Mark,
No DAC - I will try and get rear pictures for you.
james
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Excellent, the next million dollar question, roughly, How Much James?
It will be interesting when it is ready for release if you can list some of the headphones that you've tested that you feel work particularly well with the BHA-1 as I can't make my mind up what to go for :dunno:
Thanks.
Hi Vipers,
A little to early to say price wise but I am hoping about $1000 list with internal power supply.
james
-
James
What would approx. price be for unit without internal power supply for those with an MPS-2 :o
-
James
What would approx. price be for unit without internal power supply for those with an MPS-2 :o
Hi nikon,
Not sure yet.
james
-
Hi Vipers,
A little to early to say price wise but I am hoping about $1000 list with internal power supply.
james
Thanks James, Will both versions be available at the same time as I'm after one without the internal power supply as I've got a BP26.
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Thanks James, Will both versions be available at the same time as I'm after one without the internal power supply as I've got a BP26.
Hi Vipers - I would assume so as the power supply would be modular so you can include it or not.
james
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Hi Vipers - I would assume so as the power supply would be modular so you can include it or not.
james
If you ordered the headphone amp with the internal power supply could you bypass it with the mps2?
Jim
-
If you ordered the headphone amp with the internal power supply could you bypass it with the mps2?
Jim
Hi Jim
Not sure - not that far along yet.
James
-
Hi nikon,
Not sure yet.
james
Hi James, I would be interested on one without internal PSU as well. I would assume the connection to MPS-2 would be the same as to BP26? The analogue signal would be balance out from BP26 or BDA-1?? :scratch:
-
Hello, James; for those of us who depend largely on the output from our CD/DVD/Blu-ray player for our music, will the new head amp have any circuitry devoted to reducing jitter, by reclocking or whatever? Chris
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Hello, James; for those of us who depend largely on the output from our CD/DVD/Blu-ray player for our music, will the new head amp have any circuitry devoted to reducing jitter, by reclocking or whatever? Chris
Hi Chris,
No the BHA-1 takes ANALOG 'inputs' not Digital.
james
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Hi James,
I am eager to know how well the amp's driving the HE-6. I think we can sort of establish a benchmark: if the amp is powerful enough to drive the HE-6 well, driving almost any other headphone on the market will not be a huge task.
According to owners of HE-6, these phones sound pretty bad out of the box but feed them enough power for at least 100 hours and they will show what they are capable of. I have no first hand experience: I have just ordered mine and will take delivery in a week :)
I know this link was previously posted by someone else but it's indeed a good read for all interested parties: http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews/hifiman2/1.html
Yes - they were a little bright sounding at first but are breaking in nicely. Also have the top Grados coming.
james
-
Hi James,
I am eager to know how well the amp's driving the HE-6. I think we can sort of establish a benchmark: if the amp is powerful enough to drive the HE-6 well, driving almost any other headphone on the market will not be a huge task.
According to owners of HE-6, these phones sound pretty bad out of the box but feed them enough power for at least 100 hours and they will show what they are capable of. I have no first hand experience: I have just ordered mine and will take delivery in a week :)
I know this link was previously posted by someone else but it's indeed a good read for all interested parties: http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews/hifiman2/1.html
It was me that posted the link before and I had asked about the drive capability as well.
I quoted the HE-6's impedance and efficiency.
Not sure if we got an update?
Rather than wait, I've gone for a Schiite, very pleased with it and it drives the HE-6 wonderfully.
-
Hi James : After skimming through this entire thread again, I am unclear on one point - at this stage has a decision been made re: op-amp vs. discrete circuitry?
D.D.
-
It was me that posted the link before and I had asked about the drive capability as well.
I quoted the HE-6's impedance and efficiency.
Not sure if we got an update?
Rather than wait, I've gone for a Schiite, very pleased with it and it drives the HE-6 wonderfully.
Hi Guys,
I believe the Schite allows 14dB of gain. We will have a switch on the front that will allow 3 different gain settings - 0db - 6db and 20db. The adjustments are available on both the Single Ended and Balanced outputs but the Balanced outputs will always have 6dB more gain (6, 12 and 26db) than the single ended.
If you need more gain than that you should really use an amplifier to drive your headphones.
james
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Hi James : After skimming through this entire thread again, I am unclear on one point - at this stage has a decision been made re: op-amp vs. discrete circuitry?
D.D.
Tried both and settled on Discrete.
james
-
Tried both and settled on Discrete.
james
You have chosen wisely, Grasshopper. :thumb:
D.D.
-
Rather than wait, I've gone for a Schiite, very pleased with it and it drives the HE-6 wonderfully.
After what seems like far too much research I've almost decided to go with the same setup terrycym, I'll hopefully add the Bryston amp later aswell, I was just wondering if you compared the HE-6's directly with anything else as demoing them is going to be very difficult, it's between the HE-6's and the HD800's for me, or maybe Stax, I think :)
Jame's, have you tried the HE'6's with the BHA? if so, did it drive them OK?
Thanks,
-
After what seems like far too much research I've almost decided to go with the same setup terrycym, I'll hopefully add the Bryston amp later aswell, I was just wondering if you compared the HE-6's directly with anything else as demoing them is going to be very difficult, it's between the HE-6's and the HD800's for me, or maybe Stax, I think :)
Jame's, have you tried the HE'6's with the BHA? if so, did it drive them OK?
Thanks,
Yes the HE-6 is fine with the BHA. It is interesting as I have been looking into this how popular the Tube amps are with headphones. I would have thought given the much better noise floors and distortion of solid state devices there would be more available. :scratch:
james
PS - Vipers - how is the new job going?
-
I guess with all you boys droppin' to the way-side, that leaves s/n 0001 for the ol' Diamond Dog, don't it? :lol:
D.D.
-
After what seems like far too much research I've almost decided to go with the same setup terrycym, I'll hopefully add the Bryston amp later aswell, I was just wondering if you compared the HE-6's directly with anything else as demoing them is going to be very difficult, it's between the HE-6's and the HD800's for me, or maybe Stax, I think :)
Jame's, have you tried the HE'6's with the BHA? if so, did it drive them OK?
Thanks,
Listened to:
My old Stax Lambda Pro
My old AKG 701
Sennheisers - too bright
Audeze
Grado - aweful
Probably get some new Stax as well, no doubting that they're the best
-
Yes the HE-6 is fine with the BHA. It is interesting as I have been looking into this how popular the Tube amps are with headphones. I would have thought given the much better noise floors and distortion of solid state devices there would be more available. :scratch:
james
PS - Vipers - how is the new job going?
Thanks James, I'm still hoping to add the BHA to my system once I've decided which headphones to go with, if only PMC would make some headphones :)
New job is going well, thanks, still finding my feet a little, it's great being able to compare other top end kit with Bryston though, here's a little shootout I did yesterday with Naim :-
http://www.avforums.com/forums/hi-fi-systems-separates/1471104-bryston-v-naim-my-little-shootout.html
Looks like I'm going to be organising a Bryston open day very shortly :)
-
Listened to:
My old Stax Lambda Pro
My old AKG 701
Sennheisers - too bright
Audeze
Grado - aweful
Probably get some new Stax as well, no doubting that they're the best
Thanks for the reply Terry, I don't suppose you fancy popping over to Borehamwood with the Schiit and the HE-6's :drool:
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Thanks for the reply Terry, I don't suppose you fancy popping over to Borehamwood with the Schiit and the HE-6's :drool:
You know what, I've made a BIG mistake.
Having just listened to the new Staxs, the Schiit and the HE-6's have gone back.
I bought the new 507's, nice!
I wish i hadn't listened to the 009's as they are more than I can consider paying for cans but they must represent the ultimate!
507's & KGSS, headphone heaven! At least for me.
You can listen to those instead
Terry
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You know what, I've made a BIG mistake.
Having just listened to the new Staxs, the Schiit and the HE-6's have gone back.
I bought the new 507's, nice!
I wish i hadn't listened to the 009's as they are more than I can consider paying for cans but they must represent the ultimate!
507's & KGSS, headphone heaven! At least for me.
You can listen to those instead
Terry
MMMmmm, that is going to be dangerous, the 507's with the Woo Audio Wes was top of my list for ages and then I had a reality check and wondered if I really needed to spend that much on a headphone setup, but after listening to the Stax 303's last week that gave me a rough idea what electrostatic headphones sounded like and I loved the detailed presentation so I was leaning back to the Stax setup.
I'd really appreciate if you could bring your Stax set-up over Terry, although I think my credit card may end up taking a battering. I'm going to listen to the HD800's on Thursday, just to get an idea what they are like. BTW, I love the look of the Blue Hawaii head amp, I don't know, everyday another valve headamp keeps entering the game for my consideration.
Out of interest, where did you demo the Stax headphones, finding good headphone dealers with stock isn't easy.
Thanks.
-
Out of interest, where did you demo the Stax headphones, finding good headphone dealers with stock isn't easy.
Thanks.
Cool Gales had an open day in a club in Bath the other Saturday.
The Stax distibutor was there as well as Highend Workshop who do Schiit and the He-6 (et al) and probably Wooaudio and their take on the KGBH
-
Missed that one, that's a shame, could have saved me a lot of time.
Oh well, please feel free to pop over anytime Terry, if you want to bring along your Stax obviously they are welcome also :wink:
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Missed that one, that's a shame, could have saved me a lot of time.
Oh well, please feel free to pop over anytime Terry, if you want to bring along your Stax obviously they are welcome also :wink:
What about this Saturday?
I could bring the 507's, Lambda Pros (interested in them? I've got new earpads for them), KGSS & 701's
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What about this Saturday?
I could bring the 507's, Lambda Pros (interested in them? I've got new earpads for them), KGSS & 701's
Sounds like a plan, excellent, I'll be at Zinc all day from 9pm onwards, can't wait, thanks :thumb:
It will be perfect timing really as I'm going to demo the HD800's on Thursday so I'll be able to see whether dynamics or electrostatics are for me.
-
Sounds like a plan, excellent, I'll be at Zinc all day from 9pm onwards, can't wait, thanks :thumb:
It will be perfect timing really as I'm going to demo the HD800's on Thursday so I'll be able to see whether dynamics or electrostatics are for me.
Sorted! Around midday then, M25 permtting!
BTW Do you like Quads? Do you like Martin Logans? They're ESLs.
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Sorted! Around midday then, M25 permtting!
BTW Do you like Quads? Do you like Martin Logans? They're ESLs.
Excellent, can't wait.
If I'm honest I've never heard a pair of Electrostatic speakers, are you going to bring a pair of them over also :)
See you on Saturday.
-
At last I had a chance to sit down and listen to the HD800's today, initially I was very impressed, amazing detail and transparency, found the mid range and low end a little lean though but apparently they hadn't had much use so probably needed some more hours on them tbh, and I guess it didn't help that the only headphone amp the dealer had was the Project Headbox 2.
Then I noticed the dealer was also a Grado dealer, they only had upto the SR325i's though, but I couldn't resist a listen to see if I prefered the sonic signature of the Grado's, well I found them amazing, lovely rich mid tone with powerful bass, I know they are not considered accurate but I found them a really good listen and If I had to choose I would have gone with the Grado's, I can only imagine how great the PS1000's must sound.
I don't want to count out the HD800's just yet as I'd like to hear them with proper amplification, are they known for being a hungry headphone regarding drive or was I hearing pretty much hearing how they perform?
I've been offered to take them home for a home demo, but as I haven't got a headphone amp yet is it worth it?
James, quick question, how do you think the headphone socket on the BP26 will perform running the HD800's, is it worth a punt or will I be doing the HD800's an injustice?
Can't wait to have a chance to listen to Terry's 507's on Saturday, that should really give me an idea of the direction I need to be heading regarding my headphone purchase :)
Thanks.
-
Why not go for it and get a loan of the HD800's?
I'll be bringing my AKG 701's too
-
Why not go for it and get a loan of the HD800's?
I'll be bringing my AKG 701's too
I wish I had taken their offer up now, so we could have had a play with them tomorrow also, too late now I'm afraid.
I set the Naim headphone amp up today if you fancy a listen, there are also a pair of 650's for us to play with.
See you tomorrow Terry :thumb:
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Hi Terry,
It was great to meet you earlier today, I just wanted to say thanks for bringing over your Stax and AKG headphones + your mammoth headphone amp, much appreciated, sorry I didn't get a chance to say a proper goodbye, it really got busy in the afternoon, shouldn't complain really but I'd have rather have listened to music all day :)
I think you could tell that I loved your 507's. I now know why a friend of mine told me not to buy any headphones until I've heard a pair of Stax, amazing detail and clarity, but also the bottom end really suprised me, very powerful and rich.
I'm starting to think now that I may go with a pair of 507's and a valve amp + the BHA and maybe a pair of GS1000 Grado's and live with 2 totally different setups and see in the long term what I prefer and then go up that particular range, this whole headphone journey is becoming very complicated, it was easy with a stereo system as I knew once I'd heard Bryston with PMC that I'd found what I was looking for but this is proving far more challenging, maybe that is because I haven't heard the BHA-1 yet :wink:
-
It was fun.
Let us all know what you finally decide on.
Have a look at this energiser on ebay
It'll work with 240v too
http://cgi.ebay.com/Stax-SRM-1-MK2-Driver-Unit-Earspeaker-/360374361294?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_2&hash=item53e7fc5cce
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I own Sennheiser HD800s and I like mine. I do have to say, after a year of using them a lot, that they seem a bit tilted up toward the treble. The clarity is great, and the sound is good, but for anyone who like Grados, the sound of the HD800 is going to be very disappointing in the long run.
I am crazy for clarity and treble purity, so they are my sort of headphones. With the Rudistor RPX33 mk2 amp they are the clearest sound i have ever heard, and can hear stuff in recording i never knew was there before! But for tube like warm mids and lots of lows, the HD800 are not the choice at all.
I am not saying they are bad, more like really really neutral... just the drift is the opposite of Grados...
-
It was fun.
Let us all know what you finally decide on.
Have a look at this energiser on ebay
It'll work with 240v too
http://cgi.ebay.com/Stax-SRM-1-MK2-Driver-Unit-Earspeaker-/360374361294?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_2&hash=item53e7fc5cce
Cheers Terry, seriously looks like I'll go down the Stax route now and look at a Grado setup when the BHA comes out, kind of makes sense to have 2 totally different setups depending on my mood.
Trouble is now that I've heard how good a Stax setup can sound there is no going back.
Any chance James of an Electrostatic BHA-2 :wink:
-
I am crazy for clarity and treble purity, so they are my sort of headphones.
Bearing in mind the above statement Elizabeth, have you listened to any Stax setups? as that is how I would describe the Stax sound.
Saying that, something is still drawing me towards the fun sound of the Grado's, talk about chalk and cheese, as they couldn't be any more different.
-
Vipers,
Have you had the chance to listen to Terrycm's (or anybody's) well-powered and well-run in Hifiman HE-6? I also own the HD800 and for more than a year, they were my favorite phones. But having bought the HE-6 last week and spending several hours with them (they are being run in 24/7), I think they have set a new benchmark. I have not listened to any Stax phones for a prolonged period of time but believe they must be very good. However, anyone considering a pair of audiophile headphones NEED to try the HE-6 before deciding on anything.
-
Vipers,
Have you had the chance to listen to Terrycm's (or anybody's) well-powered and well-run in Hifiman HE-6? I also own the HD800 and for more than a year, they were my favorite phones. But having bought the HE-6 last week and spending several hours with them (they are being run in 24/7), I think they have set a new benchmark. I have not listened to any Stax phones for a prolonged period of time but believe they must be very good. However, anyone considering a pair of audiophile headphones NEED to try the HE-6 before deciding on anything.
Trouble is, nobody really sells the hifiman gear in England so you're buying blind.
I heard a pair of HE-500's when at Bath the other week and I really wonder what all the fuss is all about!
-
Vipers,
Have you had the chance to listen to Terrycm's (or anybody's) well-powered and well-run in Hifiman HE-6? I also own the HD800 and for more than a year, they were my favorite phones. But having bought the HE-6 last week and spending several hours with them (they are being run in 24/7), I think they have set a new benchmark. I have not listened to any Stax phones for a prolonged period of time but believe they must be very good. However, anyone considering a pair of audiophile headphones NEED to try the HE-6 before deciding on anything.
Thanks for the feedback and advice myview, I'd love to hear the HE-6's, they are very high on my maybe list, but as Terry says there are no dealers over here so it's almost impossible, saying that if there is anyone in the London area reading this with a pair of HE-6's and would like to bring them over to Zinc HT in Borehamwood I'd be very grateful :wink:
-
From Engineering - Headphone amp project so far:
Bryston Headphone Amplifier (BHA-1)
Features:
1)Battery operation – 2 rechargeable 9v lithium LiFePO4 batteries
2)External power option via MPS-2 power supply.*
3)Volume control combined with power switch – blue led ‘on’ indicator.
4)OPA2604 op amp. Ultra low Thd + noise. (<.001%)
5)Parallel op amp outputs – 3 per channel.
6)14dB gain
7)Perfect for headphones 16 ohms or higher.
8)Cross feed circuit – bypass - in out – amber Led indicator.
9)Cross feed level variable – full in - to – 20dB.
10)Gold connectors – RCA inputs - XLR out option.
11)50k input impedance
12)Rugged construction
13)Dimensions – 2” high x 4” wide x 6” deep.
* Higher output level with BMP2 supply. -
Hi James, any further updates on the above features or specification :D
-
Hi James, any further updates on the above features or specification :D
Hi larevoj
We care moving away from the battery unit for now and the BHA-1 will be available with a built in linear power supply or can be used with our external MPS-2 power supply.
James
-
Hi James,
I cannot be sure (because of the low resolution of the pictures) but the XLR jacks on the BHP-1 look like they are male. Can you please clarify?
Thank you
-
Hi James,
I cannot be sure (because of the low resolution of the pictures) but the XLR jacks on the BHP-1 look like they are male. Can you please clarify?
Thank you
Hi,
I will check - meaning they should be female? I have been told there is no standard as such - on the preamps and amps the signal always moves from a male into a female.
james
-
Hi James,
Most of the balanced headphone amplifiers I know of have female output XLR jacks/receptacles. I do not know if it is a technical reason for this or is there an industrial standard. Perhaps other more experienced headphone users here can advise.
Thank you
Hi,
I will check - meaning they should be female? I have been told there is no standard as such - on the preamps and amps the signal always moves from a male into a female.
james
-
Hi James,
Most of the balanced headphone amplifiers I know of have female output XLR jacks/receptacles. I do not know if it is a technical reason for this or is there an industrial standard. Perhaps other more experienced headphone users here can advise.
Thank you
That'll be conformance to the XLR standard where chassis outputs are male (ie pins)
-
Hi larevoj
We care moving away from the battery unit for now and the BHA-1 will be available with a built in linear power supply or can be used with our external MPS-2 power supply.
James
I have been doing some research and soon auditioning a few head phone amps and headphones around town. It is unfortunate Bryston is not pursuing the battery option as there are many performance advantageous with battery supply and one example is from RWA Audeze's Edition - http://redwineaudio.com/components/audeze_edition (http://redwineaudio.com/components/audeze_edition).
Perhaps making the battery supply as an option for folks whom doesn't want to have a built in linear power supply unit and using MPS-2 to charge up the battery supply unit? :)
-
I have been doing some research and soon auditioning a few head phone amps and headphones around town. It is unfortunate Bryston is not pursuing the battery option as there are many performance advantageous with battery supply and one example is from RWA Audeze's Edition - http://redwineaudio.com/components/audeze_edition (http://redwineaudio.com/components/audeze_edition).
Perhaps making the battery supply as an option for folks whom doesn't want to have a built in linear power supply unit and using MPS-2 to charge up the battery supply unit? :)
Hi larevoj,
We considered and tested the battery approach but feel the direction we are going is the better choice for us.
james
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Some new pics for you:
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=48246)
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=48247)
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=48248)
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=48249)
james
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Love that black studio look, very pro . Thanks for the pics James. Looking forward to getting one. By the way my BCD-1 is fabulous.
-
I like that.
James,is there only an input for the MPS-2 on the front.
I see there's a IEC on the back,can't see if there's connection for the MPS-2 on the back.
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I like that.
James,is there only an input for the MPS-2 on the front.
I see there's a IEC on the back,can't see if there's connection for the MPS-2 on the back.
Hi
The MPS-2 is the power supply only and has 4 power outlets on the back.
james
-
The MPS-2 is the power supply only and has 4 power outlets on the back.
So shouldn't we be seeing one of these (http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=48250) instead of an IEC connector on the back of the BHA-1?
Steve
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So shouldn't we be seeing one of these (http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=48250) instead of an IEC connector on the back of the BHA-1?
Steve
Yes if you order it without the internal supply the BHA-1 will come that way.
james
-
James - might have been covered earlier but will a BHA-1 with an internal power supply benefit from using the MPS-2 in the event one acquires a BP-26/MPS-2 set up down the road?
TIA
Ron
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James - might have been covered earlier but will a BHA-1 with an internal power supply benefit from using the MPS-2 in the event one acquires a BP-26/MPS-2 set up down the road?
TIA
Ron
Hi Ron,
No the performance will be the same with either supply. I just thought it would save some expense for those with a MPS-2 already.
james
-
But we like spending money,don't we :scratch:.
Anyway that's good to know with PS.
Could a person have both IEC and that fancy XLR power thingy.
-
Looking good James,
A black one for me please without the internal Power supply :)
quick question, If you choose the version which goes with the MPS-2 will the BHA-1 come with the correct cable to connect to the MPS-2?
Thanks.
-
James
Have you set pricing yet for both versions ?
-
Looking good James,
A black one for me please without the internal Power supply :)
quick question, If you choose the version which goes with the MPS-2 will the BHA-1 come with the correct cable to connect to the MPS-2?
Thanks.
Yes the cable will come with the BHA.
james
-
James
Have you set pricing yet for both versions ?
Hi - not yet as i am still listening and making changes.
james
-
Hi James, the MPS-2 has a 200VA toroidal transformer with filter capacity of 68,000Mfd. What would be the PSU spec for the BHA-1? :scratch:
-
Hi James, the MPS-2 has a 200VA toroidal transformer with filter capacity of 68,000Mfd. What would be the PSU spec for the BHA-1? :scratch:
Still looking at that and trying different custom transformers to see what works best.
James
-
Still looking at that and trying different custom transformers to see what works best.
James
I am keen to try HE-6 but it need plenty of juice/headroom to really sing :wink:
-
I am keen to try HE-6 but it need plenty of juice/headroom to really sing :wink:
This is one of the sets I'm currently looking at to pair with the BHA-1, would be nice to get some feedback once available to see how the BHA-1 compares to the Schiit Lyr.
-
WooAudio, Headamp and RSA have options to power electrostatic headphone...anyone know if BHA-1 can power STAX?? :scratch:
-
WooAudio, Headamp and RSA have options to power electrostatic headphone...anyone know if BHA-1 can power STAX?? :scratch:
I didn't see a Stax compatable socket on the BHA-1 so I wouldn't hold my breath.
I asked this question early on and James never got back to me.
Which Stax do you have mate?
I've got the new 507s & KGSS, which I mentioned earlier.
What is the plural of Stax?
-
WooAudio, Headamp and RSA have options to power electrostatic headphone
Who are RSA?
-
Which Stax do you have mate?
I've got the new 507s & KGSS, which I mentioned earlier.
I got a deal here for the following at USD3,700.00 package...still considering if I should go with SRM-717 or other options including BHA-1.
1. Stax Omega Mark 1 SR-007 (brown) with original flight case
2. Stax Amp SRM-717 (230V) with box
3. Stax Extension Cable SRE-750 (brown), 5 metre, with box
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RSA = Ray Samuels Audio
http://www.raysamuelsaudio.com/
Who are RSA?
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WooAudio, Headamp and RSA have options to power electrostatic headphone...anyone know if BHA-1 can power STAX?? :scratch:
Hi
No Stax connection.
james
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RSA = Ray Samuels Audio
http://www.raysamuelsaudio.com/
Thanks for that, never heard of them.
The link doesn't work BTW, have they gone bust?
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Hi
No Stax connection.
james
Shock, Horror!
What will I do with my Otis Redding LPs then?
Presume it will do Motown instead?
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Yes, for some reason, the website seems to be down today. But the company is far from having gone bust. On the contrary, RSA seems to be doing very well. It is very well-known and has quite a following among the headphone-loving crowd, having designed and built a range of very fine portable as well as full-size headphone amplifiers.
Thanks for that, never heard of them.
The link doesn't work BTW, have they gone bust?
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This is one of the sets I'm currently looking at to pair with the BHA-1, would be nice to get some feedback once available to see how the BHA-1 compares to the Schiit Lyr.
Hi Vipers, I got a feeling Schiit may not be in Bryston league...a good comparison would be the GSX powering HE-6, LDC-2 and HD800. 8)
http://www.headamp.com/home_amps/gsx/index.htm (http://www.headamp.com/home_amps/gsx/index.htm)
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Have a pair of Audio-Technica ATH-W5000 headphones on the way to try out.
james:
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Have a pair of Audio-Technica ATH-W5000 headphones on the way to try out.
james:
Hi James,
The sacrifices you have to make in the cause of development for new products :)
I'm very envious, when you've finished playing, sorry, I mean researching :wink: I'd be very interested in your opinions regarding all the different headphones you have tried with the BHA-1, personally I'm thinking of going with 2 system, a Stax sytem and a BHA-1 system with a pair of Dynamics/Planar Magnetics, just not sure which ones at the moment though as auditioning all the phones I'm interested in is almost impossible.
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Hi Vipers, I got a feeling Schiit may not be in Bryston league...a good comparison would be the GSX powering HE-6, LDC-2 and HD800. 8)
Why do you say that? Have you heard the Schiit?
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Hi James,
Can a person go down to their local dealer now and pre-order the BHA?
Thanks,
Mark
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Hi James,
Can a person go down to their local dealer now and pre-order the BHA?
Thanks,
Mark
Hi Mark,
Sure - but we still about 60 days from release.
james
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Hi Mark,
Sure - but we still about 60 days from release.
james
Hi James,
Excellent, Sounds like I need to have a word with PMC on Monday :)
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Hi James!
How does the HP-1 perform on the higher end Grado's and can you post a pic of the back panel for hookups? It looks like it will do a superb job on any headphones above 16 ohms, so 32 ohm Grado GS-100i's should work great I assume. I will be ordering one from Audio One as soon as it becomes available.
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I sold Sennheiser and Grado for years and it amazes me that someone can listen to both and prefer the Senns. Grado's sound like Bryston. Accurate and transparent. Try the GS-1000i or PS-1000i models. These models sound like high end speakers and don't have the "in-the -head" sound of other headphones.
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Hi James!
How does the HP-1 perform on the higher end Grado's and can you post a pic of the back panel for hookups? It looks like it will do a superb job on any headphones above 16 ohms, so 32 ohm Grado GS-100i's should work great I assume. I will be ordering one from Audio One as soon as it becomes available.
I have tried it on 2 sets of Grado's already and they work great.
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=48998)
james
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I have tried it on 2 sets of Grado's already and they work great.
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=48998)
james
James - would you mind naming the Grado models you tried AND could you share what differences you hear with listening through the BHA-1 vs. the standard Bryston headphone jack on say the BP26? It would be interesting to know how much improvement it will provide on low vs. higher ohm headphones. I would think the differences would reveal themselves much more with more difficult headphones i.e. one's that the standard headphone jacks on Bryston preamps can't adequately handle. Thanks.
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Dual mono. Sick! This is exciting as I just moved into a nicer but smaller place and am really starting to spend more time headphone listening.
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Hi larevoj,
We considered and tested the battery approach but feel the direction we are going is the better choice for us.
james
I wouldn't worry about the built in power supply Larevoj. Bryston's are as quiet as you can get and wont lose performance as the batteries start to die.
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Another question James. Will the new Bryston remote control the volume of the BHA-1?
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Another question James. Will the new Bryston remote control the volume of the BHA-1?
No sorry the volume pot is not motorized.
James
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James - would you mind naming the Grado models you tried AND could you share what differences you hear with listening through the BHA-1 vs. the standard Bryston headphone jack on say the BP26? It would be interesting to know how much improvement it will provide on low vs. higher ohm headphones. I would think the differences would reveal themselves much more with more difficult headphones i.e. one's that the standard headphone jacks on Bryston preamps can't adequately handle. Thanks.
SR 325 and GS 1000. I am still experimenting but I would say the dynamic contrasts and transients would be what I notice most between the preamp and the BHD - the more difficult to drive the more noticeable it is of course.
James
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SR 325 and GS 1000. I am still experimenting but I would say the dynamic contrasts and transients would be what I notice most between the preamp and the BHD - the more difficult to drive the more noticeable it is of course.
James
Dynamic contrasts (would that be both micro and macro?). Transients is well expected with the ease of power delivery that the BHA-1 would deliver. How about at the extremes - air and low extension. Please continue to report James as you formulate an opinion.
I've got Grado's myself - just the SR80, which are great for the money, hence my interest in the models you chose to tryout. Cheers.
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I wouldn't worry about the built in power supply Larevoj. Bryston's are as quiet as you can get and wont lose performance as the batteries start to die.
Hi Zeeman, after further research I think external PSU (MPS-2) will be a better option for me vs. one with battery supply. Battery life expectancy is one consideration but will have to worry about recharge time, use time, etc. and if/when the head phone amp shuts down for recharge - I will be stuffed! :duh:
James - the LCD-2 (R2) is relatively hard to drive. Did you made any comparison on with BP26 headphone out? Any significant improvements?? Here a link on the headphone details - http://www.audeze.com/driver-update-and-leather-headband (http://www.audeze.com/driver-update-and-leather-headband)
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The LCD-2 is hard to drive compared to some headphones but it is considered an easy load as compared to the Hifiman HE-6 (which, like LCD-2, is an ortho). James did say that the BHP-1 could adequately drive the HE-6 (but did not elaborate). If so, it should have more than sufficient power to drive the LCD-2. Whether the headphone out of the BP26 can drive the LCD-2 has never been discussed so perhaps James will give his input. I am, however, of the opinion that to optimise a pair of top class headphones, one needs a top class headphone amplifier - which I hope the BHP-1 will be one.
Also, as far as I can remember (I follow this thread closely), there's no mention from James ever that the BHP-1 would run on battery.
Hi Zeeman, after further research I think external PSU (MPS-2) will be a better option for me vs. one with battery supply. Battery life expectancy is one consideration but will have to worry about recharge time, use time, etc. and if/when the head phone amp shuts down for recharge - I will be stuffed! :duh:
James - the LCD-2 (R2) is relatively hard to drive. Did you made any comparison on with BP26 headphone out? Any significant improvements?? Here a link on the headphone details - http://www.audeze.com/driver-update-and-leather-headband (http://www.audeze.com/driver-update-and-leather-headband)
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Also, as far as I can remember (I follow this thread closely), there's no mention from James ever that the BHP-1 would run on battery.
FYI - http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=91385.msg906408#msg906408 (http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=91385.msg906408#msg906408)
I do think a well design external PSU like MPS-2 to BHP-1 has its benefits versus battery supply.
Yes...I will like to know how well BHP-1 can drive ortho like HE-6 and LCD-2 V2 :scratch:
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I am sorry - my mistake. What I should have said was more recently, the idea for BHP-1 to run on batteries seems to have been (implicitly) superceded by options for power supply - either with it coming supplied with a PSU or via a connection to the MPS-2.
FYI - http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=91385.msg906408#msg906408 (http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=91385.msg906408#msg906408)
I do think a well design external PSU like MPS-2 to BHP-1 has its benefits versus battery supply.
Yes...I will like to know how well BHP-1 can drive ortho like HE-6 and LCD-2 V2 :scratch:
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Yes...I will like to know how well BHP-1 can drive ortho like HE-6 and LCD-2 V2 :scratch:
+1 from me also.
I'm looking for a pair of headphones to match with the BHA-1, I've done far too much research tbh, and it looks like I'll go for a seperate Stax system aswell, but for the BHA-1 it is the HE-6's that are looking like my favoured can so I'd like to know if the BHA-1 will be sufficient enough to drive the HE-6 to get the maximum performance from them, if it can succeed with the HE-6's, from what I gather, then it will drive every other headphone no problem.
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Hi Folks,
It is difficult to get some of these phones without an unlimited budget but I have had a number of requests from reviewers so I think we should be able to get a very good over-view of the BHA with these different phones.
james
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Can't wait to hear your findings James, I think if you can blag a pair of HE-6's from somewhere and the BHA-1 can drive them as good as any of the competition then I'd say it would eat every other pair of headphones alive, which I'm sure it will :)
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Crossfeed we are looking at - balanced outs to where - you mean an XLR output for the headphones? - if so that's covered :)
james
Seriously, balanced and crossfeed?
Possibly an impedance switch as some headphones are harder to drive than others.
When you say XLR connectors, will it be a balanced out, or just the connectors?
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James,
Are you guys any closer to a release date with the BHA-1?
I hope your not waiting for Dolby approval on this also :wink:
Thanks.
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James,
Are you guys any closer to a release date with the BHA-1?
I hope your not waiting for Dolby approval on this also :wink:
Thanks.
Yes we are going to show it at the CEDIA Show next month and will be ready to go.
Got my new Grado PS1000 headphones today - trying them out tonight.
james
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Hi James,
Is there going to be a crossfeed function on the BHA-1? If so, great!
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Hi James,
Is there going to be a crossfeed function on the BHA-1? If so, great!
Sorry no cross-feed - tried it and did not like it.
james
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Yes we are going to show it at the CEDIA Show next month and will be ready to go.
Got my new Grado PS1000 headphones today - trying them out tonight.
james
Excellent news James, can't wait :)
Funny you mention the PS1000's, I just bought What HiFi over here as they have a review of the PS1000's in there, stonking review, summing up they say 'Powerful, effortless, dynamic, superb midrange detail, beautifully built, headphones can't get much better than this'
Let us now what you think James, once they are run in a little.
Once the BHA-1 is out it will be decision time for me, PS1000's or HE-6's :?
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James, for us nerd-porn lovers, can you post a pic or two of the insides of that?
Thanks!
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James, for us nerd-porn lovers, can you post a pic or two of the insides of that?
Thanks!
Will do - we are currently redesigning the chassis so it matches the size and cosmetics of the other Bryston products.
james
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James: Having bought the Audeze LCD-2 headphones and having fallen in love with them (my HD800s are back in the box and may stay there), I'm interested in learning more about the BHA-1 status. Any features now added but not previously mentioned? Any update on when it will be shipped? Any news about the list price?
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James: Having bought the Audeze LCD-2 headphones and having fallen in love with them (my HD800s are back in the box and may stay there), I'm interested in learning more about the BHA-1 status. Any features now added but not previously mentioned? Any update on when it will be shipped? Any news about the list price?
Hi Dave,
Still working on it and will have the prototype at the CEDIA show next month. We have added a balance control. I have now in house the top line AKG's, Senn's HD800. and the Grado PS1000.
james
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Thanks, James: Great news about the balance control! I'll be very interested in how the HD800s sound through the BHA-1 versus the headphone jack on the Preamp. I suppose you don't have the LCD-2s, but that will be of interest as well. People with 50ohms headphones are anxious to know if the BHA-1 will have the extra power to drive them to their best. Too bad the BHA-2 was not ready to show at this year's CanJam.
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Hi Dave,
Still working on it and will have the prototype at the CEDIA show next month. We have added a balance control. I have now in house the top line AKG's, Senn's HD800. and the Grado PS1000.
james
Hi James,
I'm very anxious to hear about the HD800 and PS1000. Look forward to your review.
Bill
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Final Version of Bryston BHA-1 headphone interface.
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=50990)
james
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Very nice James. I think I'll get out my "phones" again soon..... :drool:
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James, if I am using the 2 outputs from my BDA-1, and want to add a BHA-1 (internally powered) to my system, what alternatives would you recommnend using?
Dave
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Final Version of Bryston BHA-1 headphone interface.
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=50990)
james
The balance control is a smart addition and increases functionality. Interesting small knob for the balance control, though not the typcial Bryston one's - I think it works visually.
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Final Version of Bryston BHA-1 headphone interface.
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=50990)
james
James, are the balanced headphone outputs fully balanced? Can you show us a photo of the rear of the unit?
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The balance control is a smart addition and increases functionality. Interesting small knob for the balance control, though not the typcial Bryston one's - I think it works visually.
Final Version of Bryston BHA-1 headphone interface.
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=50990)
james
Hi James
Any chance of implementing a small balance control? (we want it all you know)
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=46085)
Robert
Hi James
Thanks for implementing my suggestion and design but you do realize it'll cost you, but send me a free unit and I'll call it even :eyebrows:
Robert
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The balance control is a smart addition and increases functionality. Interesting small knob for the balance control, though not the typcial Bryston one's - I think it works visually.
...the BHA-1's balance control knob seems to have the same size as the SP2's balance knob?!? :scratch:
al.
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looking good James, but is this the 19" faceplate? The engraved "Bryston" seems a lot further away from the edge than on the 17" in my rack...As is the power on the right.
Marius
Final Version of Bryston BHA-1 headphone interface.
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=50990)
james
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Well, i pre-ordered the BHA-1 in black with 19" faceplate with no power supply. I can hardly wait to hear it. We are not sure of the price yet, but my dealer says he will get back to me within a few days. :thumb:
Mark
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Hi James,
Maybe covered already, but have you tested the BHA-1 with the Hifiman headphones, as mentioned in http://media.avguide.com/full_size_headphones_buyers_guide.pdf ? Their insensitivity would be the only weak point in Headphones that come closest to my ESL, and the transparency I'm used to, or put otherwise, wouldn't want to be without.
Thanks,
Marius
ps other thing: how would the BHA be connected to the BP26? In the tape loop? Doesn't that interfere with the tape-rec monitoring?
I can't seem to find a technical description in this forum, or on the website.
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Hi James,
Maybe covered already, but have you tested the BHA-1 with the Hifiman headphones, as mentioned in http://media.avguide.com/full_size_headphones_buyers_guide.pdf ? Their insensitivity would be the only weak point in Headphones that come closest to my ESL, and the transparency I'm used to, or put otherwise, wouldn't want to be without.
Thanks,
Marius
ps other thing: how would the BHA be connected to the BP26? In the tape loop? Doesn't that interfere with the tape-rec monitoring?
I can't seem to find a technical description in this forum, or on the website.
Hi Marius,
I have tried a lot of headphones so far but not the ones you mentioned.
Yes I recommend the Tape Loop because that way you are not going through the volume control and balance control on your preamp.
james
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Ok, but where do I leave my play and rec interconnects that go ( or at least went...) into my recorder?
should I find another setup for that, or is there a passthrough on the BHA1?
Marius
Hi Marius,
I have tried a lot of headphones so far but not the ones you mentioned.
Yes I recommend the Tape Loop because that way you are not going through the volume control and balance control on your preamp.
james
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Ok, but where do I leave my play and rec interconnects that go ( or at least went...) into my recorder?
should I find another setup for that, or is there a passthrough on the BHA1?
Marius
No pass-through.... so you're stuck!!! or use one of the Preouts on the BP26.
james
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:( :(
That's really too bad. Couldn't you redesign one more time? And that way keep the bp26 the way Bryston intended and designed it, ....and customers use it....?
I especially bought this version of the bp26 because of this functionality, and would hate to miss it and just use a pre-out for recording purposes.
Please?
Marius
No pass-through.... so you're stuck!!! or use one of the Preouts on the BP26.
james
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You can also use the output of the BDA for the BHA
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??
No non digital sources would reach the BDA? like my record-player. and FM tuner.
Marius
You can also use the output of the BDA for the BHA
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ps other thing: how would the BHA be connected to the BP26? In the tape loop? Doesn't that interfere with the tape-rec monitoring?
I can't seem to find a technical description in this forum, or on the website.
You actually own a device that allows for analog recording, like a tape deck? I must say, I am amazed... :o
Just wondering, what do you record? And, from personal experience (I used to record lots as well and then never played or watched whatever I recorded, so I just gave the thing away), do you ever play it back now that you have the BDP and such?
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:D
yep I do.
besides the fact that I'm like forever on the waiting list for a Nak. Dragon, I do have a lot of my own live recordings that were aired on radio, and to my knowledge have found no digital disclosure yet. I have no means of transferring them to the BDP, or any other digital player for that matter.
I do have the Bryston digitals, but do not own a digital recording apparatus, although that might be a good replacement for my current recorder. Which is a vhs-recorder that is able to use the full bandwidth of the tape to record audio only. Of course this is "old" technique. But so is my record player. And there's no debate about that functionality, Bryston even has a separate Phono-stage. Which is also in my setup. I'm lucky to be able to play those records in hi-end Bryston quality.
I do listen to a lot of live radio transmission all over the world, and tend to like recording those, and hope to be able to do that in the future. I'd hate to loose the functionality of my Bp26, especially bought in this configuration.... :cry:
A separate debate could be held about analog or digital, but this is not the place for that. or is it?
Thanks,
Marius
You actually own a device that allows for analog recording, like a tape deck? I must say, I am amazed... :o
Just wondering, what do you record? And, from personal experience (I used to record lots as well and then never played or watched whatever I recorded, so I just gave the thing away), do you ever play it back now that you have the BDP and such?
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Hey Marius,
If you ever decide to get a digital recorder, these guys do a good selection and they're pretty knowledgeable.
http://www.solidstatesound.co.uk/ (http://www.solidstatesound.co.uk/)
They do portable & rack mount some of which does 24bit, 96k too
Having said that, the Nagra digital recorder is very nice. I know someone who uses the 4 track version. His live recordings are outstanding
Terry
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No pass-through.... so you're stuck!!! or use one of the Preouts on the BP26.
james
James, Marius isn't alone in his question/issue. I confess I have not heard the term preouts before. Does this mean any of the two channel outputs on the BP26?
There are a lot of people who own several headphones and headphone amps, and they don't want to be connecting and reconnecting them.
Dave
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James, Marius isn't alone in his question/issue. I confess I have not heard the term preouts before. Does this mean any of the two channel outputs on the BP26?
There are a lot of people who own several headphones and headphone amps, and they don't want to be connecting and reconnecting them.
Dave
Yes you can use a pair of the PREOUTs on the rear of the BD26 but you are then going through the volume control on the BP-26.
james
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...and since you advised against that earlier, that would be short of a real solution.....no?
Marius
Yes you can use a pair of the PREOUTs on the rear of the BD26 but you are then going through the volume control on the BP-26.
james
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Hi James,
Any ideas on the prices? I pre-ordered mine and they said delivery would be around end of October.
Mark
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...and since you advised against that earlier, that would be short of a real solution.....no?
Marius
Correct.
james
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Hi James,
Any ideas on the prices? I pre-ordered mine and they said delivery would be around end of October.
Mark
Hi Mark,
We are still looking at it so will be another week or so before I know.
james
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So you might reconsider and implement a pass-through? (or what would be the official term for it?)
Marius
Wouldn't understand why not, wouldn't it make the Bha more versatile?
Correct.
james
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So you might reconsider and implement a pass-through? (or what would be the official term for it?)
Marius
Wouldn't understand why not, wouldn't it make the Bha more versatile?
No sorry ....too far alone for that.
james
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Hi James,
Of course its your call, and your company, so I fully respect that. But sometimes you amaze me: You made the most beautiful preamp in the world with great specifications, with all possible additions and options that don't exclude each other, but make the Bp26 even stronger, and used to its full extent.
Then you make a wonderful BHA. but which is not fully compatible with your own Bp26? It compromises the versatility of an extremely balanced product.
Why not just make that small adjustment (or it seems that way at least) so that very satisfied Bp26 users can stay that way, and with addition of the BHA, even further enjoy their system with the ultimate headphone system.
That way being able to use the tape loop what it was invented for, (and bought for....) and still use all the features of both machines.
Also taken into account that there would be no reason not to do it, there is no technical disadvantage to implement that pass-through, or is there?
no offense meant at all, but left in full doubt,
greets,
Marius
No sorry ....too far alone for that.
james
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Hi Mark,
We are still looking at it so will be another week or so before I know.
james/quote]
Okay, thanks for the update.
Mark
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Hi James,
Of course its your call, and your company, so I fully respect that. But sometimes you amaze me: You made the most beautiful preamp in the world with great specifications, with all possible additions and options that don't exclude each other, but make the Bp26 even stronger, and used to its full extent.
Then you make a wonderful BHA. but which is not fully compatible with your own Bp26? It compromises the versatility of an extremely balanced product.
Why not just make that small adjustment (or it seems that way at least) so that very satisfied Bp26 users can stay that way, and with addition of the BHA, even further enjoy their system with the ultimate headphone system.
That way being able to use the tape loop what it was invented for, (and bought for....) and still use all the features of both machines.
Also taken into account that their would be no reason not to do it, there is no technical disadvantage to implement that pass-through, or is there?
no offense meant at all, but left in full doubt,
greets,
Marius
Great point! Marius!
Because the BP26 only had ONE balanced XLR output (which always goes to the power amp of course.) and only RCA for the tape loop. I always wanted another set of XLR outputs, or a tape loop using XLR sockets because my current headphone amp only had XLR inputs.
There must be some reasons that Bryston offered only one set balanced XLR output, maybe it's because bridging the main output with another set of outputs would compromise the sound/signal quality in some way? I know we can always buy one of those 'shotgun' cables with 2 sets of plugs on one end, but i'm still wondering why.
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There must be some reasons that Bryston offered only one set balanced XLR output .....
The BP 26 is a 1U slimline enclosure and there is no available room on the back panel for additional connectors. A new preamp in a 2U enclosure like the BP 16 would be needed for more outputs.
Steve
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The BP 26 is a 1U slimline enclosure and there is no available room on the back panel for additional connectors. A new preamp in a 2U enclosure like the BP 16 would be needed for more outputs.
Steve
:scratch: Awww.... i forgot this one. Of course,... space.. :duh:
Thanks Steve! :green:
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Nope, space could not be the problem..
I'm talking about the BHA here, not the BP26, which is perfect the way it is...Just if the preferred way of connecting the BHA is by means of the tape loop, it would be so very nice if the BHA offered a way to pass the original tape loop through and keep that functionality alive...
The BHA has a lot of room on the back.
Keeping my fingers crossed.
Marius
:scratch: Awww.... i forgot this one. Of course,... space.. :duh:
Thanks Steve! :green:
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Correct - there is only so much space available. You can use a Y connector on the outputs without any issues if you do need two sets of Balanced outs.
james
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Oh, so that would be the way to keep the tape loop in function? Should have said so before James.
Please elaborate, how do I go about to connect the bha to the bp26 and where do I put the Y connector.
Wouldn't the Y connector bring the risk of deterioration of sound quality? If not that would be a very easy solution :thumb:
Thanks!
Marius
Correct - there is only so much space available. You can use a Y connector on the outputs without any issues if you do need two sets of Balanced outs.
james
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Correct - there is only so much space available. You can use a Y connector on the outputs without any issues if you do need two sets of Balanced outs.
james
...using a Y-connector without ANY issues?!?! that's good to know :thumb: :thumb:
i assume you mean that the connector has to be used with two amplifier's xlr inputs?
al.
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Oh, so that would be the way to keep the tape loop in function? Should have said so before James.
Please elaborate, how do I go about to connect the bha to the bp26 and where do I put the Y connector.
Wouldn't the Y connector bring the risk of deterioration of sound quality? If not that would be a very easy solution :thumb:
Thanks!
Marius
OK maybe we are not on the same page here - what I am saying is the BP-26 has more than enough voltage out to drive many amplifiers at once so if you want to Y the Balanced outs and run two or three amplifiers then feel free.
james
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Nope, space could not be the problem..
I'm talking about the BHA here, not the BP26, which is perfect the way it is...Just if the preferred way of connecting the BHA is by means of the tape loop, it would be so very nice if the BHA offered a way to pass the original tape loop through and keep that functionality alive...
The BHA has a lot of room on the back.
Keeping my fingers crossed.
Marius
But sometimes the 'loop' may 'alter' the signals abit, although very little but still not desireable.
A friend of mine had a Mcintosh 'room EQ processor', which goes in between the signal path and had a bypass mode,the manual stated ' in this mode it will NOT alter the signal in any way' but the highs became abit darker in this mode, barely noticable but we all noticed it in an AB blind test.
I use the outputs on the gears whenever possible, but if that's not an option (for example, bi-amping), i use the shotgun XLR cables (Y connector) because IMO it's somehow 'cleaner' than internal loops or bypass/switch box because at the very least there's less metal, soldering and connectors in the signal path . :green:
But since we were talking about headphone amp, i'm not sure Y-connectors r good if i use it to link my CD player to headphone amp and pre amp(BP26) at the same time, since the CDP's signal is 'weaker'? :scratch:
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hmmm, not sure I am sure.
I don't want to "Y the balanced outs", I want the tape loop to be functional and use the BHA...
for a moment I thought you said that was possible with a Y-connector, but I believe to have to believe that hope is gone again.
OK maybe we are not on the same page here - what I am saying is the BP-26 has more than enough voltage out to drive many amplifiers at once so if you want to Y the Balanced outs and run two or three amplifiers then feel free.
james
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...in my case: i like the idea of using y-cables in order to drive another Bryston amp with my 26! that's very good, because i prefer the xlr connections :D
hmmm, maybe i should try the 4B + 3B for bi-amping now?!? :thumb:
al.
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hmmm, not sure I am sure.
I don't want to "Y the balanced outs", I want the tape loop to be functional and use the BHA...
for a moment I thought you said that was possible with a Y-connector, but I believe to have to believe that hope is gone again.
Seems to me you should put a Y-connector on the tape out and connect a line to the tape recorder and the BHA. That would take the BP-26 volume control out of the system and should give you what you need.
Tony
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Hi Tony,
you mean something like this
http://www.headphone.com/productphotos/large/0060210000_102.jpg (http://www.headphone.com/productphotos/large/0060210000_102.jpg) ?
would it keep the tape loop switch functional?
What I don't see yet is how it all works. Usually when plugging in the Headphone, the speakers are muted. In the tape loop the source is permanently to the "to tape" or "record". Speakers are not muted, right? So A/B 'ing the headphone/speakers is done with the mute switch? Or does that mute the source into the tape also connected to the BHA.
Flipping the tape switch to "from tape" or "play" still plays my tape?
I see balanced (XLR's) and rca (SE) in's on the BHA back, that would be connected to the "to tape". In my case the SE. What setup would need the XLR's. Also I see a stereo-connection. What goes in there?
I really need a visual here. Is a scheme available?
Thanks again,
Marius
Seems to me you should put a Y-connector on the tape out and connect a line to the tape recorder and the BHA. That would take the BP-26 volume control out of the system and should give you what you need.
Tony
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pictures always tell a better story, this is what I meant:
http://www.headamp.com/home_amps/lite/images/lite_back_high.jpg (http://www.headamp.com/home_amps/lite/images/lite_back_high.jpg)
http://www.headamp.com/home_amps/gsx/images/gsx_back_stacked_high.jpg (http://www.headamp.com/home_amps/gsx/images/gsx_back_stacked_high.jpg)
of course we need that in Bryston quality..
Marius
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Hi Tony,
you mean something like this
http://www.headphone.com/productphotos/large/0060210000_102.jpg (http://www.headphone.com/productphotos/large/0060210000_102.jpg) ?
Just a splitter plug, no boxes like the one you linked to in the previous post. The more electronics you introduce the more distortion and loss you get.
(http://www.headphone.com/productphotos/large/0060210000_102.jpg)
This indeed is all. The male end goes into the "tape out" on the BP26, then one end goes to the BHA, the other end goes to your recorder.
would it keep the tape loop switch functional?
The tape loop switch only affects the loop INPUT on the BP26, NOT the output, those are selected by the source knob.
From the manual:
Tape Outputs: The “TO TAPE” outputs are selected by the rotary ‘SOURCE” knob and are provided as a recording output. This feed is unaffected by the operation of other front panel controls.
So all that happens is the OUTPUT signal from the BP26 is split to the input on the recorder and the input on the BHA, nothing more.
What I don't see yet is how it all works. Usually when plugging in the Headphone, the speakers are muted. In the tape loop the source is permanently to the "to tape" or "record". Speakers are not muted, right? So A/B 'ing the headphone/speakers is done with the mute switch? Or does that mute the source into the tape also connected to the BHA.
The sound from a source ONLY gets muted if a headphone is plugged into an integrated device, like a receiver or an amplifier that has the pre amp and the power amp in one box.
The BP26 is a pre amplifier, that has no headphone amplifier integrated. You will need a separate device for that, which is the BHA. To prevent the signal from reaching the loudspeakers you turn the poweramp (I do not know that you have, so as an example) 4B SST2 off, or you turn the volume on the BP26 to zero. The BHA then functions as the pre amplifier AND the power amplifier for your headphones. The BP26 ONLY functions as a source selector.
Flipping the tape switch to "from tape" or "play" still plays my tape?
Yes, no changes there. the BHA is ONLY connected to the tape output on the BP26, NOT to the input.
I see balanced (XLR's) and rca (SE) in's on the BHA back, that would be connected to the "to tape". In my case the SE. What setup would need the XLR's. Also I see a stereo-connection. What goes in there?
The BHA will be connected via the RCA, because the BP26 does not have a balanced rec out. There is no benefit from going from RCA to XLR in a cable.
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well thank you Anonamemouse!
one more: if split into the two (recorder and BHA) the signal halves? Would it be still strong enough, or put in other words, up to specification for either BHA and recorder?
Marius
btw, the two pics above with the tape loops, are no splitter-boxes, but the back of two headphone amps, that do have tape loop passthrough...
No, no boxes, just a splitter plug. The more electronics you introduce the more distortion and loss you get.
(http://www.headphone.com/productphotos/large/0060210000_102.jpg)
This indeed is all. The male end goes into the "tape out" on the BP26, then one end goes to the BHA, the other end goes to your recorder.
The tape loop switch only affects the loop INPUT on the BP26, NOT the output, those are selected by the source knob.
From the manual:
So all that happens is the OUTPUT signal from the BP26 is split to the input on the recorder and the input on the BHA, nothing more.
The sound from a source ONLY gets muted if a headphone is plugged into an integrated device, like a receiver or an amplifier that has the pre amp and the power amp in one box.
The BP26 is a pre amplifier, that has no headphone amplifier integrated. You will need a separate device for that, which is the BHA. To prevent the signal from reaching the loudspeakers you turn the poweramp (I do not know that you have, so as an example) 4B SST2 off, or you turn the volume on the BP26 to zero. The BHA then functions as the pre amplifier AND the power amplifier for your headphones. The BP26 ONLY functions as a source selector.
Yes, no changes there. the BHA is ONLY connected to the tape output on the BP26, NOT to the input.
The BHA will be connected via the RCA, because the BP26 does not have a balanced rec out. There is no benefit from going from RCA to XLR in a cable.
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well thank you Anonamemouse!
Graag gedaan!
one more: if split into the two (recorder and BHA) the signal halves? Would it be still strong enough, or put in other words, up to specification for either BHA and recorder?
According to James it is (http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=91385.msg994707#msg994707). Actually, unless you use both the BHA and your recorder at the same time, the signal is not split. It only is split in two if you have both the recorder and the BHA in use at the same time.
NB: When you are recording something it is NOT a good plan to turn the BHA on or off, because that will either cut the signal in half or boost the signal to double value.
btw, the two pics above with the tape loops, are no splitter-boxes, but the back of two headphone amps, that do have tape loop passthrough...
Trust me, you really don't need that.
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ok, thanks again!
It won't happen too often, and recording is almost always more comfortable through the Headphones.
not to be finicky, but I believe your last two sentences to be contradicting each other..it would be the exact reason why we do need it. Or at least why this adapter-thingy is not a real solution.
On or off, we need a pass through that does not interfere or change the signal, independent of the BHA being in or off.
nogmaals dank! :D thanks again,
Marius
Graag gedaan!
According to James it is. Actually, unless you use both the BHA and your recorder at the same time, the signal is not split. It only is split in two if you have both the recorder and the BHA in use.
NB: When you are recording something it is NOT a good plan to turn the BHA on or off, because that will either cut the signal in half or boost the signal to double value.
Trust me, you really don't need that.
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Hi Marius
I have been thinking about the issue with only one tape out on the BP 26 and I will ask engineering but maybe we can configure one of the two pairs of RCA OUTs to be unity gain?
Will let you know.
James
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:thumb: :thumb: :thumb:
James, the thinking never stops! Wonderful. Thanks for this.
(couldn't you ask engineering about a built in tape loop in the BHA also......;-) and if not, why haven;'t you considered it, or if you did, why did you decide not to .
o wait a minute, if you'd reconfigure, the BHA could be connected to that, and the tape loop would still be in use for the recorder, wouldn't it? If you'd make that switchable, I mean the rca out, it would be the ultimate in versatility. A mini switch on the back, just like on the Phono-amp, switch to MM or MC. Bp26 on steroids!
Marius
Hi Marius
I have been thinking about the issue with only one tape out on the BP 26 and I will ask engineering but maybe we can configure one of the two pairs of RCA OUTs to be unit gain?
Will let you know.
James
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Hi Marius
I have been thinking about the issue with only one tape out on the BP 26 and I will ask engineering but maybe we can configure one of the two pairs of RCA OUTs to be unity gain?
Will let you know.
James
Hi James
I often thought of that; for those who do not use the polarity switch maybe they could have their BP25/26 modified so that it could be used to switch the second unbalanced out either to pre or tape out #2.
I’m currently running my tape out to a BR60 at the listening position for headphone listening of movies but my main head-amp has to be disconnected, my previous had a loop out.
Could just add a splitter, but a second direct out from the BP25 would come in handy, just a thought.
Robert
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if split into the two (recorder and BHA) the signal halves? Would it be still strong enough
Since the splitter places the two devices in parallel, then the voltage on each parallel leg will remain the same. Only the load impedance that the source (BP26) sees will be reduced. Generally, the low output impedance of a solid state device can be split many times before it becomes a concern.
Whether the parallel devices (BHA & Tape unit) are powered up, matters not. The parallel load impedance of the BHA and Tape unit will alway be present while the splitter is connected.
I see no problem though.
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Since the splitter places the two devices in parallel, then the voltage on each parallel leg will remain the same. Only the load impedance that the source (BP26) sees will be reduced. Generally, the low output impedance of a solid state device can be split many times before it becomes a concern.
Whether the parallel devices (BHA & Tape unit) are powered up, matters not. The parallel load impedance of the BHA and Tape unit will alway be present while the splitter is connected.
I see no problem though.
Duh on my part... You are correct! I totally did not think of that... :duh:
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There's a picture of JT and that's not the womanising centre half, in Stereophile's coverage of TAVES clutching a headphone amp.
On a second note, since they've been mentioned before here, I heard some cans at the recent Whittlebury show. I am a Stax man but I was quite impressed by the Audeze but as for the HifiMan cans I couldnt understand what the fuss is all about.
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There's a picture of JT and that's not the womanising centre half, in Stereophile's coverage of TAVES clutching a headphone amp.
On a second note, since they've been mentioned before here, I heard some cans at the recent Whittlebury show. I am a Stax man but I was quite impressed by the Audeze but as for the HifiMan cans I couldnt understand what the fuss is all about.
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=52094)
http://www.stereophile.com/category/taves-2011?page=2
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On a second note, since they've been mentioned before here, I heard some cans at the recent Whittlebury show. I am a Stax man but I was quite impressed by the Audeze but as for the HifiMan cans I couldnt understand what the fuss is all about.
I can't comment on Stax or HiFiMan, but can say the Audeze LCD-2 rev. 2, is very much my choice over my Sennheiser HD800. Just about every review says that the LCD-2 is more listenable than the very accurate but comparatively cold and analytical Sennheisers.
Big question for me will be this: How do both the LCD-2 and HD800 sound when played through the BHA-1 when compared with my Grace Designs m903 and Schiit Lyr HP amps?
Dave
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Hi,
Is it going to have an inbuilt dac option?
Also, what are the output specs?
Thanks.
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Wasn't impressed with Senheiser either to tell you the truth.
Doubt the Bryston will be competitive price wise in the UK compared to the Schitt so then you'll have to weigh uo how much you value headphone listening.
Which preamp/integrated do you use and does it have a headphone o/p?
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Hi,
Is it going to have an inbuilt dac option?
Also, what are the output specs?
Thanks.
Hi Dune - no DAC - we have a DAC already - the BDA-1.
It will swing plus or minus 30 volts.
james
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Wasn't impressed with Senheiser either to tell you the truth.
Doubt the Bryston will be competitive price wise in the UK compared to the Schitt so then you'll have to weigh uo how much you value headphone listening.
Which preamp/integrated do you use and does it have a headphone o/p?
One of the reasons I bought the Schiit Lyr was because it's relatively so inexpensive, and wouldn't bust my budget in case I decided to buy the BHA-1.
I have a Bryston Preamp and it does have a headphone jack, which in terms of sound is virtually identical to that of the Grace Designs m902, which costs more than the expected price of the BHA-1. The Lyr, with the volume turned up high, has a hum (which probbly is something in my house wiring), but even then, to my ears sounds better than the Grace. The Grace can sound closer when played at high volumes, but still lacks the musicality of the Lyr.
The Sennheiser HD800 is great if you're looking for accuracy and are a sound engineer or in the recording business. I am in neither of these categories. Enjoyment is my measuring stick. I didn't know how dry and unexciting the HD800 is until I bought the LCD-2. The LCD-2 doesn't have the HD800's wide soundstage, but seems to be very precisely defined. These cans have an intimate sound, and the bottom end is incredible - deeper than I've ever heard, and very punchy.
So, getting back to Bryston. Will the BHA-1 sound as musical as the Lyr driving the LCD-2? Will it add excitement to the HD800? If there are differences, will they be, as you point out, significant enough to justify paying more than twice the price of a Lyr.
The answer to all these questions, as always in audio, are entirely subjective. There will be listeners who love the HD800 and Grace, and hate the Lyr and LCD-2. And still others (often myself included) who are ready to pay big dollars for small but wanted differences. Fortunately, I should be able to demo to BHA-1 to come to some conclusion I'm prepared to live with.
However, whatever that decision might be, I still haven't figured out how to split my time between a great main audio system (PMC MB2i speakers, 7BSST Squared amps), and a very good headphone setup, which becomes even more problematic when you own more than one set of cans and HP amps.
BTW, the LCD-2 rolls off in the very high end, where at first it seemed that cymbals were just not strongly presented. But I switched to better interconnects from my BDA-1, and now I'm getting a better result.
Dave
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I was interested on your thoughts reagarding the hp o/p of the Bryston pre-amp.
Interesting.
Will the BHA-1 offer a big step up on that to justify the expence, time will tell.
I've heard the top of the range Grados too but I would image a few hours with though would give me a headache.
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I was interested on your thoughts reagarding the hp o/p of the Bryston pre-amp.
Interesting.
Will the BHA-1 offer a big step up on that to justify the expence, time will tell.
I've heard the top of the range Grados too but I would image a few hours with though would give me a headache.
I was assured by someone who should know that if the BHA-1 doesn't sound better than the Bryston pre-amp headphone jack, then there was no point in building the BHA-1. Perfect logic, so the question should be how much better. This same person felt the preamp jack to be very good, and I agree given that it is as good as the pricey and excellent Grace m903.
I don't own the new Grado top end headphones, but have the RS-1s, which are quite old, but were once the best Grado made. I literally can't stand listening to them after hearing the HD800 and even better the LCD-2. But, once more, there are users who love Grados. Different strokes for different folks.
Dave
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Hi terrycym & DaveNote,
Have any of you tried Graham Slee headphone amps? They are manufactured in the UK. I have tried a few of the Solo models and they are reasonablly priced and sound very nice with most phones expensive or not so
Mark
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However, whatever that decision might be, I still haven't figured out how to split my time between a great main audio system (PMC MB2i speakers, 7BSST Squared amps), and a very good headphone setup, which becomes even more problematic when you own more than one set of cans and HP amps.
Dave
Interesting reading Dave, as a fellow MB2i and 7B SST2 user I too have been deliberating which headphone path to take as terrycym will know.
I've now tried, top end Stax, awesome, HD800, not overly impressed, Grado GS1000's which I really liked, but I decided to wait till the BHA-1 is actually available and see how certian headphones perform before making my final decison.
I had kind of decided to give the HE-6's a try as I was hoping that a top pair of orthodynamic's would give me the best of electrostatics and dynamics but it sounds that I should really still consider the LCD-2's.
Trouble is it is extremely difficult, if not impossible, to demo all these headphones, but at the same time reading a review can be of some help but ultimately you really need to live with the actual headphones you are interested in with the head amp you are going to use.
I really don't know how you can get a conclusion to this, other than buying 3 or 4 pairs of headphones :scratch:
Is the BHA-1 actually available to buy yet?
And as a likely SP3 owner, how good will the headphone jack be on the SP3?
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Mark, I've not heard the Graham Slee, but have noticed they are often mentioned.
Viper, I'm new to buying multiple headphones and HP amps, which I got into by accident. There is a whole community out there whose members own many amps and cans. I don't know what to suggest if you want to go into the whole thing, because unless you live in a very large city, you just won't be able to demo either the amps or the headphones. I bought my Grace m902, Schiit Lyr, HD800 and LCD-2 sight unseen. I don't defend buying this way, but this is the way the world is. See the topic I started on the demo being dead -
http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=97693.0
Your point about reviews proved, for me, to be helpful. But even these have to be taken carefully since they sometimes are off the mark. For example, one reviewer - a very good one - recently concluded the Stax is head and shoulders above all other cans. I've not heard the new ones, but he might be right. Yet his view of the LCD-2 was based on his using an earlier version. And as I have found, cables can make a big difference, and reviewers tend to use upgraded HP cables, which can cost an arm and a leg.
I guess there is a bad news good news thing about jumping into the HP world. The bad news is that you might have to spend a lot of money on speculation (i.e. no demo). The good news is that you spend a lot less than doing the same thing with top end audio gear.
My hope is that Bryston can do for the BHA-1 what it has done with the 7BSST squared amps - which is to make a very musical non-tubed amp. It seems to be particularly difficult to do as most of the top end HP amps use tubes.
Not much help I know, but food for thought.
Dave
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Is the BHA-1 actually available to buy yet?
And as a likely SP3 owner, how good will the headphone jack be on the SP3?
I preordered a BHA1 about 3 weeks ago and the rep said i should recieve it at the end of Oct to mid Nov. Still don't know of a price yet but , Stereophile claims it will be $1295USD. Not sure if it is the powered or non-powered version they were referring to.
I would think the headphone jack on the SP3 will be the same as the ones on the preamps. You are best off with the BHA to fully enjoy the dynamics and transients attack of your music with a dedicated amp.
Mark
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You are best off with the BHA to fully enjoy the dynamics and transients attack of your music with a dedicated amp.
How do you know Mark?
One would assume that the BHA would outperform the o/p on the pre but by how much and is the price worth the extra cost.
Until the unit has been released and listened to, this is all conjecture, surely?
I'm guessing it would cost £1,500 in the UK (based on how the BDP is priced over here). That's a lot of money for a headphone amp especially when you will probably already own a fairly respectable one in your pre-amp.
I can't see a lot being sold in the UK, not in this economic climate especially when stuff like Schitt is available at a 1/3 of the cost.
Others may think otherwise.
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How do you know Mark?
One would assume that the BHA would outperform the o/p on the pre but by how much and is the price worth the extra cost.
Until the unit has been released and listened to, this is all conjecture, surely?
I'm guessing it would cost £1,500 in the UK (based on how the BDP is priced over here). That's a lot of money for a headphone amp especially when you will probably already own a fairly respectable one in your pre-amp.
I can't see a lot being sold in the UK, not in this economic climate especially when stuff like Schitt is available at a 1/3 of the cost.
Others may think otherwise.
Just saw two of the Schiit models at a local store. Didn't have time to listen but they looked and felt very Brystonesque in their appearance and build quality.
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How do you know Mark?
One would assume that the BHA would outperform the o/p on the pre but by how much and is the price worth the extra cost.
Until the unit has been released and listened to, this is all conjecture, surely?
I'm guessing it would cost £1,500 in the UK (based on how the BDP is priced over here). That's a lot of money for a headphone amp especially when you will probably already own a fairly respectable one in your pre-amp.
I can't see a lot being sold in the UK, not in this economic climate especially when stuff like Schitt is available at a 1/3 of the cost.
Others may think otherwise.
You're right on the money (pun intended) when you say "Others may think otherwise." It all comes down to how much you use and value the headphone experience as to how much you're willing to spend on it. For those who love it who have the money, they will be willing to buy the top Stax for a stupendous price. For those who don't, $30 headphones just might be the upper limit of their purchase. It's the very same equation that audiophiles use when deciding to buy any equipment, for example Bryston 28Bs vs.4Bs. I have a friend in the UK who is mad for his new Grace Designs m903 which costs something in the £1500 range I believe. My m902 costs about $1400. I already had my respectable preamp HD jack, but bought it anyway. As I bought the HD800 already having the RS-1 Grado, and then the LCD-2 after the HD800. In fact, I had my more than respectable m902 and bought the better (IMO) Schiit Lyr anyway, and just might buy the BHA-1.
The answer to this litany of extravagance is this: A fool and his money are soon parted. Which just about explains how the audiophile mind works. :banghead:
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Different strokes for different folks.
Dave
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQMfN0UFqms
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQMfN0UFqms
Used the YouTube link. 1oldguy, you truly are one old guy, as am I.
Dave
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How do you know Mark?
One would assume that the BHA would outperform the o/p on the pre but by how much and is the price worth the extra cost.
Until the unit has been released and listened to, this is all conjecture, surely?
I'm guessing it would cost £1,500 in the UK (based on how the BDP is priced over here). That's a lot of money for a headphone amp especially when you will probably already own a fairly respectable one in your pre-amp.
I can't see a lot being sold in the UK, not in this economic climate especially when stuff like Schitt is available at a 1/3 of the cost.
Others may think otherwise.
Sorry, i meant you are better off with a dedicated head phone amplifier and not a preamps head phone output.
Mark
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Sorry, i meant you are better off with a dedicated head phone amplifier and not a preamps head phone output.
Mark
Mark, I prefer a dedicated headphone amp, but since my Bryston preamp headphone jack sounds the same as my Grace m902, it seems to me that some users, especially those who do not use headphones frequently, could be better off - especially financially - sticking with their preamps if they are satisfied with the sound they get. terrycym, in view of his comments on this topic, might be one of these users.
I also have a reason to proceed prudently as far as the BHA-1 is concerned. Having invested close to $2000 on two excellent dedicated HP amps, and not being a full-time HP user, I necessarily must be very demanding of the BHA-1 performance when I demo it. That is unfair to Bryston because I did not demo the other amps, but that is one of the many consequences of the fact that the demo is all but dead (and therefore unfair to audio consumers) for many products in many places.
Dave
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Preliminary literature for Bryston headphone amp:
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=52308)
james
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James, I'm confused by the paragraph on the first page of the brochure about changing a single ended 1/4" plug. Clearly there is a jack for such a plug on the BHA-1, which means I suppose you could use a 1/4" plug. So I'm wondering what this paragraph is telling readers. Under what circumstances would users need to, or want to, use the "remedy" of changing such a jack or getting an adapter for a headphone?
Dave
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James, I'm confused by the paragraph on the first page of the brochure about changing a single ended 1/4" plug. Clearly there is a jack for such a plug on the BHA-1, which means I suppose you could use a 1/4" plug. So I'm wondering what this paragraph is telling readers. Under what circumstances would users need to, or want to, use the "remedy" of changing such a jack or getting an adapter for a headphone?
Dave
Hi Dave,
If the headphone cable has 4 conductors then we can modify the cable from a 1/4 inch phone plug to a Balanced XLR 4 pin or left/right stereo XLR 3 pin connector.
james
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Preliminary literature for Bryston headphone amp:
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=52308)
james
Hi James, is there a pdf format or a higher rez picture? I can hardly read the prints...
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Hi James, is there a pdf format or a higher rez picture? I can hardly read the prints...
Yes - email me at Bryston - I am off to RMAF show so I will try to get it to you soon.
james
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Yes - email me at Bryston - I am off to RMAF show so I will try to get it to you soon.
james
Have a good trip! :D
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Hi James,
Have you figured out a cost for the powered and non-powered yet?
Has Bryston started manufacturing the BHA.
Thanks,
Mark
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Hi James,
Have you figured out a cost for the powered and non-powered yet?
Has Bryston started manufacturing the BHA.
Thanks,
Mark
Hi Mark
Yes- $1295 suggested list US for the internal power supply version as an introductory offer. Still working on the non powered supply version but should be about $1100.
James
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Hi Mark
Yes- $1295 suggested list US for the internal power supply version as an introductory offer. Still working on the non powered supply version but should be about $1100.
James
Great, thanks JT.... I can hardly wait to get it :thumb:
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Hi James,
Would the powered version be power-bypassable?
I have the Bp1.5 so dont need the powered version, but would like it to be futureproof, and as versatile as possible. Might well be I 'd use it in another setup, where the Bp1.5 is not around...
Marius
Hi Mark
Yes- $1295 suggested list US for the internal power supply version as an introductory offer. Still working on the non powered supply version but should be about $1100.
James
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Hi James,
Would the powered version be power-bypassable?
I have the Bp1.5 so dont need the powered version, but would like it to be futureproof, and as versatile as possible. Might well be I 'd use it in another setup, where the Bp1.5 is not around...
Marius
I do not think so as the backboards are different but you could change the backboard and install the transformer - I will ask engineering.
james
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HI James,
Ok please do. Great.
Would have hoped for a universal backboard, with the BHA having a powersource installed, and an extra connection for the external BP1.5. If plugged in, use the external Bp1.5, if not plugged in use the internal powersource.
It's no price concern, just a matter of universal flexibility.
Hope to hear from the engineers..
and of course still waiting for an answer about the tapeloop pass-through too.
Marius
I do not think so as the backboards are different but you could change the backboard and install the transformer - I will ask engineering.
james
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HI James,
Ok please do. Great.
Would have hoped for a universal backboard, with the BHA having a powersource installed, and an extra connection for the external BP1.5. If plugged in, use the external Bp1.5, if not plugged in use the internal powersource.
It's no price concern, just a matter of universal flexibility.
Hope to hear from the engineers..
and of course still waiting for an answer about the tapeloop pass-through too.
Marius
No tape loop pass-through.
james
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No, I meant your suggestion of using the seconde out's on the bp26 and modify those .
Marius
No tape loop pass-through.
james
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No, I meant your suggestion of using the seconde out's on the bp26 and modify those .
Marius
Yes that can be done but not by the customer of course.
James
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Of course , I wouldnt dare. :nono:
Yes that can be done but not by the customer of course.
James
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Hi James,
I'm just about to order a BP-1.5 to go with my SP3, now I've got the ordering bug again and am wondering if it is possible to order a BHA-1 yet for the UK? and if so, how much for the non power supply version?
Thanks,
-
Hi James,
I'm just about to order a BP-1.5 to go with my SP3, now I've got the ordering bug again and am wondering if it is possible to order a BHA-1 yet for the UK? and if so, how much for the non power supply version?
Thanks,
Hi Vipers,
You would have to check with PMC on the pricing - in Canada the non-transformer version is $200 less. We have run into some metal work issues so we are still about 3-4 weeks away from release.
james
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Hi Vipers,
You would have to check with PMC on the pricing - in Canada the non-transformer version is $200 less. We have run into some metal work issues so we are still about 3-4 weeks away from release.
james
Thanks James, I'll check with PMC tomorrow.
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Hi James,
I'm just about to order a BP-1.5 to go with my SP3, now I've got the ordering bug again and am wondering if it is possible to order a BHA-1 yet for the UK? and if so, how much for the non power supply version?
Thanks,
Chances are that if you fly to Toronto, rent a car to drive to Petersborough, shake James's hand, load the boxes into the trunk and fly back to the UK you will be a lot cheaper off than when buying it through PMC...
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Chances are that if you fly to Toronto, rent a car to drive to Petersborough, shake James's hand, load the boxes into the trunk and fly back to the UK you will be a lot cheaper off than when buying it through PMC...
Then you'll get no support from PMC and you'll have to negotiate a return to the factory if it goes wrong?
I doubt that Bryston would do this. It's unethical, they'll be shafting PMC's margins
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Chances are that if you fly to Toronto, rent a car to drive to Petersborough, shake James's hand, load the boxes into the trunk and fly back to the UK you will be a lot cheaper off than when buying it through PMC...
Good idea, I could do with a holiday :)
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Regarding the BP1.5, does anyone know if it comes with the MPS-2 as standard or does it have to be bought as an extra?
Thanks.
-
Regarding the BP1.5, does anyone know if it comes with the MPS-2 as standard or does it have to be bought as an extra?
Thanks.
Hi Vipers
The MPS is extra.
James
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Hi Vipers
The MPS is extra.
James
Thanks James, now that I've sold the BP26 that means the BP1.5 + MPS-2 comes in at around £4500, that may be a bit rich for me at the moment, shame, at least I've got the SP3 to look forward to.
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What is the status? Are the models with the external power supply now shipping? There doesn't seem to be any info on the website.
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What is the status? Are the models with the external power supply now shipping? There doesn't seem to be any info on the website.
Hi
Sorry slingshot - two issues came up - initially metal work changes due to a layout change caused a short delay and then fortuitously as we were doing some more research on the headphone circuits and we found a circuit that is just superb so we are changing the original design to reflect those changes.
James
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HI James,
Since you are redesigning: considering a Tape-loop Passthrough too?
Thanks,
Marius
(fingers crossed)
Hi
Sorry slingshot - two issues came up - initially metal work changes due to a layout change caused a short delay and then fortuitously as we were doing some more research on the headphone circuits and we found a circuit that is just superb so we are changing the original design to reflect those changes.
James
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HI James,
Since you are redesigning: considering a Tape-loop Passthrough too?
Thanks,
Marius
Hi Marius
No sorry that is not in the cards. We are not redesigning the overall layout just the gain stages.
Jame
James
(fingers crossed)
-
bummer..
believed to have seen a speck of light in your metal work changes.....
will have to wait for Bha-2 then I guess. Or....well, just have to hear it first, I just might be tempted anyway.
Marius
-
James, do you have an update on the estimated shipping date for the BHA-1?
Dave
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James, do you have an update on the estimated shipping date for the BHA-1?
Dave
Hi Dave,
I hope by Christmas
james
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Thanks, James. Good to get an idea of availability.
BTW, with the new circuit you're using, how does the sound now differ from the original one you were going to use?
Dave
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Thanks, James. Good to get an idea of availability.
BTW, with the new circuit you're using, how does the sound now differ from the original one you were going to use?
Dave
I find it a bit more listen into - so I find the resolution of small details are better.
james
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Thanks, again, James. The reason I'm probing you about the sound is that now that I am running 7BSST2 amps, I've discovered something new in the Bryston sound that wasn't in the 7BSSTs, or the other Bryston amps I have had. They have always been very accurate, but we're missing somethng that until recently I had not heard in my system. I have only one component that uses tubes, and it has a kind of musicality (is that the word?) that the 7BSST2s now give me to an unprecedented degree. That tube component is a headphone amp (like the sound, but not the tubes and all that goes with them). The headphone jack on my BP 26 is excellent, but much less musical and enjoyable than the tube headphone jack I'm running. So I'm wondering if the BHA-1 is likely to have the musical sound of the Bryston squared amps?
Dave
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Thanks, again, James. The reason I'm probing you about the sound is that now that I am running 7BSST2 amps, I've discovered something new in the Bryston sound that wasn't in the 7BSSTs, or the other Bryston amps I have had. They have always been very accurate, but we're missing somethng that until recently I had not heard in my system. I have only one component that uses tubes, and it has a kind of musicality (is that the word?) that the 7BSST2s now give me to an unprecedented degree. That tube component is a headphone amp (like the sound, but not the tubes and all that goes with them). The headphone jack on my BP 26 is excellent, but much less musical and enjoyable than the tube headphone jack I'm running. So I'm wondering if the BHA-1 is likely to have the musical sound of the Bryston squared amps?
Dave
Hi Dave,
The demo will tell of course but I could do a special BHA-1 for you with a small tube in the output stage :lol:
james
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James - Great offer for a tube lover! :lol: But I'm not one. I like the sound, but dislike the hum I have on my unit, and don't like the prospective hassle about finding and buying tubes. Guess I'm an incurable solid state guy.
I'm interested in the BHA-1 because (a) Bryston has never disappointed me, and (b) and there will be no tubes in it.
But setting everything - including appreciated pleasantries - about tubes aside, I notice you didn't answer my question.
Dave
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James - Great offer for a tube lover! :lol: But I'm not one. I like the sound, but dislike the hum I have on my unit, and don't like the prospective hassle about finding and buying tubes. Guess I'm an incurable solid state guy.
I'm interested in the BHA-1 because (a) Bryston has never disappointed me, and (b) and there will be no tubes in it.
But setting everything - including appreciated pleasantries - about tubes aside, I notice you didn't answer my question.
Dave
Well I do not think it is something I can definitively answer for you Dave. One man's musicality may differ from another's. Our goal has always been to provide as accurate a signal path as we know how to do from input to output.
james
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Thanks for your answer, James. Of course, you're right. There is one thing, however, that must have been part of your design objectives, namely that the BHA-1 must sound markedly better than the headphone jack on other Bryston equipment. If that wasn't one of your goals, then not only would there have been no point to the project, but the result would cheese off all Bryston preamp owners who would ask why they spent $1300 to get a box that does only what their headphone jacks already do.
Dave
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Thanks for your answer, James. Of course, you're right. There is one thing, however, that must have been part of your design objectives, namely that the BHA-1 must sound markedly better than the headphone jack on other Bryston equipment. If that wasn't one of your goals, then not only would there have been no point to the project, but the result would cheese off all Bryston preamp owners who would ask why they spent $1300 to get a box that does only what their headphone jacks already do.
Dave
Well I guess that will be a wait and see :D
james
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SR 325 and GS 1000. I am still experimenting but I would say the dynamic contrasts and transients would be what I notice most between the preamp and the BHD - the more difficult to drive the more noticeable it is of course.
James
Dave, I believe James answered this question - at least his earlier impressions, in response to a similar question I asked. It sound like if your headphones are more demanding from a power perspective the differences between the bp26 headphone jack and the BHA will be move evident. It also sounds like dynamics and transients are the primary difference. Only an audition will reveal what comes through on your headphones. Bye-the-way, Dave, what are you using?
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Dave, I believe James answered this question - at least his earlier impressions, in response to a similar question I asked. It sound like if your headphones are more demanding from a power perspective the differences between the bp26 headphone jack and the BHA will be move evident. It also sounds like dynamics and transients are the primary difference. Only an audition will reveal what comes through on your headphones. Bye-the-way, Dave, what are you using?
My headphones are Audeze LCD-2s (which are not power demanding) and I am driving them with a Schiit Lyr. I was using Sennheiser HD800s with a Grace Designs m902, both of which I bought without a demo and gave away because while great were just too cold and analytical for my taste once I had the LCD-2s. The person I gave them to is producing music, so for him they are perfect. The Lyr is driving me nuts because it has a hum in it with my preferred set of tubes. The bottom line for me is that I would like a solid state HP amp that sounds like the Lyr. James no doubt doubt has given the best answer he can, but perhaps unrealistically, I was hoping or something else.
Dave
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Hi James,
Is there actually a difference in the level of sound quality between the internal-PSU version and the external-PSU version? Or is the external-PSU version just offered as a convenience for customers who already have the MPS-2? If there is a difference, what is the difference in terms of percentage? I know that that's pretty subjective, but if the external-PSU version offered 100% maximum sound quality, what percentage would the internal-PSU version offer?
Thanks!
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Hi James,
Is there actually a difference in the level of sound quality between the internal-PSU version and the external-PSU version? Or is the external-PSU version just offered as a convenience for customers who already have the MPS-2? If there is a difference, what is the difference in terms of percentage? I know that that's pretty subjective, but if the external-PSU version offered 100% maximum sound quality, what percentage would the internal-PSU version offer?
Thanks!
Hi,
Correct - just a lower cost alternative for folks with a MPS-2 already.
james
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Hi James, is the BHP-1 ready for Christmas sales?? Any updated pictures of its front and rear?? :thumb:
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Hi James, is the BHP-1 ready for Christmas sales?? Any updated pictures of its front and rear?? :thumb:
We are in the final stages so should have some pictures soon.
james
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We are in the final stages so should have some pictures soon.
james
Excellent news, I nearly ordered a pair of Grado PS1000's today in anticipation but thought I'd better wait till the BHA-1 is definitely in my hands.
The million dollar question James, will the BHA-1 outperform the headphone out on my SP3?
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Excellent news, I nearly ordered a pair of Grado PS1000's today in anticipation but thought I'd better wait till the BHA-1 is definitely in my hands.
The million dollar question James, will the BHA-1 outperform the headphone out on my SP3?
Hi
I think so but that is a good question because the headphone amp on the SP3 actually has a dedicated Class A Discrete circuit driving the phones. I think it will come down to the difficulty of the load as the BHA-1 will be more capable in that circumstance.
james
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Hi
I think so but that is a good question because the headphone amp on the SP3 actually has a dedicated Class A Discrete circuit driving the phones. I think it will come down to the difficulty of the load as the BHA-1 will be more capable in that circumstance.
james
James are you saying you don't know if the BHA-1 outperforms the headphone option on other Bryston gear? If so, that is troubling indeed. I would be terribly cheesed off to have purchased a BHA-1 only to discover it did not outperform the headphone jack on my BP. It seems that the No. 1 design goal of the BHA-1 would have been, at a minimum, to outperform the headphone capability of the SP3 or that of other Bryston gear. Haven't you compared the BHA-1 to the headphone options of other Bryston Gear?
Dave
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James are you saying you don't know if the BHA-1 outperforms the headphone option on other Bryston gear? If so, that is troubling indeed. I would be terribly cheesed off to have purchased a BHA-1 only to discover it did not outperform the headphone jack on my BP. It seems that the No. 1 design goal of the BHA-1 would have been, at a minimum, to outperform the headphone capability of the SP3 or that of other Bryston gear. Haven't you compared the BHA-1 to the headphone options of other Bryston Gear?
Dave
Hi Dave
Nope have not compared the SP3 with the BHA -1 as it is still being played with.
Let me try to explain this differently. The BHA -1 comes into its own as the difficulty of the headphone load becomes more difficult. Much like amplifiers the speaker load has a lot to do with the amp choosen to drive it adequately. The more difficult the load the more the amp has to work therefore a 28B instead of a 3B.
Same with headphones - the more difficult the load the more the BHA-1 makes sense. If your headphones are really easy to drive then I would probably say the SP3 would work very well indeed :thumb:
James
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I have the Audeze LCD-2's, which really need a couple watts of power into 50-60 ohms, and can handle up to 15w. Do you know what the new amp will be rated at yet? Voltage swing?
I looked through a few pages of this thread and couldn't find an answer. Apologies if it's been posted.
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I have the Audeze LCD-2's, which really need a couple watts of power into 50-60 ohms, and can handle up to 15w. Do you know what the new amp will be rated at yet? Voltage swing?
I looked through a few pages of this thread and couldn't find an answer. Apologies if it's been posted.
Plus or minus 33 volts of swing.
james
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Plus or minus 33 volts of swing.
james
James, as a followup to your answer to my questions above, and mamba315's specs about the LCD2 headphones, would you consider LCD2 headphones hard or difficult to drive?
Dave
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James, as a followup to your answerr to my questions above, and mamba315's specs about the LCD2 headphones, would you consider LCD2 headphones hard or difficult to drive?
Dave
Hi Dave
Can you send me a link?
James
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Hi Dave
Can you send me a link?
James
James, here are the LCD2 specs:
The frequency response is flat between 10hz and 1Khz. At higher frequencies the response is adjusted for headphone listening.
Impedance: 50 Ohms, nominal
Sensitivity: 91 dB/1mW
Maximum power handling: 15W
Frequency Response: 5 Hz – 20 KHz, usable high frequency extension 50 KHz.
Distortion: Less than 1% even at full output.
Impedance: 50 Ohms, nominal
Efficiency: 91 dB/1mW
Maximum output: 133dB, 15W
Active diaphragm area: 6.17 square inches.
Contact pressure: 1.5 N, adjustable, comfortable headband.
Weight: 550 g, without cable.
Maximum diaphragm excursion: 2.5mm p-p
Dave
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Hi James, since you are checking up on this can you also have a look at LCD-3?
https://audeze.com/audeze-lcd-3 (https://audeze.com/audeze-lcd-3)
Specs
- Planar Magnetic Transducers.
- Custom designed Zebra wood (zebrano) earcups.
- Specially designed lambskin leather earpads.
- Left and right transducers have matched sensitivity and frequency response within +/- 0.5dB.
- Specially designed self- closing, acoustically transparent magnetic structure with highest grade Neodymium magnets.
- Frequency Response: 5Hz - 20KHz, usable high frequency extension 50KHz.
- Distortion: less than 1% even at full output.
- Impedance: 50Ohms, nominal
- Maximum diaphragm excursion: 2.5mm p- p
- Efficiency: 93dB/1mW - Maximum output: 133dB, 15W
-Transducer active diaphragm area: 6.17 sq. in.
- Input cable: Custom cable with mini XLR connectors
- Weight: 550g, without cable.
Thanks!
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I don't understand James's comments about drive and stuff but from what I can see is the main difference between the SP3 headphone socket and the BHA is that the BHA has balanced outputs.
I have AKG headphones which just have a normal 1/4" plug so the BHA will be of no benefit to me? In fact, all the headphone I've seen use jack plug or am I missing the point somewhere?
Getting confused by all this talk of specifications
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James, here are the LCD2 specs:
The frequency response is flat between 10hz and 1Khz. At higher frequencies the response is adjusted for headphone listening.
Impedance: 50 Ohms, nominal
Sensitivity: 91 dB/1mW
Maximum power handling: 15W
Frequency Response: 5 Hz – 20 KHz, usable high frequency extension 50 KHz.
Distortion: Less than 1% even at full output.
Impedance: 50 Ohms, nominal
Efficiency: 91 dB/1mW
Maximum output: 133dB, 15W
Active diaphragm area: 6.17 square inches.
Contact pressure: 1.5 N, adjustable, comfortable headband.
Weight: 550 g, without cable.
Maximum diaphragm excursion: 2.5mm p-p
Dave
Hi Dave,
Spoke with Stuart Taylor and he said these phones are on the upper side of difficult to drive but no problem for the BHA-1.
james
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Hi Dave,
Spoke with Stuart Taylor and he said these phones are on the upper side of difficult to drive but no problem for the BHA-1.
james
Thanks James. Love my LCD2s, so piecing the information above together, it looks like the BHA-1 should outperform the headphone jack on my BP using them. I'm looking forward to taking my headphones down to my Bryston dealer to demo the BHA-1 when it comes, and to ask him to set it up so I can compare it with the BP HP jack.
Dave
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I heard the LCD headphones at the Whittlebury Show last September and they were the best sounding headphones at the show, excepting the Stax SR-009's of course.
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Low impedance causes a headphone to be more difficult to drive. The BP26 manual states that the headphone output should be used with headphones having an impedance of greater than 50 Ohms. The BHA-1 must not have that limitation. The LCD2 impedance of 50 Ohms is at the lower limit of the BP26.
Tony
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Low impedance causes a headphone to be more difficult to drive. The BP26 manual states that the headphone output should be used with headphones having an impedance of greater than 50 Ohms. The BHA-1 must not have that limitation. The LCD2 impedance of 50 Ohms is at the lower limit of the BP26.
Tony
Hi Tony,
Correct - a lot of phones these days are at 32 ohms.
james
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Low impedance causes a headphone to be more difficult to drive. The BP26 manual states that the headphone output should be used with headphones having an impedance of greater than 50 Ohms. The BHA-1 must not have that limitation. The LCD2 impedance of 50 Ohms is at the lower limit of the BP26.
Tony
Ok then, that's a reason the get the BHA over the socket on the SP3
-
Low impedance causes a headphone to be more difficult to drive. The BP26 manual states that the headphone output should be used with headphones having an impedance of greater than 50 Ohms. The BHA-1 must not have that limitation. The LCD2 impedance of 50 Ohms is at the lower limit of the BP26.
Tony
But you also need to consider that the headphones that typically have less than 50ohms impendence, also don't require much power to operate. Most headphones designed for mobile devices are 32ohm / 16 ohm but their power requirements are so minimal - I can't see it being difficult for the BP26 to drive. My Grado SR80's operate fine with the BP6 headphone jack and I don't expect would perform noticeably better on the BHA-1, given there relative ease to drive.
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I heard the LCD headphones at the Whittlebury Show last September and they were the best sounding headphones at the show, excepting the Stax SR-009's of course.
Terry, years ago I had an entry level Stax, and listened to the top end several years ago and I wasn't blown away. Of course, not having heard the 009's, I can have no opinion, although they are raved about everywhere. And, of course, they cost a King's ransom - certainly more than I could justify for my use.
But the LCD2! After I got mine and used them for a while, I knew I wouldn't be using my other headphones. Gave away my Sennheiser HD800s and Grado RS-1s.
I'm running the LCD2s with a Lyr now - lots of power - but I'd prefer a solid state amp and Bryston has never failed me yet. So I'm hoping the BHA-1 outperforms the Lyr.
Dave
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So I'm hoping the BHA-1 outperforms the Lyr.
At $999 (?) for the Canadian-built Bryston BHA-1 vs. $449 for the USA-built Schiit Lyr, I would say "I would hope so!"
Steve
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But you also need to consider that the headphones that typically have less than 50ohms impendence, also don't require much power to operate. Most headphones designed for mobile devices are 32ohm / 16 ohm but their power requirements are so minimal - I can't see it being difficult for the BP26 to drive. My Grado SR80's operate fine with the BP6 headphone jack and I don't expect would perform noticeably better on the BHA-1, given there relative ease to drive.
Excellent points. I run my LCD2s on my BP26 with no problem and having only to increase the volume setting. And I have used it with my HD800s, RS-1s, SR80s, and KRK KNS3800s (surprisingly good). So I agree entirely that the BP26 has no difficulty driving lower impedance headphones. But my problem is that the BP26, like the Grace Designs m902 I used to have, is this in terms of headphones: very accurate, but cold, analytical and quite frankly, not as enjoyable as listening to cans on the Lyr.
My 7BSST2s while being very accurate, are not cold, and have a lot of the warmth I like in the Lyr.
Bottom line: I'm hoping the BHA-1 does more than simply being able to dive low impedance cans. I want it to do with my headphones what the 7BSST2s have done for my MB2is.
Dave
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Headphones work exactly like speakers - as the impedance goes down you need more current - as the impedance goes up you need more voltage. Distortion increases drastically if the headphone section can not provide the proper voltage or current as needed.
james
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Excellent points. I run my LCD2s on my BP26 with no problem and having only to increase the volume setting. And I have used it with my HD800s, RS-1s, SR80s, and KRK KNS3800s (surprisingly good). So I agree entirely that the BP26 has no difficulty driving lower impedance headphones. But my problem is that the BP26, like the Grace Designs m902 I used to have, is this in terms of headphones: very accurate, but cold, analytical and quite frankly, not as enjoyable as listening to cans on the Lyr.
My 7BSST2s while being very accurate, are not cold, and have a lot of the warmth I like in the Lyr.
Bottom line: I'm hoping the BHA-1 does more than simply being able to dive low impedance cans. I want it to do with my headphones what the 7BSST2s have done for my MB2is.
Dave
That's a very specific question Dave - one that I don't believe has been directly addressed. In simple general terms, acknowledging that this will vary depending on the headphones, the question then is:
Does the BHA-1 sound different, specifically in term of warmth/body and perhaps liquidity/smoothness, than the integrated headphone amps supplied standard in Bryston preamp/processors?
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At $999 (?) for the Canadian-built Bryston BHA-1 vs. $449 for the USA-built Schiit Lyr, I would say "I would hope so!"
Steve
Steve, as I understand it, the BHA-1 will come out at about $1300. My experience is that paying more for audio equipment often correlates to better performance, but I've found that a higher priced piece of equipment doesn't always get me more of what I want, or the performance I'm looking for.
Here's a perfect example: I paid over $1500 for a Grace Designs m902 DAC/headphone amp, without a demo (had no choice). It is a beautiful piece of equipment, with lots of features and worked as advertised. I bought the much cheaper Lyr for a lark, but then discovered that I like the sound it produced much more and realized I simply wouldn't be using the Grace. So I gave it away.
Because I've been buying Bryston gear for 33 years, I'm altogether prepared to believe that the BHA-1 will be excellent. That's what Bryston does. But the replacement cost for my BP26 is something like $4000 and it is not giving me what I want in a headphone operation, while the Lyr at about the tenth of the price is giving me more of what I want. If the BHA-1 gives me what I want - sound more like the Lyr but without tubes, and with a balance control and balanced output options - I'll go for it. But my experience with headphone gear tells me that price alone is not the only factor to consider.
Dave
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That's a very specific question Dave - one that I don't believe has been directly addressed. In simple general terms, acknowledging that this will vary depending on the headphones, the question then is:
Does the BHA-1 sound different, specifically in term of warmth/body and perhaps liquidity/smoothness, than the integrated headphone amps supplied standard in Bryston preamp/processors?
Thank you, SoundGame. You have asked a question I've tried to get the answer to from James for months, but obviously I have not used the right words and have fumbled the ball. I hope that now that you have expressed it so well, James will be able to answer it.
I've also tried to make the point that unless the BHA-1 is better not only in the terms you have described, but in every other way, then why in hell would Bryston want to have developed it, or, in fact, dare to sell it to its loyal customers?
if it isn't better than the headphone operation on a Bryston integrated device like the SP3 or BP26, then why would Bryston have spent time, effort and money to develop it and bring it to market? I would like to know what James's ultimate goals were for the BHA-1. A headphone amp for users without Bryston integrated devices? A headphone amp just to add one more device to that growing market?
James is great at keeping his ear to to ground in terms of what Bryston customers want. It seems to me he discovered a lot of us are into headphones. So if his intent was not to do better than the headphone option many of us have already on our Bryston integrated devices, then with respect, what was the point?
And if you owned an SP3 or BP26, went out and bought a BHA-1 on faith (as I did with my BDA and BDP), only to discover that it performed no better than your headphone jack, wouldn't you be pissed off? I would.
Dave
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I've also tried to make the point that unless the BHA-1 is better not only in the terms you have described, but in every other way, then why in hell would Bryston want to have developed it, or, in fact, dare to sell it to its loyal customers?
I'm new to this Board and I am sorry to make my very first post one in which I disagree with a regular. But, I don't agree. Not every potential customer is "one of it's loyal customers" as you apparently see yourself. Take me. I don't presently have any Bryston gear, but I do have dedicated two channel system that I am quite happy with. Thanks to purchasing a pair of Audeze LCD-2s, I am in the market for a top tier dedicated headphone amp that will drive the Audeze's to their full potential. My pre-amp is an Audioprism Mantissa that has been modified/upgraded by the original designer. It does not possess a headphone out. I love it and see absolutely no need to replace my pre-amp with one that has a headphone output like the Brystons. For me, the Bryston BHA-1 looks like a great candidate for these particular headphones.
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It seems to me he discovered a lot of us are into headphones. So if his intent was not to do better than the headphone option many of us have already on our Bryston integrated devices, then with respect, what was the point?
Ah, but there is a point. What about if you don't have a Bryston pre-amp but something else with no headphone output?
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I've also tried to make the point that unless the BHA-1 is better not only in the terms you have described, but in every other way, then why in hell would Bryston want to have developed it, or, in fact, dare to sell it to its loyal customers?
if it isn't better than the headphone operation on a Bryston integrated device like the SP3 or BP26, then why would Bryston have spent time, effort and money to develop it and bring it to market? I would like to know what James's ultimate goals were for the BHA-1. A headphone amp for users without Bryston integrated devices? A headphone amp just to add one more device to that growing market?
James is great at keeping his ear to to ground in terms of what Bryston customers want. It seems to me he discovered a lot of us are into headphones. So if his intent was not to do better than the headphone option many of us have already on our Bryston integrated devices, then with respect, what was the point?
Dave
Fsonicsmith is the point. You see a growing market in head-fi and you develop a product in the hopes of getting a piece of that market and expand your business and your customer base. You need to bring new customers on board on an ongoing basis to grow and to replace existing customers that are done buying or move to other brands. So you get into digital and into head-fi
and any other niches it makes sense for you to attempt to exploit. Or you just keep on churning out amps that you can't really improve on much more to a mature and shrinking customer base until you can't afford to keep the lights on anymore. The tendency is for existing Bryston customers to see verything Bryston does from the perspective of everything they do being an attempt to further cater to existing customers. It ain't necessarily so.
D.D.
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Ah, but there is a point. What about if you don't have a Bryston pre-amp but something else with no headphone output?
Terry, I don't disagree that this would be a valid reason for Bryston to produce a stand-alone headphone amp. But Bryston has been very good at expanding its product line in a way to give its existing customer base a reason to buy something new. James can confirm whether or not this has been part of their product planning. But I would venture to guess that this may have been one of the reasons it felt it could go ahead with a BDA, a BDC and a BDP. Indeed, if you follow this circle you'll find James, from time to time, asking members what they would think about Bryston making this or that kind of gear. Isn't he toying with the idea of Bryston speakers right now, and running a thread about his prototype?
in short, certainly, a BHA-1 would be a good idea for those who don't have other headphone jacks on their systems, but my guess is that Bryston looks first to the support of its existing customers, who, like me, buy and buy again, and who invariably pitch Bryston to friends and family who have yet to discover Bryston.
Dave
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Fsonicsmith is the point. You see a growing market in head-fi and you develop a product in the hopes of getting a piece of that market and expand your business and your customer base. You need to bring new customers on board on an ongoing basis to grow and to replace existing customers that are done buying or move to other brands. So you get into digital and into head-fi
and any other niches it makes sense for you to attempt to exploit. Or you just keep on churning out amps that you can't really improve on much more to a mature and shrinking customer base until you can't afford to keep the lights on anymore. The tendency is for existing Bryston customers to see verything Bryston does from the perspective of everything they do being an attempt to further cater to existing customers. It ain't necessarily so.
D.D.
D.D. I don't disagree that in developing a new product, Bryston surely must consider the possibility of tapping new markets. But a company that works so hard to please and keep its current customers happy, and more I importantly, keep them coming back to buy more Bryston gear, has to put them into the mix of product development. These two considerations are not either or, they are not mutually exclusive. I'm sure other great companies do the same thing - refinement of older products, introduction of new, and trying not to cheese off existing customers.
But I'm only guessing. What does James have to say?
James, in developing the BHA-1, weren't you interested in how owners of existing Bryston gear might like it? Or were you looking solely into breaking into a new market to attract new customers? Or were you doing both?
Dave
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Terry, I don't disagree that this would be a valid reason for Bryston to produce a stand-alone headphone amp. But Bryston has been very good at expanding its product line in a way to give its existing customer base a reason to buy something new. James can confirm whether or not this has been part of their product planning. But I would venture to guess that this may have been one of the reasons it felt it could go ahead with a BDA, a BDC and a BDP. Indeed, if you follow this circle you'll find James, from time to time, asking members what they would think about Bryston making this or that kind of gear. Isn't he toying with the idea of Bryston speakers right now, and running a thread about his prototype?
in short, certainly, a BHA-1 would be a good idea for those who don't have other headphone jacks on their systems, but my guess is that Bryston looks first to the support of its existing customers, who, like me, buy and buy again, and who invariably pitch Bryston to friends and family who have yet to discover Bryston.
Dave
I believe that Bryston was striving to meet two objectives:
1) satisfy the needs of those who are looking for just a stand-alone headphone amp (whether new or existing Bryston customers). Even existing Bryston customers with a B26 preamp may also want a dedicated headphone amp for a setup in another room etc.
2) create a headphone amp that went above and beyond the current performance parameters and functionality of it's existing integrated headphone amplifiers. They could have just taken their existing integrated headphone amplifiers and outboarded it in a separate box...they didn't, they went through the process of increasing it's capabilities, adding functionality e.g. XLR outputs and making it capable of now driving virtually (if not all) headphones on the planet.
What I think would be good to have here, to satisfy a number of questions, is a comparison of features + performance specifications between the BHA-1 vs the standard in-board headphone amp in Bryston preamp/processors. Specs don't say it all but they will help to illustrate the technical performance differences.
I assume that the headphone amp in the BP6, BP16, BP26 are identical but I'm not sure if the SP3 is an evolution and enhancement and actually closer to the BHA-1. I wonder - was there anything learned through the BHA-1 engineering effort that will actually lead now to better in-board headphone amps in Bryston products???
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D.D. I don't disagree that in developing a new product, Bryston surely must consider the possibility of tapping new markets. But a company that works so hard to please and keep its current customers happy, and more I importantly, keep them coming back to buy more Bryston gear, has to put them into the mix of product development. These two considerations are not either or, they are not mutually exclusive. I'm sure other great companies do the same thing - refinement of older products, introduction of new, and trying not to cheese off existing customers.
But I'm only guessing. What does James have to say?
James, in developing the BHA-1, weren't you interested in how owners of existing Bryston gear might like it? Or were you looking solely into breaking into a new market to attract new customers? Or were you doing both?
Dave
Hi Dave,
I think a bit of both I guess - I always try an listen to existing customers and what they would like to see Bryston develop - ex MONO 300 watt amplifiers.
The DAC and BDP-1 Player were really my idea based on what would I like to have in my system and my frustration with the operating and quality available through standard computer systems. The CD was from our customers asking.
The headphone amp though was my idea based on my perception that so many of the younger crowd grew up listening to crappy headphones with compressed music and maybe a way to entice that group into high quality audio was to develop a much better headphone interface for them to experience????
james
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That's a very specific question Dave - one that I don't believe has been directly addressed. In simple general terms, acknowledging that this will vary depending on the headphones, the question then is:
Does the BHA-1 sound different, specifically in term of warmth/body and perhaps liquidity/smoothness, than the integrated headphone amps supplied standard in Bryston preamp/processors?
James: Can you answer SoundGame's question that is in bold typeface?
Dave
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Hi Dave,
I think a bit of both I guess - I always try an listen to existing customers and what they would like to see Bryston develop - ex MONO 300 watt amplifiers.
The DAC and BDP-1 Player were really my idea based on what would I like to have in my system and my frustration with the operating and quality available through standard computer systems. The CD was from our customers asking.
The headphone amp though was my idea based on my perception that so many of the younger crowd grew up listening to crappy headphones with compressed music and maybe a way to entice that group into high quality audio was to develop a much better headphone interface for them to experience????
james
Interesting James - so why then go to all the effort in designing something all new. There is a whole slew of headphone amps out there at different levels of performance for young listeners. Why not just use the existing integrated headphone amp and outboard it as is in a separate box with separate power supply? It seems to me that as you got into the initiative the objective evolved and became not only a product for the young listeners but also to create the best headphone amp you could build - above and beyond the current integrated designs.
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James: Can you answer SoundGame's question that is in bold typeface?
Dave
Only if the headphones you are using are causing problems for the output capabilities of the specific preamp or processor you have them plugged into. The headphone output in the BP-26 for instance is happy with impedances above 50 and closer to 100 really whereas the BHA-1 will be very happy at 16 ohms.
james
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Interesting James - so why then go to all the effort in designing something all new. There is a whole slew of headphone amps out there at different levels of performance for young listeners. Why not just use the existing integrated headphone amp and outboard it as is in a separate box with separate power supply? It seems to me that as you got into the initiative the objective evolved and became not only a product for the young listeners but also to create the best headphone amp you could build - above and beyond the current integrated designs.
Hi,
Yes in fact once I started down the road and looking at what headphone amps and types of headphones where out there I was totally blown away :duh:
There was this whole subculture of headphone listening enthusiast's and Tube driven headphone amps (very few solid-state) etc. I realized that my original idea of a simple high quality headphone interface was very very naive to say the least (I was never a real serious headphone listener). So more research and more questions and I realized that if I was going to go down this path there was an opportunity to not only affect the younger crowd (hopefully) but supply this underground unknown to me community of serious headphone listeners with a product that could compete with the best out there. Time will tell I guess if I accomplish my goals.
james
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Only if the headphones you are using are causing problems for the output capabilities of the specific preamp or processor you have them plugged into. The headphone output in the BP-26 for instance is happy with impedances above 50 and closer to 100 really whereas the BHA-1 will be very happy at 16 ohms.
james
James, with respect, your answer does not answer SoundGames' very specific question, which was, Does the BHA-1 sound different, specifically in term of warmth/body and perhaps liquidity/smoothness, than the integrated headphone amps supplied standard in Bryston preamp/processors?
Dave
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Hi,
Yes in fact once I started down the road and looking at what headphone amps and types of headphones where out there I was totally blown away :duh:
There was this whole subculture of headphone listening enthusiast's and Tube driven headphone amps (very few solid-state) etc. I realized that my original idea of a simple high quality headphone interface was very very naive to say the least (I was never a real serious headphone listener). So more research and more questions and I realized that if I was going to go down this path there was an opportunity to not only affect the younger crowd (hopefully) but supply this underground unknown to me community of serious headphone listeners with a product that could compete with the best out there. Time will tell I guess if I accomplish my goals.
james
That makes sense to me... ;)
Time will tell but as I mentioned before - it will be interesting to see if the lessons learned in the engineering of the BHA-1 might trickle its way down in some respects into integrated headphone amps in Bryston products, as they come up for redesign.
Oh, bye-the-way James - does the SP3 have the same integrated headphone design as the other Bryston products or is it an evolution / new-breed??
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James, with respect, your answer does not answer SoundGames' very specific question, which was, Does the BHA-1 sound different, specifically in term of warmth/body and perhaps liquidity/smoothness, than the integrated headphone amps supplied standard in Bryston preamp/processors?
Dave
Hi Dave - I can not answer that unless we decide what headphones - with a benign load they will all sound the same - with a more difficult load the BHA-1 will sound better.
james
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Hi,
Yes in fact once I started down the road and looking at what headphone amps and types of headphones where out there I was totally blown away :duh:
There was this whole subculture of headphone listening enthusiast's and Tube driven headphone amps (very few solid-state) etc. I realized that my original idea of a simple high quality headphone interface was very very naive to say the least (I was never a real serious headphone listener). So more research and more questions and I realized that if I was going to go down this path there was an opportunity to not only affect the younger crowd (hopefully) but supply this underground unknown to me community of serious headphone listeners with a product that could compete with the best out there. Time will tell I guess if I accomplish my goals.
james
This a more plausible explanation. I was a little puzzled. If such a younger crowd isn't already into high quality audio, how would a $1300 headphone amp draw them into it? Typically, If you read the headphone forums, they seem first to buy better headphones, usually to listen to compressed music. if they move to headphone amps, they have a raft of amps to choose from already, many of them excellent and highly rated and often less expensive.
The headphone "community" is as avid and discriminating as any other audio group. To break into the good graces of it, and to compete with the best of the amps, the BHA-1 is going to have to be damned good. There seems to be a preference for tube amps, even at astronomical prices.
And I think I've learned why. I've always been a solid state guy, preferring accuracy above so-called warmth. But spending more time with headphones in recent months, I found that headphone listening is a more intimate kind of listening, and a warmer sound from the cans and the amps makes the experience even better. The only solid state amp out there that I have read about that gets any marks for warmth is the Australian built Burson HP160. I prefer SS because I am not charmed by rolling tubes or the prospect of buying them, but I wamt my headphone amp to sound more like a tube than a solid state amp. I believe the headphone market won't be wild about the BHA-1 unless it does.
This is why I've pressed you for a direct answer to SoundGame's question.
Dave
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Hi Dave - I can not answer that unless we decide what headphones - with a benign load they will all sound the same - with a more difficult load the BHA-1 will sound better.
james
James, I doubt that the headphone choice is the only thing to consider, and maybe the question should have had this caveat.
Use any good headphone on the SP3 or BP26. Then try it on a good tube amp. This should set the baseline of what SoundGame's question was getting at. Then try the same headphones on the BHA-1. Then tell us if the headphones sound closer to the SP3/BP26, or the tube amp. If you can do that, then you might be getting closer to what we're looking for.
Dave
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James, I doubt that the headphone choice is the only thing to consider, and maybe the question should have had this caveat.
Use any good headphone on the SP3 or BP26. Then try it on a good tube amp. This should set the baseline of what SoundGame's question was getting at. Then try the same headphones on the BHA-1. Then tell us if the headphones sound closer to the SP3/BP26, or the tube amp. If you can do that, then you might be getting closer to what we're looking for.
Dave
Hi Dave,
Well I would not agree that a tube amp is more accurate and should be the reference point. Also I have been told by people in the know that there are no standards for headphone testing as there are with speakers :duh:.
james
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Hi Dave,
Well I would not agree that a tube amp is more accurate and should be the reference point. Also I have been told by people in the know that there are no standards for headphone testing as there are with speakers :duh:.
james
Thanks for your entirely confusing reply, James. You say you "would not agree that a tube amp is more accurate." You are replying to me, so I assume you think I have made the claim that a tube amp is more accurate than a SS one. I haven't. Show me where I have said such a thing. I haven't because I don't believe they are.
In terms of reference, however, tube amps, as known by people in the know, are warmer sounding than SS ones. And my question and suggestion was about seeing how warm sounding - not accurate - the BHA-1 is compared to a tube amp.
But it seems that getting my point across, or getting you to understand it, is simply impossible. :duh:
I give up.
Dave
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Thanks for your entirely confusing reply, James. You say you "would not agree that a tube amp is more accurate." You are replying to me, so I assume you think I have made the claim that a tube amp is more accurate than a SS one. I haven't. Show me where I have said such a thing. I haven't because I don't believe they are.
In terms of reference, however, tube amps, as known by people in the know, are warmer sounding than SS ones. And my question and suggestion was about seeing how warm sounding - not accurate - the BHA-1 is compared to a tube amp.
But it seems that getting my point across, or getting you to understand it, is simply impossible. :duh:
I give up.
Dave
Me too.
james
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As Gil Scott Heron said, "I'm new here". But I am not new to audio boards. I can't fathom why one guy is getting away with giving a respected guy from the industry so much crap. Mr. Tanner has been nothing other than diplomatic. A well designed amp does not have a sound. There are other important sound qualities and they go far beyond warm vs. sterile and include such things as....(well, we have all heard the audio gobbledy goop-microdynamics, resolution, cohesiveness, yada yada yada). How can you expect Mr. Tanner to describe his amp as warm vs. cold vs. something in between? Either buy one and try it or wait and see what others have to say. Just be aware that what others have to say is usually worth nothing since they are likely using different sources, cables, and phones. BTW, my tubed pre-amp, an Audioprism Mantissa, is NOT warm. My tubed amp, an ARC VS-110 is also, NOT warm, unless you touch it's output transformer.
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I'm new to this Boad and I am sorry to make my very first post one in which I disagree with a regular. But, I don't agree. Not every potential customer is "one of it's loyal customers" as you apparently see yourself. Take me. I don't presently have any Bryston gear, but I do have dedicated two channel system that I am quite happy with. Thanks to purchasing a pair of Audeze LCD-2s, I am in the market for a top tier dedicated headphone amp that will drive the Audeze's to their full potential. My pre-amp is an Audioprism Mantissa that has been modified/upgraded by the original designer. It does not possess a headphone out. I love it and see absolutely no need to replace my pre-amp with one that has a headphone output like the Brystons. For me, the Bryston BHA-1 looks like a great candidate for these particular headphones.
Fsonicsmith, no need to be sorry. If being on a forum is only about being fans or yes-people, that would be pretty dull. I see that you are a perfect candidate for being a new customer for the BHA-1, but being a lover of the LCD-2, as I am, I suspect that unless it adds to their warm and musical sound - its great attractions - you'll be looking elsewhere. I would urge you, as James Tanner would, to demo the BHA-1 before buying it.
There is a reason that people who are into buying high end headphone amps usually prefer tubes, as I have suggested in this thread. At the BHA-1's $1300 price point, tube amps may be the competition. James has written that his goal is to compete with the best, as it should be. Therefore, there is no doubt that tube headphone amps be the competiton.
Dave
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As Gil Scott Heron said, "I'm new here". But I am not new to audio boards. I can't fathom why one guy is getting away with giving a respected guy from the industry so much crap. Mr. Tanner has been nothing other than diplomatic. A well designed amp does not have a sound. There are other important sound qualities and they go far beyond warm vs. sterile and include such things as....(well, we have all heard the audio gobbledy goop-microdynamics, resolution, cohesiveness, yada yada yada). How can you expect Mr. Tanner to describe his amp as warm vs. cold vs. something in between? Either buy one and try it or wait and see what others have to say. Just be aware that what others have to say is usually worth nothing since they are likely using different sources, cables, and phones. BTW, my tubed pre-amp, an Audioprism Mantissa, is NOT warm. My tubed amp, an ARC VS-110 is also, NOT warm, unless you touch it's output transformer.
+1
Fsonicsmith, no need to be sorry. If being on a forum is only about being fans or yes-people, that would be pretty dull. I see that you are a perfect candidate for being a new customer for the BHA-1, but being a lover of the LCD-2, as I am, I suspect that unless it adds to their warm and musical sound - its great attractions - you'll be looking elsewhere. I would urge you, as James Tanner would, to demo the BHA-1 before buying it.
There is a reason that people who are into buying high end headphone amps usually prefer tubes, as I have suggested in this thread. At the BHA-1's $1300 price point, tube amps may be the competition. James has written that his goal is to compete with the best, as it should be. Therefore, there is no doubt that tube headphone amps be the competiton.
Dave
:scratch:
Tony
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Hi Folks,
Yes I guess that is really what I am trying to say - hopefully the BHA-1 will allow the source to be heard as accurately as possible so the quality of the headphones will determine the final result.
As for seducing the younger crowd I think we will introduce a headphone as well - what do you think of these :thumb:
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=54752)
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As Gil Scott Heron said, "I'm new here". But I am not new to audio boards. I can't fathom why one guy is getting away with giving a respected guy from the industry so much crap. Mr. Tanner has been nothing other than diplomatic. A well designed amp does not have a sound. There are other important sound qualities and they go far beyond warm vs. sterile and include such things as....(well, we have all heard the audio gobbledy goop-microdynamics, resolution, cohesiveness, yada yada yada). How can you expect Mr. Tanner to describe his amp as warm vs. cold vs. something in between? Either buy one and try it or wait and see what others have to say. Just be aware that what others have to say is usually worth nothing since they are likely using different sources, cables, and phones. BTW, my tubed pre-amp, an Audioprism Mantissa, is NOT warm. My tubed amp, an ARC VS-110 is also, NOT warm, unless you touch it's output transformer.
Fsonicsmith, as a "new guy" here maybe you are not aware that we all respect James Tanner on this circle. But we respect him enough not to treat him like he is made of glass or to the point that we think he is always right. Do some research on this circle and you'll find many a time he has been challenged or questioned. This is an outstanding forum largely because of James, and especially because by his own behavior, he has not let it degrade into becoming one of the many mindless cheering sections that you find elsewhere. Because he and I had a few exchanges on a single issue does not mean I respect him less, nor did I notice that he is offended.
As to the characterization of the sound of amps - warm, smooth, etc. - I agree that these are very subjective terms. On the other hand, you probably are aware that these are terms regularly used not only by ordinary consumers, but also by respected reviewers.
I once spoke to another highly respected Bryston person, Chris Russell, the company's CEO, about these terms. He did not deny at all that these were perceived characteristics, but not surprisingly, as the company's former chief engineer, says that such sound is, in fact, a form of distortion. Bryston, he says, goes for the lowest possible distortion as an engineering goal. But engineering he has explained to me is a question of making choices and balancing those choices.
So engineering audio products in making choices seems to be something of an art as well as a science. I'm a terribly happy Bryston owner for my main system - all the electronics and even some cables are pure Bryston art.
But not all art is or needs to be one thing. Many respected art lovers prefer impressionists, Picasso, or Jackson Pollock. All of them engaged in representing what they saw through one form of distortion or another. I have found that the admitted distortion of the tubes in my Lyr amp - its warmth - is highly attractive to my ear. It is not a criticism of anything Bryston, it is a personal preference. Indeed, my preference would be Bryston because I have found that its squared amps do for my main system what the Lyr has done for my headphones. That's the only reason I have been pressing James on this thread. I would prefer SS. I would prefer Bryston if the BHA-1 gives me this kind of sound.
For sure, I will follow your good advice to try the BHA-1. In this interesting discussion, and despite our various differences in terms of lexicon, I think I now can anticipate what I am likely hear - something fairly close to the headphone jack on my BP26. Because Bryston invariably has surprised me, I wouldn't be surprised now that the difference might prompt me to buy it.
Dave
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Thanks for you kind reply Dave. I am sorry for the comment about "getting away with....".
I share many of your concerns. I came over here to this Board because I find that though Head-Fi may be the most active, there is an awful lot of mindless cheerleading and lemming-marching going on over there. Headphones are kind of peculiar in this sense; many headphone enthusiasts are not necessarily into high end audio. "High end audio" is of course a subjective term, but I think you likely know what I mean-many of these folks do not have components at the Bryston level of quality. They often will spend $1,000 or more on a set of cans and yet they are using iPods or laptops as their sources with $200 DACs and $200 headamps. But separate and aside from the denizens and character of various Boards, the universal truth is that you can't pick out equipment based on what you read on the 'net. You perhaps can make an educated guess based on wide acclaim and such, but that is about it. I am in the same boat as you are in a sense. No one has yet had a chance to hear the BHA-1 with various headphones since it has not yet been released. I am torn in that the Violectric V200 has wide acclaim (and again, I have not yet heard one of those) and I also would love to find a Leben CS300SX used. The Leben is an integrated amp, but it is one of the very few I would consider as an option to a dedicated head amp which is admittedly contradictory to something I posted at the outset of this thread.
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Thanks for you kind reply Dave. I am sorry for the comment about "getting away with....".
I share many of your concerns. I came over here to this Board because I find that though Head-Fi may be the most active, there is an awful lot of mindless cheerleading and lemming-marching going on over there. Headphones are kind of peculiar in this sense; many headphone enthusiasts are not necessarily into high end audio. "High end audio" is of course a subjective term, but I think you likely know what I mean-many of these folks do not have components at the Bryston level of quality. They often will spend $1,000 or more on a set of cans and yet they are using iPods or laptops as their sources with $200 DACs and $200 headamps. But separate and aside from the denizens and character of various Boards, the universal truth is that you can't pick out equipment based on what you read on the 'net. You perhaps can make an educated guess based on wide acclaim and such, but that is about it. I am in the same boat as you are in a sense. No one has yet had a chance to hear the BHA-1 with various headphones since it has not yet been released. I am torn in that the Violectric V200 has wide acclaim (and again, I have not yet heard one of those) and I also would love to find a Leben CS300SX used. The Leben is an integrated amp, but it is one of the very few I would consider as an option to a dedicated head amp which is admittedly contradictory to something I posted at the outset of this thread.
And thank you, Fsonicsmith, for a reply that helps describe how you came to join this circle. I looked at a lot of forums, but this is the only one in which I regularly participate, because aside from not being a mindless cheering section, it does not commit these typical forum offenses:
1. Taking personal preferences as Holy Writ, and allowing, as a consequence, the pursuit of heretics as devil worshippers. Here we know that personal preferences are just that, and that no piece of gear, or technology, satisfies every taste.
2. Allowing personal attacks, characterizations, and foul language. Here civility in my experience so far is taken seriously by the members.
3. Suffering a moderator who misses the point of what forums are about, and who sees his or her role as being a nanny or forum Nazi. Here, self-discipline rules on the basis that although we might drift a bit from time to time, we understand that we are here to share ideas and experiences. If at times we color a little beyond the lines, we rarely jump on one another.
I like your comments about headphone enthusiasts. It was difficult at first for me to fathom folks spending a lot of money to make their iPods work better, until I remembered that some high end companies, like Wadia, have been making gear for iPod users. But in any case it is a very different kind of community, and in my view, a very different kind of market, which is one of the reasons I was pressing James yesterday, and I think some others saw why I was.
Obviously, I want the BHA-1 to perform a certain way for selfish reasons, but there is another thing. I feel kind of like a member of the Bryston family, having so much or its equipment in my home and being a customer for 33 years. I want it to continue to succeed, to hit a home run every time at bat. My fear - maybe just nervousness - is that in this case it may not have read the market right. But no doubt Bryston understands about these gambles far more than I do.
I am unfamiliar with the equipment that you mention, but now that you have, I'm going to look into the names.
Dave
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I am just a tad concerned about Mr. Tanner's constant references to the BHA-1 being a product aimed at the "youth market" and "younger crowd used to iPods". I would hope that it is a no-compromise design. Contantly referencing gearing the product to a crowd who has no familiarity with the high end does not instill confidence. Everything else about the design does.
Violectric is very unusual in specifying power into multiple impedances as can be seen if you look at their website; http://www.violectric.de/Pages/en/technical-data.php (http://www.violectric.de/Pages/en/technical-data.php)
I would love to hear from Mr. Tanner as to the actual amount of power (current) expressed in mW that the BHA-1 can deliver into 32 ohm rather than the repeated reference to +/- 32 voltage swing capability. As I understand it, current into a given impedance is far more "accurate" as an indicator of predictive performance for the Audeze LCD-2s than voltage swing.
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I am just a tad concerned about Mr. Tanner's constant references to the BHA-1 being a product aimed at the "youth market" and "younger crowd used to iPods". I would hope that it is a no-compromise design. Contantly referencing gearing the product to a crowd who has no familiarity with the high end does not instill confidence. Everything else about the design does.
Violectric is very unusual in specifying power into multiple impedances as can be seen if you look at their website; http://www.violectric.de/Pages/en/technical-data.php (http://www.violectric.de/Pages/en/technical-data.php)
I would love to hear from Mr. Tanner as to the actual amount of power (current) expressed in mW that the BHA-1 can deliver into 32 ohm rather than the repeated reference to +/- 32 voltage swing capability. As I understand it, current into a given impedance is far more "accurate" as an indicator of predictive performance for the Audeze LCD-2s than voltage swing.
James, I hope you will respond to our new member. My own observation is though I, too, am somewhat skeptical about the target market (even absent the youth target), I haven't a doubt in the world that the only compromises Bryston will make are to produce the very best possible amp consistent with its design philosophy and reasonable pricing. That is baked into every Bryston product I have ever bought and enjoyed.
Dave
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Hi Guys
Yes my original thought (as silly as that seems now) :duh: -- was a small high quality portable head phone amplifier for those younger folks using the earplugs/ipods/ etc.
But as I was researching what we could do to address that specific market I realized there was this totally sophisticated very serious headphone listening customer that I had no idea existed. So when Stuart (one of our design engineers) and I originally talked he felt he could put together a very competitive small portable headphone amp very quickly and easily. Well that original idea has ballooned into this all out state of the art attempt at a Bryston headphone amplifier.
Maybe there is still room for the portable unit down the road???
james
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Hi Guys
Yes my original thought (as silly as that seems now) :duh: -- was a small high quality portable head phone amplifier for those younger folks using the earplugs/ipods/ etc.
But as I was researching what we could do to address that specific market I realized there was this totally sophisticated very serious headphone listening customer that I had no idea existed. So when Stuart (one of our design engineers) and I originally talked he felt he could put together a very competitive small portable headphone amp very quickly and easily. Well that original idea has ballooned into this all out state of the art attempt at a Bryston headphone amplifier.
Maybe there is still room for the portable unit down the road???
james
Hi James - yes, I believe there is but I would say it needs to be very compact and competitively priced with the most popular current options available.
Something like this (desktop/portable) might work - kinda like what NuForce has got out:
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=45738)
Or to catch the more on-the-fly customer - something like this:
(http://images.gogadgets.multiply.com/image/2/photos/55/600x600/4/FIIO-E5.jpg?et=jJGQRsuR4nQGTzclhffuaw&nmid=228541715)
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Hi Guys
Yes my original thought (as silly as that seems now) :duh: -- was a small high quality portable head phone amplifier for those younger folks using the earplugs/ipods/ etc.
But as I was researching what we could do to address that specific market I realized there was this totally sophisticated very serious headphone listening customer that I had no idea existed. So when Stuart (one of our design engineers) and I originally talked he felt he could put together a very competitive small portable headphone amp very quickly and easily. Well that original idea has ballooned into this all out state of the art attempt at a Bryston headphone amplifier.
Maybe there is still room for the portable unit down the road???
james
Hi James. As you can tell I'm very interested in the marketing approach you're taking. Would it be competitively sensitive for you to say which brands you think will be competition for the BHA-1?
Dave
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Hi James. As you can tell I'm very interested in the marketing approach you're taking. Would it be competitively sensitive for you to say which brands you think will be competition for the BHA-1?
Dave
Hi Dave
Well I would hope we would be able to compete with the best out there - as with all Bryston products we do not build to a price point - we do it the best way we know how with the best the state of the art has to offer and it is what it is.
james
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James,
I would be interested in a portable headphone amp. I am now using an iQube ($600.00) to power my Shure 530 earbuds along with my Sennheiser 650HD. I just purchased HiFiMan HE-500 and the iQube barley powers them. I am looking foreword to the new Bryston BHA-1 along with a new portable amp would suite me just right.
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James,
How many watts into 50 ohms? Thanks!
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James,
I would be interested in a portable headphone amp. I am now using an iQube ($600.00) to power my Shure 530 earbuds along with my Sennheiser 650HD. I just purchased HiFiMan HE-500 and the iQube barley powers them. I am looking foreword to the new Bryston BHA-1 along with a new portable amp would suite me just right.
If the BHA-1 works out - perhaps a BHA-mini might be a possibility... :eyebrows:
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James,
How many watts into 50 ohms? Thanks!
I will find out.
James
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James,
How many watts into 50 ohms? Thanks!
Hi
Do not have the 50 ohms yet but here are 2 of the measurements on the BHA-1.
600 Ohms:
Voltage = 24V,
mW 875
32 Ohms:
Voltage = 11.46
mW = 4100
Remember if you were ever to listen at these levels you would do serious damage to either your hearing or your headphones :nono:
james
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Hi
Do not have the 50 ohms yet but here are 2 of the measurements on the BHA-1.
600 Ohms:
Voltage = 24V,
mW 875
32 Ohms:
Voltage = 11.46
mW = 4100
Remember if you were ever to listen at these levels you would do serious damage to either your hearing or your headphones :nono:
james
James,
Wow! Those are great numbers, guaranteed to drive pretty much any headphone on the market. Do you know if those are the numbers for the single-ended or balanced outputs? Generally, the numbers double for the balanced outputs. Thanks!
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James,
Wow! Those are great numbers, guaranteed to drive pretty much any headphone on the market. Do you know if those are the numbers for the single-ended or balanced outputs? Generally, the numbers double for the balanced outputs. Thanks!
Balanced outs with Low Gain setting on the BHA-1.
james
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BHA-1 would certainly power my HiFiMan HE-500. When is the release?
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600 Ohms:
Voltage = 24V,
mW 875
32 Ohms:
Voltage = 11.46
mW = 4100
I have been beaten to it, but I will say it too-wow-great numbers. Matches the best of the competition which I alluded to in an earlier post in this thread-the Violectric V200. Numbers help, but the only way to know how it sounds is to listen and I look forward to trying the BHA-1.
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BHA-1 would certainly power my HiFiMan HE-500. When is the release?
We hope to be in production in January 2012.
james
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Those are good power figures!
I think a DAC combined with this HP amp in one box should happen. I know it was already mentioned and dismissed, but I think that's a mistake. Many headphone users are space limited, and there is NO technical reason it can't be done. It's a much more elegant solution (reduces wiring clutter) and a better use of resources (only pay for one enclosure).
My 3 cents
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Those are good power figures!
I think a DAC combined with this HP amp in one box should happen. I know it was already mentioned and dismissed, but I think that's a mistake. Many headphone users are space limited, and there is NO technical reason it can't be done. It's a much more elegant solution (reduces wiring clutter) and a better use of resources (only pay for one enclosure).
My 3 cents
Depends on the quality of the DAC. I had a great combo HP amp and DAC, but because the Bryston BDA was better, I never used the HP amp DAC after hearing the difference.
Dave
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I appreciate your point. If it were another company, I wouldn't be so adamant. But Bryston has great engineers and knows how to compete against the best. They have experience in both DACs and amplification. If the will was there, it would be a great product.
I already have two DACs and a full speaker and headphone rig. But I'm tired of the high box count (not to mention the rats nest of wires) and it isn't necessary for state-of-the-art performance. All future purchases will be made with two goals in mind: 1) Top of the line performance 2) Low box count.
The active speakers on my list meet all criteria, and then some. So it's down to finding the same thing for my Audeze headphones. The Bryston amp has the necessary power; all it needs is an integrated DAC and I'm sold. Bryston is the perfect company to pull this off. All they need is the will to make it happen.
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Hi James my only question is . Is there really a market for a made in Canada premium headphone amplifiers? . If so go for it , Otherwise forget about it .
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All they need is the will to make it happen.
Actually they need to have high confidence in meeting projected minimum sales numbers to make it happen. Not every combo product will sell well. The preamps and integrated amps that have the capability to add a DAC card (BP6, BP16, B26, B60R, B100) have been losing sales of the DAC card to the BDA-1 DAC for one or more reasons - i.e. the BDA-1 is a better DAC, has higher resolution, or has more inputs.
Steve
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(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=54802)
An earlier Bryston Headphone Interface :lol:
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I have a geeky question for Bryston's chief engineer in charge of this project, Stuart Taylor. Perhaps Mr. Tanner would be so kind as to relay this question to him; is the choice of op-amp utilized the single most critical aspect of the BHA-1's ultimate sound quality and how would the other factors be ranked either ahead of or behind the choice of op amp and in what order? In other words, can you rank from most important to least important the various parts and design choices you made when designing this head amp? Is the op amp really completely proprietary and if not, are you at liberty to disclose what changes are made to someone else's chip? And lastly, are you certain that all the input and output flexibility of the BHA-1 creates no compromises whatsoever in overall SQ and if so, how are you certain? Sorry in advance. If you don't care to answer all of these, would you please answer my first question-that one is the most important one to me.
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..... is the choice of op-amp utilized the single most critical aspect of the BHA-1's ultimate sound quality and how would the other factors be ranked either ahead of or behind the choice of op amp and in what order?
Is the op amp really completely proprietary and if not, are you at liberty to disclose what changes are made to someone else's chip?
The last reference I saw was James' posting of the preliminary product literature (http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=52308 (http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=52308)) which stated that the four operational amplifiers were fully discrete and not an opamp chip.
Steve
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I have a geeky question for Bryston's chief engineer in charge of this project, Stuart Taylor. Perhaps Mr. Tanner would be so kind as to relay this question to him; is the choice of op-amp utilized the single most critical aspect of the BHA-1's ultimate sound quality and how would the other factors be ranked either ahead of or behind the choice of op amp and in what order? In other words, can you rank from most important to least important the various parts and design choices you made when designing this head amp? Is the op amp really completely proprietary and if not, are you at liberty to disclose what changes are made to someone else's chip? And lastly, are you certain that all the input and output flexibility of the BHA-1 creates no compromises whatsoever in overall SQ and if so, how are you certain? Sorry in advance. If you don't care to answer all of these, would you please answer my first question-that one is the most important one to me.
Hi
Yes the Class A discrete operational amplifiers are our own design and we have been using variations of them for over 20 years now.
James
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The last reference I saw was James' posting of the preliminary product literature (http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=52308 (http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=52308)) which stated that the four operational amplifiers were fully discrete and not an opamp chip.
Steve
You must have eyes like a hawk to be able to read off that image...to blurry for me and I have 20/20 vision... :o
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You must have eyes like a hawk to be able to read off that image...to blurry for me and I have 20/20 vision... :o
I had increased the browser's zoom to 250% to read it - it was quite blurry but readable.
Steve
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James.......question about headphone amp. if you get it with the built in power supply can you still plug it into the main mps-2. also will the one without the built in p/s come with the same power cord to plug in as the one from the mps-2 to bp-26 thanks
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James.......question about headphone amp. if you get it with the built in power supply can you still plug it into the main mps-2. also will the one without the built in p/s come with the same power cord to plug in as the one from the mps-2 to bp-26 thanks
Hi - there will be a plate on the back which will either have a standard power plug or a special pin connector to plug into the MPS-2. You would have to change out that plate to move from one power option to the other and remove/install/disconnect the internal transformer.
james
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We hope to be in production in January 2012.
james
What does this mean in real world terms? In other words, when will my Bryston dealer likely have one in stock for me to audition or buy.
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What does this mean in real world terms? In other words, when will my Bryston dealer likely have one in stock for me to audition or buy.
Hi,
Honestly I do not know - we made some changes to the layout of the front panel and in doing so discovered a terrific new circuit topology ideally suited for the BHA-1 headphone amp. So long story short we tried this new circuit - love it and now have prototypes being built. I will have one at the CES show in January for demo and display and we should be able to start building units shortly after that.
My apology on the delay but when you find a better way you gota go that way :thumb:
james
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My apology on the delay but when you find a better way you gota go that way :thumb:
james
I know you're right James but I'm a little gutted as I was going to order my BHA-1 tomorrow with a hopeful early Jan delivery.
Not to worry as I now it will be worth the wait :)
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I know you're right James but I'm a little gutted as I was going to order my BHA-1 tomorrow with a hopeful early Jan delivery.
Not to worry as I now it will be worth the wait :)
Yes sorry about that - get the order in though as they are starting to pile up - my fault :duh:
james
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I know you're right James but I'm a little gutted as I was going to order my BHA-1 tomorrow with a hopeful early Jan delivery./quote]
LOL, your gutted, i pre-ordered mine over 3 months ago. :duh:
Mark
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James, Today I got the chance to listen to the highly thought of HiFiMan HE-6's, which are regarded as possibly the toughest headphones on the planet to drive, when I plugged them into the BP26 headphone out I was surprised at the lack of volume available, totally unusable, would the SP3 headphone out offer similar performance to the BP26 or is it a totally new design which would offer superior performance?
More importantly, I take it the BHA-1 could drive them OK? in the end I used the Schiit Lyr and they sounded pretty awesome, if you haven't already, it maybe worth getting a pair of HE-6's to try.
Thanks.
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James, Today I got the chance to listen to the highly thought of HiFiMan HE-6's, which are regarded as possibly the toughest headphones on the planet to drive, when I plugged them into the BP26 headphone out I was surprised at the lack of volume available, totally unusable, would the SP3 headphone out offer similar performance to the BP26 or is it a totally new design which would offer superior performance?
More importantly, I take it the BHA-1 could drive them OK? in the end I used the Schiit Lyr and they sounded pretty awesome, if you haven't already, it maybe worth getting a pair of HE-6's to try.
Thanks.
hi Vipers,
No the SP3 is similar to the 26 so the new BHA-1 is the much better option for those phones.
james
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Excellent, good to know James, although to be honest I'm still hoping to go with the Grado PS1000's, did I read a little while ago that you had a pair of these? If so have you tried them on the BHA-1?
Thanks.
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Excellent, good to know James, although to be honest I'm still hoping to go with the Grado PS1000's, did I read a little while ago that you had a pair of these? If so have you tried them on the BHA-1?
Thanks.
Yes listening to them as I write this ..... Superb phones
James
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I'm not jealous, honest :wink:
Hoping to get mine ordered tomorrow, would you say they would benefit from the BHA-1 over the SP3 headphone out?
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I'm not jealous, honest ;)
Hoping to get mine ordered tomorrow, would you say they would benefit from the BHA-1 over the SP3 headphone out?
The Grado's are not as power demanding as many of the other headphones out there. The are only 32ohms but, as was brought up before, the standard headphone amps in Bryston components such as the BP26 and SP3 have been designed for 50ohm headphonne loads and up - so the Grado's would not be optimized in the standard headphone jacks but the BHA-1 should handle them better. How much of a difference - perhaps James can just switch his plug on his phones and report back to us on his actual impressions....?
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Here is what the BHA-1 does to a person as reported in the January 2012 issue of Stereophile by Kalman Rubinson from the 2011 CEDIA Expo: "When I first arrived at the Indiana Convention Center, I came upon Bryston's James Tanner, feet up, eyes closed, oblivious to all the manic activity around him, listening to music via a prototype of Bryston's new headphone amp." Man, I wish I had a job like that! :D
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James. could you tell me how long the cable is on the grado ps-1000's.i'm considering them and sennheiser 800's. i just listened to a pair of grado ps-500's might consider them too, but they only have a 5 ft. cable. i need at least 10 ft.
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James. could you tell me how long the cable is on the grado ps-1000's.i'm considering them and sennheiser 800's. i just listened to a pair of grado ps-500's might consider them too, but they only have a 5 ft. cable. i need at least 10 ft.
My Grado SR80's have about 5.5ft from the Y in the cable to the connector pin tip and I assume the ps1000's would be similar but Grado sells a 15ft extension cord that they guarantee will not degrade the performance of any of it's headphones - it sells for about $30, though I haven't tried personally.
http://www.gradolabs.com/page_accessories.php?item=aabfee4357ed427ff3e18e30fdbd15c0 (http://www.gradolabs.com/page_accessories.php?item=aabfee4357ed427ff3e18e30fdbd15c0)
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James. could you tell me how long the cable is on the grado ps-1000's.i'm considering them and sennheiser 800's. i just listened to a pair of grado ps-500's might consider them too, but they only have a 5 ft. cable. i need at least 10 ft.
Just found this spec, looks like the cable is 9ft (3m) and apparently the 15ft extension comes in the box :thumb:
Specifications:
Sensitivity: 98 dB/mV
Manufacturer Warranty: 1 year
Headphone Type: Full Size
Connector Type: 1/4
Impedance @ 1kHz: 32 Ohms
Detachable Cable: No
Cord Length: 9 ft. (3m)
Cord Type: Straight Y
Coupler Size: Large
Ear Coupler Type: Full-Size
Acoustic Seal: Open
Driver Type: Dynamic
What's In The Box:
Grado 1/4"-to-1/8" mini-plug adapter
Grado 15 foot extension cable
Grado Labs warranty insert
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James. could you tell me how long the cable is on the grado ps-1000's.i'm considering them and sennheiser 800's. i just listened to a pair of grado ps-500's might consider them too, but they only have a 5 ft. cable. i need at least 10 ft.
Won Ton On: Not a fan of the Grado sound, but would urge you to consider adding the Audeze LCD-2 to your possible buy list. Had the HD800, which is very good, but found the LCD-2 a more enjoyable headphone.
Dave
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Won Ton On: Not a fan of the Grado sound, but would urge you to consider adding the Audeze LCD-2 to your possible buy list. Had the HD800, which is very good, but found the LCD-2 a more enjoyable headphone.
Dave
Hi Dave - more on your impressions of the differences would be interesting. What about the Grado sound do you not like?
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Hi,
Soon I'll be in the market for new Headphones, and would like to hear from you all, which HP benefits the most from the BHA, and which would come closest to the Esl experience.
Had the privilege to play through the Jecklin Floats http://www.quad-musik.de/html/jecklin.html, but lost touch with them long time ago and they are not made anymore. Now I have the space to restart with Headphones. Would love to need the BHA....
Marius
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Thank's guys i asked because the web site dosen't list the length.i'll have to see if there is a audeze dealer in s ont. or are they only available on line. i've read good things about the hi fi man too,not sure on the dealer for them either.also are they not comeing out with a lcd-3.i did like the sound of the ps-500's currently i'm using sennheiser 580's and looking to upgrade Thank's again
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ha i see it takes 100 posts to be a full member.i was kind of wondering about that
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Hi Dave - more on your impressions of the differences would be interesting. What about the Grado sound do you not like?
SoundGame: I own SR80s and did own Grado's former top end RS-1s. Used them for years, having bought them over Sennheisers. But when I bought my HD800s, I couldn't stand the Grados - too bright, too forward, a scattered soundstage. Personal opinion, of course, and I haven't heard the PS-500 or PS-1000.
The HD800 is one of the best on offer. I gave mine away. Excellent definition and soundstage. Very accurate. But takes a lot of volume to get any reasonable bass. Bottom line: Frankly boring to listen to.
The LCD-2 was a revelation for me. Very accurate, but with a narrower soundstage. Bass is about as good as it gets. Clear, defined, not the least bit flabby and very deep - all at reasonable volumes. Headphone listening is an intimate activity, and the LCD-2 is very intimate sounding, indeed.
Gave the HD800 to a young man doing pro work because it is best for that application. I knew I wouldn't be listening to them with the LCD-2 in hand.
Here are typical reviews that seem to agree with the impression I have:
http://news.cnet.com/8301-13645_3-20096214-47/audeze-headphones-redefining-the-state-of-the-art-again/
http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews/audeze/1.html
Dave
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James. could you tell me how long the cable is on the grado ps-1000's.i'm considering them and sennheiser 800's. i just listened to a pair of grado ps-500's might consider them too, but they only have a 5 ft. cable. i need at least 10 ft.
Yes about 8 feet but I have the extension cable as well.
james
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question to whom ever might know. if i was to get a headphone would it be best to plug it in to my bcd-1,bda-1 or the bp-26. i would be using the rca jacks as i'm using the balanced outputs for my 4bsst2 thanks
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that would be a headphone amp
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question to whom ever might know. if i was to get a headphone would it be best to plug it in to my bcd-1,bda-1 or the bp-26. i would be using the rca jacks as i'm using the balanced outputs for my 4bsst2 thanks
I assume you mean where to connect a headphone amp. I have connected mine either to my BDA-1 or BP-26. I use whichever sounds best.
Dave
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Does Bryston have plans at some point to produce a preamp with XLR tape out? That would be great for connecting to the BHA-1. Thanks.
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Does Bryston have plans at some point to produce a preamp with XLR tape out? That would be great for connecting to the BHA-1. Thanks.
Hi
No plans for a new preamp at this point.
James
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James,
I have a few questions regarding the BHA-1.
I preordered a few weeks ago through my dealer David Michael Audio. I think he spoke with you in regards to delivery timing. You gave him an approximate time in January. Is that no longer valid since the changes that you mentioned earlier to the circuit have delayed things?
Would the power specs that you quoted (4100mW at 32 ohms using the balanced outs and low gain setting) be higher with the high gain setting?
You sent David a brochure for the BHA-1 and the information listed the balanced male XLR outputs as the standard and female XLR outputs as optional. I ordered the female XLRs. The industry standard or atleast all commercially available balanced headphone amps that I know of have female outputs. You may want to make the female outputs the standard and male outputs the option IMO.
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James,
I have a few questions regarding the BHA-1.
I preordered a few weeks ago through my dealer David Michael Audio. I think he spoke with you in regards to delivery timing. You gave him an approximate time in January. Is that no longer valid since the changes that you mentioned earlier to the circuit have delayed things?
Would the power specs that you quoted (4100mW at 32 ohms using the balanced outs and low gain setting) be higher with the high gain setting?
You sent David a brochure for the BHA-1 and the information listed the balanced male XLR outputs as the standard and female XLR outputs as optional. I ordered the female XLRs. The industry standard or atleast all commercially available balanced headphone amps that I know of have female outputs. You may want to make the female outputs the standard and male outputs the option IMO.
Hi
Yes I believe we will be in production in January. This new circuit caught us a little by surprise but was so good we just had to stop the presses and start again. We will have to retest all the specs once we have a production version but the new circuit concentrates on lower distortion over higher output.
The standard in the industry is that signal always flows from a Male XLR to a Female XLR so I was a little taken back when I saw that many of the current headphone amps on the market having a Female output as standard :duh: Anyway we felt we should stick with the standard as seen on all other products imploying XLR balanced connections? :scratch:
James
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Hi James,
Thanks for your reply. You may want to reconsider the headphone outputs being male XLRs as the standard. I have 7 headphones including the Audeze LCD3, LCD2 r1, LCD2 r2, HifiMan HE6, Sennheiser HD800, LA7000 (Lawton Audio modded Denon D7000), and AKG K340 modded by Headphile. All of my headphones are setup for both balanced operation via a two 3 pin male XLRs or one 4 pin male XLR and also I have 1/4" adapters cables for single ended operation. Each one of my headphones has an aftermarket headphone cable costing between $300 and $600 each and all of them are setup for a female XLR on the amp. Many headphone enthusiats have similiar setups. So, I would say that nearly 100 percent of us head-fiers are setup for female XLRs on our amps. I'm suggesting that you make the standard for the BHA-1 female XLRs to avoid unhappy customers who may assume that the standard is female XLR output headphone jacks.
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Hi James,
Thanks for your reply. You may want to reconsider the headphone outputs being male XLRs as the standard. I have 7 headphones including the Audeze LCD3, LCD2 r1, LCD2 r2, HifiMan HE6, Sennheiser HD800, LA7000 (Lawton Audio modded Denon D7000), and AKG K340 modded by Headphile. All of my headphones are setup for both balanced operation via a two 3 pin male XLRs or one 4 pin male XLR and also I have 1/4" adapters cables for single ended operation. Each one of my headphones has an aftermarket headphone cable costing between $300 and $600 each and all of them are setup for a female XLR on the amp. Many headphone enthusiats have similiar setups. So, I would say that nearly 100 percent of us head-fiers are setup for female XLRs on our amps. I'm suggesting that you make the standard for the BHA-1 female XLRs to avoid unhappy customers who may assume that the standard is female XLR output headphone jacks.
Any idea why the headphone amp community does it differently than the rest?? :scratch:
james
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Not sure why but since you are still in the pre-production stage, I would think that it is not too late to change your standard. Just think if your dealers order the standard BHA-1 for display and their customers bring their headphones to try in the store and they can't plug them in because of the male XLR connector on the amp. That will not go over well in the headphone community.
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James,
My preorder through David Michael Audio is for the BHA-1 with external power supply. Please make sure he ordered the female XLRs for me as I asked him to. Thank you.
Steve
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Any idea why the headphone amp community does it differently than the rest?? :scratch:
james
Perhaps there will need to be a professional and consumer version of the BHA-1, with the professional having the male XLR out and the consumer having the femaile XLR out? Headophile's are a community all their own, I'm finding.
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Good points guys. :thumb:
James
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"Thanks for your reply. You may want to reconsider the headphone outputs being male XLRs as the standard."
********
You may have saved Bryston a lot of post-production grief. I never would have checked that detail with my order and none of my head phone XLR cables would have worked with the "standard" configuration. I just checked an aftermarket cable that is at least ten years old and it's set up to plug into a female XLR, so the head phone "standard" is not new.
Steve
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"Perhaps there will need to be a professional and consumer version of the BHA-1, with the professional having the male XLR out"
********
Just did a quick look at head phone amp and distribution panels at a pro audio-video site; of the dozen or so devices, none had XLR head phone outputs. So I guess for pros, 1/4" TRS is the standard. So Bryston just needs to have female XLR outputs as the standard inorder to avoid problems.
Steve
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One final thought, the "female" combo-XLR output for headphone is "logical" in that it allows use of both XLR and 1/4" TRS from the head phone. My current amp has dual Neutrik NCJ6FA-H 3 Pole XLR Female outputs.
Steve
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Anyone had any experience with these yet? https://audeze.com/audeze-lcd-3
Was searching for a Jecklin Float replacer, and reading the internet reviews would hope these to come close.
Would these connect to the BHA: - Input cable: Custom cable with mini XLR connectors? or is that the connection to the Phone themselves and not to the BHA? Specification seems a little vague about that.
Thanks,
Marius
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Anyone had any experience with these yet? https://audeze.com/audeze-lcd-3
Was searching for a Jecklin Float replacer, and reading the internet reviews would hope these to come close.
Would these connect to the BHA: - Input cable: Custom cable with mini XLR connectors? or is that the connection to the Phone themselves and not to the BHA? Specification seems a little vague about that.
Thanks,
Marius
I have the LCD3 and it is my favorite headphone of the ones that I own including the HD800, HE6, LCD2 r1 and r2, LA7000 (Lawton Audio modded Denon D7000) and AKG K340 (Headphile modded). The mini XLRs are at the headphone connection. The LCD3 is a fantastic headphone. Great soundstaging, imaging, smooth midrange, great bass and extended highs but not fatiguing.
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How does one change the headphone wire to a balanced one and what advantage is that over the regular phone plug ?
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The standard in the industry is that signal always flows from a Male XLR to a Female XLR so I was a little taken back when I saw that many of the current headphone amps on the market having a Female output as standard :duh: Anyway we felt we should stick with the standard as seen on all other products imploying XLR balanced connections? :scratch:
Any idea why the headphone amp community does it differently than the rest?? :scratch:
You make a thinking mistake here. If it looks like a duck and sounds like a duck, it does not actually have to be one... And this is one of those.
Headphones connectors may resemble the mechanical part that looks like an XLR plug, but it is not one. The cable is not balanced, it is left channel, right channel, ground, shield. No balance there.
Any connector plugged into any socket is male. As such, the connection on the headphone side is male, and the receicing end (the BHA) has to be female.
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How does one change the headphone wire to a balanced one and what advantage is that over the regular phone plug ?
No balance; left, right, ground. So no benefit whatsoever. It just looks different.
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You make a thinking mistake here. If it looks like a duck and sounds like a duck, it does not actually have to be one... And this is one of those.
Headphones connectors may resemble the mechanical part that looks like an XLR plug, but it is not one. The cable is not balanced, it is left channel, right channel, ground, shield. No balance there.
Any connector plugged into any socket is male. As such, the connection on the headphone side is male, and the receicing end (the BHA) has to be female.
Hi Anonamemouse - thanks for that info I had no idea :duh: I guess we will make sure the Standard is the Female as most have suggested.
james
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Any connector plugged into any socket is male. As such, the connection on the headphone side is male, and the receicing end (the BHA) has to be female.
While this is true for many types of connectors (plumbing, etc.), it's not so obvious for the world of electrical connectors.
For electrical, the gender of the connector is determined by the pins used in the connector - not the connector itself.
It's quite possible to plug a female XLR connector plug (designated as a plug by nature of its moveable position) into a male XLR socket (designated as a jack by nature of its fixed location).
In that regard, the statement that, "the connection on the headphone side is male, and the receicing end (the BHA) has to be female", is not a truism.
female jack
(http://www.neutrik.com/website/uploads/images/07/420x/nc3fd-lx.jpg?v=1)
male jack
(http://www.neutrik.com/website/uploads/images/02/420x/nc3md-lx.jpg?v=1)
female plug
(http://www.neutrik.com/website/uploads/images/05/420x/nc3fxx.jpg?v=1)
male plug
(http://www.neutrik.com/website/uploads/images/07/420x/nc3mxx.jpg?v=1)
brucek
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Perhaps there will need to be a professional and consumer version of the BHA-1, with the professional having the male XLR out and the consumer having the femaile XLR out? Headophile's are a community all their own, I'm finding.
It is indeed a different community. And I suspect that the BHA-1 while it might be attractive to it, it may not be as attractive to the pro community that uses headphones. These folks increasingly are people working at home and workspace can be at a premium, so smaller headphone amps, and especially multifunction ones, like the Grace Designs units, might be more suitable for this growing number of pro users.
Dave
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I have an older version of this amp...http://www.headphone.com/headphone-amps/amplifiers/headroom-balanced-ultra-desktop-amp-buda.php
I think that Bryston should consider using similar Neutrik connectors...they accept male XLR or 1/4" TRS stereo plugs; very convenient.
Steve
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I think that Bryston should consider using similar Neutrik connectors...they accept male XLR or 1/4" TRS stereo plugs; very convenient.
I can't imagine not wanting to use the combo connector. Although they are fairly standard on a variety of digital recording interfaces for microphone inputs and on powered monitor inputs, it makes absolute sense on headphone outputs, where a 1/4" headphone plug will be likely be encountered at some point in its use.
Steve
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While this is true for many types of connectors (plumbing, etc.), it's not so obvious for the world of electrical connectors.
For electrical, the gender of the connector is determined by the pins used in the connector - not the connector itself.
It's quite possible to plug a female XLR connector plug (designated as a plug by nature of its moveable position) into a male XLR socket (designated as a jack by nature of its fixed location).
In that regard, the statement that, "the connection on the headphone side is male, and the receicing end (the BHA) has to be female", is not a truism.
brucek
If we were talking about XLR you would be somewhat correct.
But we are not talking about XLR, we are talking about a connector for a headphone. The plug on the cable of the headphones is ALWAYS male. The input in the BHA HAS to be female.
The examples you give are for XLR. This is not XLR. It just LOOKS like it.
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Something like this plug would be ideal for the BHA.
(http://www.neutrik.com/website/uploads/images/07/660x/ncj6fav.jpg?v=1)
(click me!) (http://www.neutrik.com/en/audio/plugs-and-jacks/jacks/combo-a-series/ncj6fa-v)
It accepts bot the XLR style plug AND the 1/4" Stereo Jack. There is a high end version of this, give Neutric (http://www.neutrik.com/) a call...
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Hi James,
I use headphones a lot and I agree with the majority opinion that has been voiced: the connector on the BHA-1 has to be female. This is the standard for almost all headphone amplifiers I have come across.
Using the Neutrik combination jack as Anonamemouse mentioned is a great idea, especially if the space on the faceplate is limited.
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Headphones connectors may resemble the mechanical part that looks like an XLR plug, but it is not one. The cable is not balanced, it is left channel, right channel, ground, shield. No balance there.
I claim no expertise on this matter, but I'm not sure that the above statement is entirely correct. As far as I understand headphones with balanced drive, some setups actually carry a fully-balanced signal (both normal and inverted signals) all the way to each driver coil. The following is a photo taken from the Headroom website:
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=55601)
The original is at http://www.headphone.com/learning-center/balanced-drive-faq.php
As you can see, it's not merely left channel, right channel, ground, shield as Anonamemouse states. You can actually carry a balanced signal all the way to the headphones themselves.
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Good point. Just because the headphone can use a XLR connector, doesn't mean it's balanced. My HeadRoom balanced amp has two female combo XLRs. If the headphones are wired "balanced", a male XLR is plugged into each connector otherwise a XLR/1/4" adapter or 1/4" stereo phono plug is used and the amp will drive two headphones. I'll have to do a little looking around to see which 'phones can be ordered "balanced".
Steve
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From a little more looking, it seems that there is no "standard" for balanced output. I guess the two major options are singe 4 pin Neutrik or double 3 pin combo Neutrik.
Steve
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From a little more looking, it seems that there is no "standard" for balanced output. I guess the two major options are singe 4 pin Neutrik or double 3 pin combo Neutrik.
Steve
You're absolutely right that there's no standard, mostly because balanced headphones are still rather cutting-edge. The lack of a standard often creates confusion, as we're seeing in this thread. :scratch:
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I claim no expertise on this matter, but I'm not sure that the above statement is entirely correct. As far as I understand headphones with balanced drive, some setups actually carry a fully-balanced signal (both normal and inverted signals) all the way to each driver coil. The following is a photo taken from the Headroom website:
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=55601)
The original is at http://www.headphone.com/learning-center/balanced-drive-faq.php
As you can see, it's not merely left channel, right channel, ground, shield as Anonamemouse states. You can actually carry a balanced signal all the way to the headphones themselves.
This is new to me, I did not know this existed. Reading the article it looks very new to me.
I get the feeling that balanced headphones take up a marginal portion of the market though, I for one have never seen one in the wild. I think it is up to James what to do with this.
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This is new to me, I did not know this existed. Reading the article it looks very new to me.
I get the feeling that balanced headphones take up a marginal portion of the market though, I for one have never seen one in the wild. I think it is up to James what to do with this.
People have been balancing headphones for only about 5-10 years, so it's definitely a new development, and you're right that it still takes up only a marginal portion of the market. At this point, I've only encountered balanced headphones at local meets of headphone enthusiasts. Balanced headphones are just starting to break into the mainstream, and even then it's a rather slow development.
Bryston is the only major audio company of which I'm aware that is producing a balanced headphone amp. So far, all the balanced amps are made by boutique manufacturers; even headphone companies like Grado have not yet manufactured balanced amps. It's very exciting to see Bryston leading the charge in this regard.
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"Bryston is the only major audio company of which I'm aware that is producing a balanced headphone amp."
********
I haven't seen a comment about the topology of the revised circuit but assuming it is balanced, then a 4 pin female Neutrik and a 3 pin female Neutrik combo would cover all of the bases except for the double, 3 pin male headphone configuration. The 4 and 3 pin Neutrik config. has better cosmetics than 4 pin Neurtik and 1/4" TRS and will accommodate both single ended XLR and 1/4" TRS, IMO. The only "wrong" option appears to be male XLR out.
Steve
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Hi
Do not have the 50 ohms yet but here are 2 of the measurements on the BHA-1.
600 Ohms:
Voltage = 24V,
mW 875
32 Ohms:
Voltage = 11.46
mW = 4100
Remember if you were ever to listen at these levels you would do serious damage to either your hearing or your headphones :nono:
james
Hi James,
Do the circuit changes affect the specs that you provided above? If so, do you have the new specs?
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Hi James,
Do the circuit changes affect the specs that you provided above? If so, do you have the new specs?
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=55987)
PRODUCT FEATURES:
• Balanced Dual mono circuitry
• High Quality Noble Stereo Volume control– laser trimmed
• Left/Right Balance Control
• 6 Fully discrete Class A Bryston operational amplifiers
• Balanced outputs – 4 pin stereo and dual left/right 3 pin outputs
• Stereo ¼ inch single ended outputs
• 14dB or 20dB of selectable gain available
• All input and output connectors are Gold plated
• 10k input impedance
• Multiple headphone drive capability
POWER OPTIONS:
• Standard: high quality Bryston internal analog power supply
• Optional: MPS-2 power supply also available (replaces internal supply).
Bryston BHA-1 Headphone AMP Specifications
Harmonic Distortion: Less than .003 at 32 ohms at 100mW 20Hz to 20KHz.
IM Distortion: Less than 001%
Signal to Noise: Greater than 105dB
Frequency response: 20 to 20KHz plus or minus .1dB
Weight 8lbs (3.6 kg)
Dimensions:
(H) - 3.125 inches x (W) 17 or 19 inches x (D) 11.25 inches
HI-Z load: 20 Volts into 600 ohms (667mW) at 001% THD + N at 20-20K
Low-Z load: 4 volts into 32 ohms (500 mW) at 001% THD + N at 20-20K
-
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=55987)
PRODUCT FEATURES:
• Balanced Dual mono circuitry
• High Quality Noble Stereo Volume control– laser trimmed
• Left/Right Balance Control
• 6 Fully discrete Class A Bryston operational amplifiers
• Balanced outputs – 4 pin stereo and dual left/right 3 pin outputs
• Stereo ¼ inch single ended outputs
• 14dB or 20dB of selectable gain available
• All input and output connectors are Gold plated
• 10k input impedance
• Multiple headphone drive capability
POWER OPTIONS:
• Standard: high quality Bryston internal analog power supply
• Optional: MPS-2 power supply also available (replaces internal supply).
Bryston BHA-1 Headphone AMP Specifications
Harmonic Distortion: Less than .003 at 32 ohms at 100mW 20Hz to 20KHz.
IM Distortion: Less than 001%
Signal to Noise: Greater than 105dB
Frequency response: 20 to 20KHz plus or minus .1dB
Weight 8lbs (3.6 kg)
Dimensions:
(H) - 3.125 inches x (W) 17 or 19 inches x (D) 11.25 inches
HI-Z load: 20 Volts into 600 ohms (667mW) at 001% THD + N at 20-20K
Low-Z load: 4 volts into 32 ohms (500 mW) at 001% THD + N at 20-20K
James,
The specs look quite a bit lower in power than what you quoted before the circuit change or maybe it is the voltage difference that makes it appear lower. Can you comment on this? I have 4 orthodynamic headphones that are quite power hungry including the HE6 and I'm concerned now that the amp will not be powerful enough. Thanks, Steve
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Hi Steve,
Yes we found that we could get much lower distortion with this new circuit but at lower impedance's the voltage goes down a bit. I have not tried the HE6 myself (currently using Grado 1000) so I can not comment on that.
james
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Hi James,
1) Like Steve above, I am also using the Hifiman HE-6 headphones which are very power-hungry. I was very much looking forward to the BHA-1 to give it the power for it to sing. Since you also own the HE-6, will you mind running a test? I am sure that quite a few of us would be interested to know the outcome.
2) I notice from the new picture that the BHA-1 has male 3-pin and 4-pin XLR connectors. Pardon me for speculating that 99.9999% of headphone users will have to reterminate their headphones to use the BHA-1. Almost all headphone amplifiers I know of have female 3-pin and 4-pin XLR connectors. This is the so called "industrial standard". May I know if there is a good reason for Bryston to go against this convention?
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=55987)
PRODUCT FEATURES:
• Balanced Dual mono circuitry
• High Quality Noble Stereo Volume control– laser trimmed
• Left/Right Balance Control
• 6 Fully discrete Class A Bryston operational amplifiers
• Balanced outputs – 4 pin stereo and dual left/right 3 pin outputs
• Stereo ¼ inch single ended outputs
• 14dB or 20dB of selectable gain available
• All input and output connectors are Gold plated
• 10k input impedance
• Multiple headphone drive capability
POWER OPTIONS:
• Standard: high quality Bryston internal analog power supply
• Optional: MPS-2 power supply also available (replaces internal supply).
Bryston BHA-1 Headphone AMP Specifications
Harmonic Distortion: Less than .003 at 32 ohms at 100mW 20Hz to 20KHz.
IM Distortion: Less than 001%
Signal to Noise: Greater than 105dB
Frequency response: 20 to 20KHz plus or minus .1dB
Weight 8lbs (3.6 kg)
Dimensions:
(H) - 3.125 inches x (W) 17 or 19 inches x (D) 11.25 inches
HI-Z load: 20 Volts into 600 ohms (667mW) at 001% THD + N at 20-20K
Low-Z load: 4 volts into 32 ohms (500 mW) at 001% THD + N at 20-20K
-
"Almost all headphone amplifiers I know of have female 3-pin and 4-pin XLR connectors. This is the so called "industrial standard". May I know if there is a good reason for Bryston to go against this convention?"
*******
I think that you will be able to specify which XLR connections you want, but IMO it's not a good publicity picture to show male connections. If I wasn't aware of the previous discussion, I would take one look at the out-puts and move on. The idea of re-terminating or using an adapter isn't very appealing.
Steve
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Hi James,
1) Like Steve above, I am also using the Hifiman HE-6 headphones which are very power-hungry. I was very much looking forward to the BHA-1 to give it the power for it to sing. Since you also own the HE-6, will you mind running a test? I am sure that quite a few of us would be interested to know the outcome.
2) I notice from the new picture that the BHA-1 has male 3-pin and 4-pin XLR connectors. Pardon me for speculating that 99.9999% of headphone users will have to reterminate their headphones to use the BHA-1. Almost all headphone amplifiers I know of have female 3-pin and 4-pin XLR connectors. This is the so called "industrial standard". May I know if there is a good reason for Bryston to go against this convention?
Hi
The unit will be available with either male or female.
I only had the HE 6 on loan so I do not have a pair at this point.
James
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Hi James,
Is there a possibility of Bryston making their own balanced and RCA headphone cables?
Thanks,
Mark
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Hi James,
Is there a possibility of Bryston making their own balanced and RCA headphone cables?
Thanks,
Mark
As a matter of fact we were thinking the same thing :thumb:
James
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I suppose the shock that a child will get when they touch the pretty gold pins on the front panel will be mild. Maybe there are some caps that could be provided if by chance someone wants one with the male pins.
Tony
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As a matter of fact we were thinking the same thing
James
Great minds think alike. Well if you do i'll be the first in line. Congrats on getting this project to the manufacturing stage.
Mark
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Hi Steve,
Yes we found that we could get much lower distortion with this new circuit but at lower impedance's the voltage goes down a bit. I have not tried the HE6 myself (currently using Grado 1000) so I can not comment on that.
james
James,
The changes to lower distortion may be great for Grados and other high sensitivity headphones but not so great for power hungry orthos like the Audeze LCD2/LCD3 or the HiFiMan HE6. If I am interpreting the specs correctly, the power output of the BHA-1 has been changed from 4100mW to 500mW at 32 ohms. That is a huge decrease in power. Unless you can convince me otherwise, I will be cancelling my order because I don't think this amp will now meet my needs.
Steve
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James,
The changes to lower distortion may be great for Grados and other high sensitivity headphones but not so great for power hungry orthos like the Audeze LCD2/LCD3 or the HiFiMan HE6. If I am interpreting the specs correctly, the power output of the BHA-1 has been changed from 4100mW to 500mW at 32 ohms. That is a huge decrease in power. Unless you can convince me otherwise, I will be cancelling my order because I don't think this amp will now meet my needs.
Steve
Hi Steve
Yes I would cancel your order because we are staying with the newer design.
James
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Hi James,
It is such a pity! (but you can loan them again, can't you? :icon_lol:)
Grados headphones are generally very easy to drive that even portable headphone amps can drive them more than adequately.
The challenge is for amps in general (and more specifically for me, BHA-1) to adequately drive the planar magnetic (also called orthodynamic) headphones - think mini Magneplanar/Maggie speakers against the ears. These headphones are all the rage now for good reason and my feel is their popularity will continue to increase - provided there are enough powerful amplifiers to drive them.
I really really hope BHA-1 with its revised lower power can do the job well. I have already placed an order for it.
(Question to self: if after extensive testing, it is found that BHA-1 cannot drive all my headphones well, should I sell it and buy other amps that can, or do I keep the BHA-1 and sell all my headphones and buy new ones...? :o)
Hi
The unit will be available with either male or female.
I only had the HE 6 on loan so I do not have a pair at this point.
James
-
Hi James,
It is such a pity! (but you can loan them again, can't you? :icon_lol:)
Grados headphones are generally very easy to drive that even portable headphone amps can drive them more than adequately.
The challenge is for amps in general (and more specifically for me, BHA-1) to adequately drive the planar magnetic (also called orthodynamic) headphones - think mini Magneplanar/Maggie speakers against the ears. These headphones are all the rage now for good reason and my feel is their popularity will continue to increase - provided there are enough powerful amplifiers to drive them.
I really really hope BHA-1 with its revised lower power can do the job well. I have already placed an order for it.
(Question to self: if after extensive testing, it is found that BHA-1 cannot drive all my headphones well, should I sell it and buy other amps that can, or do I keep the BHA-1 and sell all my headphones and buy new ones...? :o)
Hi
I can not really say how well the BHA will drive the orthodynamic phones without trying them myself so I would recommend canceling your order until I can be more certain for you.
James
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Have a pair of the Hi-Fi Man HE500's and Audeze LCD2 on the way for testing.
james
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Have a pair of the Hi-Fi Man HE500's and Audeze LCD2 on the way for testing.
james
My guess is that all of us with orthoplanars are going to be very, very interested in what your verdict will be on these headphones when used with the BHA-1. As a very happy LCD-2 owner I going to be particularly attentive.
Dave
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Have a pair of the Hi-Fi Man HE500's and Audeze LCD2 on the way for testing.
james
James,
Thanks so much for following up on this after people expressed concern. This is the epitome of good customer service. Like others, I eagerly await your findings.
-
I very much appreciate all of the information and feedback from James Tanner in this thead, but frankly, I am a bit concerned. Very concerned. My impression is that Stuart Taylor is the designer, engineer, and decision maker when it comes to this effort. My impression also is that the ultimate product going to the manufacturing plant has been driven by laboratory testing much more than listening. Deciding to reduce power output at low impedances for the sake of lower measured distortion while James frankly admits that a wide range of phones have not been tried with the latest design is "Exhibit A" behind my impression. What happened to the design objective trumpeted by James 20 or so pages ago that the BHA-1 has been designed with newly popular orthostatic and hard to drive phones in mind?
Granted, the debate is tired and wearisome as to the role of laboratory testing and subjective listening and their values in audiophile product design and I don't want to re-hash them here or now. I do have the opinion that lab testing is critical but I also have the opinion that not every aspect of audio reproduction is currently susceptable to objective testing. Sometimes a change of resistor or capacitor or circuit layout causes an unanticipated change in subjective sound that defies any attempt at measurement. Sometimes a less expensive part produces better sound. To me, "connecting with the music" is the most difficult and elusive of qualities in high-end gear and whatever may or may not contribute to such quality is not capable of measurement. Bryston has been criticised in some camps for producing (sometimes) sterile or cold gear. Rightly or wrongly, I don't care to say. I will say that James Tanner's tag line could not be more accurate-a demo here is imperative.
-
I very much appreciate all of the information and feedback from James Tanner in this thead, but frankly, I am a bit concerned. Very concerned. My impression is that Stuart Taylor is the designer, engineer, and decision maker when it comes to this effort. My impression also is that the ultimate product going to the manufacturing plant has been driven by laboratory testing much more than listening. Deciding to reduce power output at low impedances for the sake of lower measured distortion while James frankly admits that a wide range of phones have not been tried with the latest design is "Exhibit A" behind my impression. What happened to the design objective trumpeted by James 20 or so pages ago that the BHA-1 has been designed with newly popular orthostatic and hard to drive phones in mind?
Granted, the debate is tired and wearisome as to the role of laboratory testing and subjective listening and their values in audiophile product design and I don't want to re-hash them here or now. I do have the opinion that lab testing is critical but I also have the opinion that not every aspect of audio reproduction is currently susceptable to objective testing. Sometimes a change of resistor or capacitor or circuit layout causes an unanticipated change in subjective sound that defies any attempt at measurement. Sometimes a less expensive part produces better sound. To me, "connecting with the music" is the most difficult and elusive of qualities in high-end gear and whatever may or may not contribute to such quality is not capable of measurement. Bryston has been criticised in some camps for producing (sometimes) sterile or cold gear. Rightly or wrongly, I don't care to say. I will say that James Tanner's tag line could not be more accurate-a demo here is imperative.
I agree some things are difficult to measure but over the many years we have been doing this I have found there is definitely a correlation between the accepted measure distortions and the listening experience. To decide that something that measures better sounds worse is simply not something I have experienced over the 40 so years I have been doing this.
james
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ok guys stupid question of the day. is 1000 mW equal to 1 watt
-
ok guys stupid question of the day. is 1000 mW equal to 1 watt
Exactly!
-
I agree some things are difficult to measure but over the many years we have been doing this I have found there is definitely a correlation between the accepted measure distortions and the listening experience. To decide that something that measures better sounds worse is simply not something I have experienced over the 40 so years I have been doing this.
james
For almost as long as James has been doing this, I have been buying Bryston gear, and doing so with great satisfaction. Only recently have I become interested in using headphones regularly, and for this reason I have been looking forward to the BHA-1.
I have long known that the headphone jack on my BP is very good. However, I discovered that it is does not make the various headphones I've used, sound as good as on an amp with lesser distortion measurements, in my case a relatively inexpensive Schiit Lyr. Because of the superb quality of other Bryston gear I naturally am expecting the BHA-1 to outperform th BP jack and the Lyr, and with luck a lot of other alternatives.
I share, however, the concerns expressed by others about the changed measurements of the BHA-1, not only because of the potential loss of power needed by planar headphones, but also because of the lack of testing the amp in the context of the headphone market. Not only would it be advisable to see how it performs on HE and LCD models, as James will be doing, but it seems to me that it also would make sense to compare the BHA-1 against competing headphone amps, such as Headroom's top models and the Burson.
One of the things I've learned so far about headphones is that an amp that may have great measurements is likely to be great for pro work, but be ignored by headphone afficianadoes.
At the end of the day, the market will decide, as James well knows, but the Bryston fan club, of which I am a long-time member, would hate to see the headphone community turn thumbs down on the BHA-1 when it comes out of the gates.
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Well, here is the dirty little truth about headphone amps (and let me come right out and say it's only my opinion and take it as one anonymous guy's subjective opinion and nothing more); headphone amps don't do much and mostly sound boring. I suspect most of the problem is with headphones themselves and not the amps. Since the transducers are right up against the head and ears, the sound is constrained. No room acoustics. We headphone enthusiasts have some compelling and misdirected notion that if a headphone amp has a huge case and is filled with lots of goodies it will provide us with what we have been heretofore lacking, that with lot of power or some other voodoo/hocus-pocus (huge tubes jutting out like Woo or Zana Deux or any number of others, wires going everywhere and nowhere as in the Single Power fiasco), the gates of audio nirvana will open and our cans will now have all the unconstrained dynamics and sonic glory that were previously constrained and hidden (sorry for the flowery prose). That is the real nature of the beast. All that said, I do still think that a well designed, powerful amp with low output impedence can make many headphones sound their best. And now back to the BHA-1. We shall see.
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Hi James,
Thank you for the effort in arranging to get the HE-500 and LCD2 for testing. It is, however, quite well-known in the headphone community that these 2 phones are much less of a load to drive as compared to the HE-6. I have both the LCD-2 and HE-6 and can subjectively confirm half of that saying. The manufacturer Hifiman which makes the HE series states quite openly that HE-6 (the current top model in its range) is much more power-hungry than HE-500 - this can kind of confirm the other half of that saying. I am not saying the world should revolve round the HE-6, but it is indeed an important benchmark to measure how powerful an amp is. Since you are getting the HE-500, why not also get the HE-6? If the BHA-1 can adequately drive the HE-6, it very likely can drive any in-production headphone (save electrostatics) in the world.
Hi
The unit will be available with either male or female.
I only had the HE 6 on loan so I do not have a pair at this point.
James
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Hi James,
Thank you for the effort in arranging to get the HE-500 and LCD2 for testing. It is, however, quite well-known in the headphone community that these 2 phones are much less of a load to drive as compared to the HE-6. I have both the LCD-2 and HE-6 and can subjectively confirm half of that saying. The manufacturer Hifiman which makes the HE series states quite openly that HE-6 (the current top model in its range) is much more power-hungry than HE-500 - this can kind of confirm the other half of that saying. I am not saying the world should revolve round the HE-6, but it is indeed an important benchmark to measure how powerful an amp is. Since you are getting the HE-500, why not also get the HE-6? If the BHA-1 can adequately drive the HE-6, it very likely can drive any in-production headphone (save electrostatics) in the world.
It sounds to me that some of these phones should be driven from a power amplifier?
james
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It sounds to me that some of these phones should be driven from a power amplifier?
james
Out of curiosity, I looked at the HiFiMAN website for details on the HE-6. It's sensitivity rating is very low - which would seem to call for higher power. Interestingly enough, the HiFiMAN website implies that it would be well matched with a 2-watt/ch headphone amplifier.
Freqency Response: 8 to 65 KHz
Impedence: 50 Ohm
Efficiency: 83.5 DB
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Well, here is the dirty little truth about headphone amps (and let me come right out and say it's only my opinion and take it as one anonymous guy's subjective opinion and nothing more); headphone amps don't do much and mostly sound boring. I suspect most of the problem is with headphones themselves and not the amps. Since the transducers are right up against the head and ears, the sound is constrained. No room acoustics. We headphone enthusiasts have some compelling and misdirected notion that if a headphone amp has a huge case and is filled with lots of goodies it will provide us with what we have been heretofore lacking, that with lot of power or some other voodoo/hocus-pocus (huge tubes jutting out like Woo or Zana Deux or any number of others, wires going everywhere and nowhere as in the Single Power fiasco), the gates of audio nirvana will open and our cans will now have all the unconstrained dynamics and sonic glory that were previously constrained and hidden (sorry for the flowery prose). That is the real nature of the beast. All that said, I do still think that a well designed, powerful amp with low output impedence can make many headphones sound their best. And now back to the BHA-1. We shall see.
Thanks, Fsonicsmith, for this comment. It has been my experience, limited though it is, that while headphone amps make a difference, confirms yours that that difference pales by comparison with the difference made by headphones themselves. Perhaps this is why so many headphone enthusiasts buy multiple pairs. With the exception of the high end Stax, it seems you may get a bigger bang out of your buck buying additional cans than buying a high end amp.
But your comment also reinforces the basic point about headphones - by their very nature they are not like listening to speakers. The experience can be very good, indeed, but it is a different one. It makes sense to demand that good headphones (together with good headphone amps) be accurate etc., etc., but it is not reasonable, I believe, to compare the headphone experience directly with that of one's main system.
For me, the chief attraction of the headphone experience is to take it in its own terms. Fsconicsmith, you say, rightly, headphones inevitably have a constrained sound. Depending on the gear you use, that constrained sound can feel very intimate, warm, and most pleasing, which may be why so many headphone enthusiasts like tube amps, and headphones that add to or enhance that kind of sound. For example, many admire the accuracy of HD800s, but it seems only a minority love them.
As to the BHA-1, in terms of the tastes I personally have developed in headphone use, if this new amp is very accurate in all ways, but detracts from rather than enhances the intimacy of the headphone experience I have come to prefer, then I probably will give it a pass. I had a headphone amp that did this (a Grace Designs m902 which is seldom mentioned in the headphone community) that was pricer than the BHA-1, and no doubt was most excellent, but wasn't for me. I gave it to a person doing pro work, which made it perfect for his use, but not mine. I hope, therefore, that the BHA-1 targets the headphone community rather than the pro market.
Dave
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A useful article on how headphone listening differs from listening to speakers:
http://audiophilereview.com/headphones/how-headphone-listening-is-different.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+AudiophileReview+%28Audiophile+Review%29
Dave
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Well after a lot of reading and demoing I've decided to order today a pair of Grado PS1000's in anticipation of the BHA-1 :thumb:
Although until the BHA-1 is available I'm hoping the SP3 will do a pretty good job, has anyone ever tried Grado's own headphone amp?
Any news James on when we can expect the BHA-1?
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Well after a lot of reading and demoing I've decided to order today a pair of Grado PS1000's in anticipation of the BHA-1 :thumb:
Although until the BHA-1 is available I'm hoping the SP3 will do a pretty good job, has anyone ever tried Grado's own headphone amp?
Any news James on when we can expect the BHA-1?
Vipers, I bought a Grado headphone amp many years ago. It was the most egregiously built piece of garbage I have ever owned. And it had a terrible hum. I took it back to the dealer and exchanged it for a V-Cans, which I subsequently traded for a Creek, both of which were far better. I have owned a Grace Designs m902, which was excellent, but did not have the sound I wanted. I run a Schiit Lyr now, which is the best I have had so far, but I would prefer a solid state amp if it were able to perform as well as the Lyr. In any case, I would recommend a Grado amp only to those I dislike.
Dave
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Vipers, I bought a Grado headphone amp many years ago. It was the most egregiously built piece of garbage I have ever owned. And it had a terrible hum. I took it back to the dealer and exchanged it for a V-Cans, which I subsequently traded for a Creek, both of which were far better. I have owned a Grace Designs m902, which was excellent, but did not have the sound I wanted. I run a Schiit Lyr now, which is the best I have had so far, but I would prefer a solid state amp if it were able to perform as well as the Lyr. In any case, I would recommend a Grado amp only to those I dislike.
Dave
Might also look at the Headroom amps:
http://www.headphone.com/headphone-amps/amplifiers.php
I have a balanced amp that is about eight years old and is going strong. This is the newest in that series:
http://www.headphone.com/headphone-amps/headroom-balanced-ultra-desktop-amp-buda.php
I am waiting for reviews of the new Bryston, esp with high power demand transducers to see how that works out.
Steve
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I would recommend a Grado amp only to those I dislike.
Dave
Thanks Dave, I actually contacted Grado and apparently they don't make the amp anymore and recomended that I look at Schiit also.
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DaveNote/Vipers,
Graham Slee is also a great headamp manufacturer. Graham now makes a tube amp called the Solo Ultra Linear at affordable price to performance.
DaveNote, based on reading your posts i would recommend you try to find a dealer who carries Graham Slee. I believe the sound signature you are after lies with them.
Mark
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DaveNote/Vipers,
Graham Slee is also a great headamp manufacturer. Graham now makes a tube amp called the Solo Ultra Linear at affordable price to performance.
DaveNote, based on reading your posts i would recommend you try to find a dealer who carries Graham Slee. I believe the sound signature you are after lies with them.
Mark
Thanks, Mark. I'll see if I can find a local Graham Slee dealer. Because I like Bryston equipment so much and prefer solid state gear, I'm hoping the BHA-1 will outperform the Lyr. But like others, I'm a bit hesitant because of James's recently published power ratings on the BHA-1. Yet I am holding out hope because I have yet to be disappointed by buying Bryston.
Dave
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Thanks Dave, I actually contacted Grado and apparently they don't make the amp anymore and recomended that I look at Schiit also.
Very interesting, Vipers. I was disappointed in my Lyr at first. For reasons unknown, it had an irritating hum. However, eventually it faded to the point that it is not noticeable at my listening levels. The makers explanation was that tubes are weird. Not much of a comfort, and one of the reasons I prefer SS.
Dave
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DaveNote-------the graham slee solo ultralinear headphone amp is ss not tube based.if you go to the website it explains that he made a circut to sound like tubes,hence the ultralinear name.reading the forum on his site it looks like it takes about 1000 hrs to fully burn in
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DaveNote----------me again it's www.gspaudio.co.uk
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DaveNote----------me again it's www.gspaudio.co.uk
Thanks won ton on for the follow up. I checked it out, and there is a local dealer. Have to see if they have a demo.
Dave
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Hi folks
Got the HE 500 phones in and tried them on the BHA-1 - really like the phone :thumb: :thumb: I only heard the HE 6 on the previous version of the BHA but I think I like the 500 better :scratch:
James
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Hi folks
Got the HE 500 phones in and tried them on the BHA-1 - really like the phone :thumb: :thumb: I only heard the HE 6 on the previous version of the BHA but I think I like the 500 better :scratch:
James
Hi James,
Thanks for following up on this. So does that mean that the BHA-1 has enough power to drive the HE-500? What gain setting did you use? Did you use single-ended or balanced connection? At what position was the volume pot for comfortable listening level?
Thanks!
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Hi James,
Thanks for following up on this. So does that mean that the BHA-1 has enough power to drive the HE-500? What gain setting did you use? Did you use single-ended or balanced connection? At what position was the volume pot for comfortable listening level?
Thanks!
Single ended about 11 oclock. The BHA-1 runs pure Class A so even at full rotation of the volume control would not be an issue.
james
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Single ended about 11 oclock. The BHA-1 runs pure Class A so even at full rotation of the volume control would not be an issue.
james
For what it is worth, by comparison, I run my Schiit Lyr amp, which has 6 watts of power, at 9:00 o'clock and the headphone jack of my BP26 at 10, using my LCD-2 headphones. In each case, higher volumes would be close to being dangerously high.
LCD-2s are 50 ohms, and HE500s are 38 ohms. So my guess is that the BHA-1 power might be closer to that of my preamp jack than to my Lyr.
Dave
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BHA-1 at CES
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=56395)
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Hey James,
While the LCD's can handle up to 15 watts they can also play 90dB with 1mw.
We usually recommend 1 watt although from the specs of your BHA-1 you should be more than fine.
Let me know if you have any other questions.
Thank you,
Alexander Rosson
www.audeze.com
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Hey James,
While the LCD's can handle up to 15 watts they can also play 90dB with 1mw.
We usually recommend 1 watt although from the specs of your BHA-1 you should be more than fine.
Let me know if you have any other questions.
Thank you,
Alexander Rosson
www.audeze.com
Many thanks, James, for getting this information from Audeze. As an LCD user, I found this to be one of the most useful pieces of information about the BHA-1 to date.
Dave
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Hi James,
Will you kindly pose a similar question to Hifiman/Head-Direct regarding the HE-6 please?
Thank you very much
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Hi James,
Will you kindly pose a similar question to Hifiman/Head-Direct regarding the HE-6 please?
Thank you very much
I did many moons ago - no answer :scratch:
James
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Well I have 4 different headphones now and I thought speakers sounded different :duh:
James
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I did many moons ago - no answer :scratch:
James
Maybe HiFiMan, which builds headphone amps as well as headphones, may be a little reluctant to help a competitor, especially since it, too, is introducing a new SS amp in a few weeks at about the same price as the BHA-1. BTW, its new EF-6 will produce 5 watts of power.
Dave
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Well I have 4 different headphones now and I thought speakers sounded different :duh:
James
Yeah, it's kinda crazy just how radically different some headphones can sound from each other, but that's also why headphone listening can be such a fun hobby. It's much easier to swap out headphones than speakers; you can easily build up an arsenal of headphones for various types of listening.
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Hey James,
While the LCD's can handle up to 15 watts they can also play 90dB with 1mw.
We usually recommend 1 watt although from the specs of your BHA-1 you should be more than fine.
Let me know if you have any other questions.
Thank you,
Alexander Rosson
www.audeze.com
This is really helpful to know. Thanks, Alexander and James.
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HI-Z load: 20 Volts into 600 ohms (667mW) at 001% THD + N at 20-20K
Low-Z load: 4 volts into 32 ohms (500 mW) at 001% THD + N at 20-20K
Hi James,
I'm curious as to why the power output drops as the impedance of the headphone decreases. I thought that power output is supposed to increase as impedance decreases. Are headphones different than speakers in this regard?
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I thought that power output is supposed to increase as impedance decreases. Are headphones different than speakers in this regard?
The thing different about headphones is the extremely wide variation in impedances between them, that is much narrower with speakers. If the amplifier voltage was constant, then the lower impedance would have more power, but my guess is that a design that can accommodate the wide variation between 32 ohms and 600 ohms impedance might require two different circuits that could explain the difference in voltage output.
Is there a low/high impedance switch on the BHA-1?
Steve
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The thing different about headphones is the extremely wide variation in impedances between them, that is much narrower with speakers. If the amplifier voltage was constant, then the lower impedance would have more power, but my guess is that a design that can accommodate the wide variation between 32 ohms and 600 ohms impedance might require two different circuits that could explain the difference in voltage output.
Is there a low/high impedance switch on the BHA-1?
Steve
Hi Steve - yes there is a high/low impedance switch.
james
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A useful article on how headphone listening differs from listening to speakers:
http://audiophilereview.com/headphones/how-headphone-listening-is-different.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+AudiophileReview+%28Audiophile+Review%29 (http://audiophilereview.com/headphones/how-headphone-listening-is-different.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+AudiophileReview+%28Audiophile+Review%29)
Dave
Dave, read this and found it interesting. Though I have a decent pair of cans i.e. Grado SR80's, they would only be mid-head-fi level, at best. This has always left me wondering how much more could be got by moving to something twice the price or so? For me, stereo imaging, both depth and bredth is an essential part of my attraction to critical listening through in-room speakers...I've never had a realistic / believeable room space from my headphones and wondered if that was primarily limited by my cans and/or headphone amp. This article suggests that there are clear limits based on the inherent nature of headphones. Interesting.
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Dave, read this and found it interesting. Though I have a decent pair of cans i.e. Grado SR80's, they would only be mid-head-fi level, at best. This has always left me wondering how much more could be got by moving to something twice the price or so? For me, stereo imaging, both depth and bredth is an essential part of my attraction to critical listening through in-room speakers...I've never had a realistic / believeable room space from my headphones and wondered if that was primarily limited by my cans and/or headphone amp. This article suggests that there are clear limits based on the inherent nature of headphones. Interesting.
SoundGame, the enjoyment in listening to headphones is not to ask or expect them to have the same sound as speakers. They do not and cannot give you the sense of room space as do speakers. It is a bit like reading a great 19th century Emglish novel vs a great 20th century American one. They will have very different syntax, for example. Each has to be read in its own terms. Same with jazz. You can't enjoy swing expecting and wanting it to sound like bop.
I have owned Grado SR80s for years, but I've never found them particularly enjoyable to listen to, nor RS-1s, which I gave away. I also gave away my Sennheiser HD800s, which I found much better than the Grados. They were outstanding in terms of accuracy and a wide soundstage, but not enjoyable. My Audeze LCD-2s are altogether different. First time I've ever used headphones over extended listening periods. They, too, are accurate, with a very deep but authentic bass; engaging midrange and increasingly pleasing high end (not as bright as the HD800).
In short, SoundGame, if you can listen to headphones in their own terms, setting aside speaker expectations, it is well worth buying a pair of very good ones. And since there is a booming market in headphones, the selection never has been better. And I would be remiss in not recommending that you try planar headphones.
Dave
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Please excuse my ignorance, but how do I know that I need to get the BHA-1? Why not use the headphones socket on the BP26?
Ash
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Please excuse my ignorance, but how do I know that I need to get the BHA-1? Why not use the headphones socket on the BP26?
Ash
Like regular systems (speakers, amps, preamps, etc.) headphones come in different flavours and different sounds. Wilson and PMC speakers have different sounds to them, as do Bryston amps vs. MacInntosh amps. Grado headphones sound very different than Sennheiser headphones.
When in comes to headphone amps, they generally sound very different than the sound you get out of a headphone jack, and people have different tastes in both headphones and amps. Generally, headphone enthusiasts prefer headphone amps, which usually have greater power than do headphone jacks, which are especially important when driving planar headphones, which are increasingly popular. Most very serious headphone enthusiasts seem to prefer tube amps.
But sometimes, as I have discovered just this week, there are some headphone jacks that are can sound better for your preferences than a headphone amp. It turns out that receivers and integrated amps from the 1970s and 80s, because they were built differently then, can have outstanding headphone jack performance. I am now using a Pioneer SX980 receiver built in the 80s that gives me the sound I've been looking for with my Audeze LCD-2 planar headphones. Great detail, transparency and slam, while bringing out their high end. I find that does not have the dry and analytical sound that can come out of solid state headphone amps, but is not as dark as the hybrid tube amp I have used.
Or to put it another way, the headphone hobby is kind of like a parallel universe to the standard audio system, with many different strokes for different folks.
Bryston is new to this very different universe with the imminent introduction of its BHA-1 headphone amplifier. No doubt it will be excellent. But the question will be whether it will be welcomed by headphone enthusiasts, and if not, what other potential customers will embrace it.
Dave
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Please excuse my ignorance, but how do I know that I need to get the BHA-1? Why not use the headphones socket on the BP26?
Ash
Hi Ash
Yes headphones come in many flavours and the difficulty in driving the more difficult loads (low sensitivity and low impedances) can be problematic for the headphone jack on a typical preamp. With Receivers and some Integrated amps they drive the headphone jack with the built in amplifier section rather than the preamp section. As with all amplifiers the quality of those preamp sections or amplifier stages are important and recognize that distortion rises rapidly as the load gets more difficult. For instance on the BHA we have developed a circuit with vanishingly low distortion and find it sounds exceptional on most of the headphones we have tried including the very difficult loads that the orthodynamic phones present - which are currently all the rage.
Headphone listening is a very different presentation than speaker listening so I think you would have to be a very serious listener to buy the BHA rather than a casual listener where the typical headphone jack (BP-26) would be more than enough.
Hope this helps
James
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Hi Ash
Yes headphones come in many flavours and the difficulty in driving the more difficult loads (low sensitivity and low impedances) can be problematic for the headphone jack on a typical preamp. With Receivers and some Integrated amps they drive the headphone jack with the built in amplifier section rather than the preamp section. As with all amplifiers the quality of those preamp sections or amplifier stages are important and recognize that distortion rises rapidly as the load gets more difficult. For instance on the BHA we have developed a circuit with vanishingly low distortion and find it sounds exceptional on most of the headphones we have tried including the very difficult loads that the orthodynamic phones present - which are currently all the rage.
Headphone listening is a very different presentation than speaker listening so I think you would have to be a very serious listener to buy the BHA rather than a casual listener where the typical headphone jack (BP-26) would be more than enough.
Hope this helps
James
James, I am very pleased to learn that the BHA-1 sounds so good with planar headphones. But the assessments you are making about how the BHA-1 performs comparing how various headphones sound on the BHA-1 might prove to be interesting, but not telling when it is reviewed by headphone people. Basically, these comparisons are a little like assessing a BMW against a Mercedes by driving only the BMW but with different sets of tires. Headphone enthusiasts, and reviewers, are going to compare the BHA-1 against other amps using the same headphone. For example, they will want to know how LCD-2s sound when it as compared to a Burson, a Woo, etc., and then taking another headphone like and HD800 and again compare amp to amp.
Dave
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James, I am very pleased to learn that the BHA-1 sounds so good with planar headphones. But the assessments you are making about how the BHA-1 performs comparing how various headphones sound on the BHA-1 might prove to be interesting, but not telling when it is reviewed by headphone people. Basically, these comparisons are a little like assessing a BMW against a Mercedes by driving only the BMW but with different sets of tires. Headphone enthusiasts, and reviewers, are going to compare the BHA-1 against other amps using the same headphone. For example, they will want to know how LCD-2s sound when it as compared to a Burson, a Woo, etc., and then taking another headphone like and HD800 and again compare amp to amp.
Dave
Hi Dave,
Yes true - but that is no different then when reviewers compare our amplifiers against other amplifiers. You either agree with Brystons philosophy of very low distortion, low noise, linear amplification or you do not.
james
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Hi Dave,
Yes true - but that is no different then when reviewers compare our amplifiers against other amplifiers. You either agree with Brystons philosophy of a very low distortion, low noise, linear amplification or you do not.
james
As a customer of yours for more than 30 years, it is patently clear that I have confidence in Bryston products, but, with respect, my buying decisions ultimately have not been a matter of agreeing or not agreeing with the Bryston philosophy, however important that philosophy may be to Bryston. Ulitmately, I buy Bryston because I like the sound it has produced using the various speakers I have owned - Mission, Hales, and PMC. Headphone amp buyers won't be buying a philosophy, they will be comparing sound, just as they do with regular amps, and buying the amp that gives them the sound, not philosophy, they prefer.
I know that there a those who have audio philosophies, and I for one, have followed some. But getting more into headphones, I discovered that a philosophy that applies well to speakers does not necessarily give me the sound I prefer when listening to headphones. It is a good lesson. It has helped to remind me that as an audio consumer, what I enjoy trumps everything else, including any audio philosophies.
I'm hoping, as I suppose you are, that in applying the Bryston philosophy in this very different market that it will produce the kind of sound that serious headphone enthusiasts prefer.
Dave
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As a customer of yours for more than 30 years, it is patently clear that I have confidence in Bryston products, but, with respect, my buying decisions ultimately have not been a matter of agreeing or not agreeing with the Bryston philosophy, however important that philosophy may be to Bryston. Ulitmately, I buy Bryston because I like the sound it has produced using the various speakers I have owned - Mission, Hales, and PMC. Headphone amp buyers won't be buying a philosophy, they will be comparing sound, just as they do with regular amps, and buying the amp that gives them the sound, not philosophy, they prefer.
I know that there a those who have audio philosophies, and I for one, have followed some. But getting more into headphones, I discovered that a philosophy that applies well to speakers does not necessarily give me the sound I prefer when listening to headphones. It is a good lesson. It has helped to remind me that as an audio consumer, what I enjoy trumps everything else, including any audio philosophies.
I'm hoping, as I suppose you are, that in applying the Bryston philosophy in this very different markets that it will produce the kind of sound that serious headphone enthusiasts prefer.
Dave
I disagree Dave - linearity of signal input vs output has always been our goal at Bryston. Over the years I have found that the more we can reduce the known distortions and the lower we can get the noise floor the better or more accurate the amplifiers sound.
Waveform accuracy is repeatable and demonstrable. I agree people buy for reasons other than accuracy but 'voicing' a product to sound a specific way is not something Bryston will pursue.
james
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I disagree Dave - linearity of signal input vs output has always been our goal at Bryston. Over the years I have found that the more we can reduce the known distortions and the lower we can get the noise floor the better or more accurate the amplifiers sound.
Waveform accuracy is repeatable and demonstrable. I agree people buy for reasons other than accuracy but 'voicing' a product to sound a specific way is not something Bryston will pursue.
james
James, I wonder what it is that your disagree with about my message. Do you disagree with the main point which was my observation that audio consumers should buy the products that give them the sound they prefer?
Somehow, it seems, you are suggesting that I am challenging Bryston's determination to follow a design and engineering goal and philosophy. Read my message carefully, and you will find not such challenge. Indeed, I applaud Bryston's consistency. But what Bryston does and wants is, obviously, not what all consumers want - otherwise you would have no competitors who follow different approaches.
It is one thing to pursue a laudable design goal and philosophy. By the tone of your messages, which seem to be highly defensive for reasons I can't fathom, it seems you're moving from philosophy to theology - hinting that the Bryston Philosophy has something to do with Absolute Truth. I saw theology of this kind once before when years ago a Bose rep claimed that Bose speakers were scientifically perfect, the implication being that nobody else need to bother to design any other speakers. I didn't buy that message then, and I don't buy it now.
Dave
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James, I wonder what it is that your disagree with about my message. Do you disagree with the main point which was my observation that audio consumers should buy the products that give them the sound they prefer?
Somehow, it seems, you are suggesting that I am challenging Bryston's determination to follow a design and engineering goal and philosophy. Read my message carefully, and you will find not such challenge. Indeed, I applaud Bryston's consistency. But what Bryston does and wants is, obviously, not what all consumers want - otherwise you would have no competitors who follow different approaches.
It is one thing to pursue a laudable design goal and philosophy. By the tone of your messages, which seem to be highly defensive for reasons I can't fathom, it seems you're moving from philosophy to theology - hinting that the Bryston Philosophy has something to do with Absolute Truth. I saw theology of this kind once before when years ago a Bose rep claimed that Bose speakers were scientifically perfect, the implication being that nobody else need to bother to design any other speakers. I didn't buy that message then, and I don't buy it now.
Dave
Hi Dave,
No- I hope I am not coming off or trying to be too defensive just making it known that our design philosophies are tied to the 'science' of amplification. I thought you were saying we should try to design and build products that fit a specific sonic mind set and I just wanted to make it clear that was not a direction we would feel comfortable with. Anyway as you say customers will either appreciate our efforts or not and I guess the market will decide.
james
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Hi Dave,
No- I hope I am not coming off or trying to be too defensive just making it known that our design philosophies are tied to the 'science' of amplification. I thought you were saying we should try to design and build products that fit a specific sonic mind set and I just wanted to make it clear that was not a direction we would feel comfortable with. Anyway as you say customers will either appreciate our efforts or not and I guess the market will decide.
james
James, as one who has literally spent many thousands of dollars on products based on the Bryston philosophy that have given me the sound I have preferred (albeit the Bryston 20 year warranty and unsurpassed service are added reasons to buy Bryston), I would be the last to suggest that you change it. And because I am a long-time Bryston supporter (I always recommend Bryston) I am hoping that the Bryston philosophy will result in a headphone amp that will encourage the headphone market to decide in its favour. If I have any doubts, it is not about Bryston, but rather that the high end headphone market seems to prefer tubed amps, and, therefore, it seems amps with certain sonic signatures.
But, I also readily confess that I am a lousy prognosticator when it comes to Bryston's new products. You will recall I had serious doubts about the reception of the BDP-1, but ended up preordering one (serial no. 13), and am wildly satisfied with it, as are most high end reviewers. So while I have my doubts about the market reception of the BHA-1, I readily accept that you are a far better judge of audio markets than I.
So, after all, on the basics it looks as if we have come to something of an agreement.
Dave
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James, as one who has literally spent many thousands of dollars on products based on the Bryston philosophy that have given me the sound I have preferred (albeit the Bryston 20 year warranty and unsurpassed service are added reasons to buy Bryston), I would be the last to suggest that you change it. And because I am a long-time Bryston supporter (I always recommend Bryston) I am hoping that the Bryston philosophy will result in a headphone amp that will encourage the headphone market to decide in its favour. If I have any doubts, it is not about Bryston, but rather that the high end headphone market seems to prefer tubed amps, and, therefore, it seems amps with certain sonic signatures.
But, I also readily confess that I am a lousy prognosticator when it comes to Bryston's new products. You will recall I had serious doubts about the reception of the BDP-1, but ended up preordering one (serial no. 13), and am wildly satisfied with it, as are most high end reviewers. So while I have my doubts about the market reception of the BHA-1, I readily accept that you are a far better judge of audio markets than I.
So, after all, on the basics it looks as if we have come to something of an agreement.
Dave
:thumb: :thumb: :thumb: :thumb:
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Headphone listening is a very different presentation than speaker listening so I think you would have to be a very serious listener to buy the BHA rather than a casual listener where the typical headphone jack (BP-26) would be more than enough.
Hi James,
Can I simplify "serious listener" by the price of headphones? Say anything below $500, stick to the BP26?
Ash
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Well after nearly a year of research and listening to many different pairs of headphones and in preparation for the BHA-1 I just bought my first pair of high quality headphones, thought I would do a little unboxing :roll: it's good to know that Grado don't waste any money on the packaging although the tart in me would have liked a nice wooden case to protect them in when not in use.
I have to say I know quite a few so called audiophiles friends who don't use headphones which I don't understand tbh as I've been extremely impressed with these, yes they don't have the soundstage and range of a good floorstander but the detail retrieval and the ability to get lost in the music is second to none. I haven't had much time to listen, but I've got this week off from work so I intend to change that, but I've listened to some Tom Mcrae, Radiohead and Damien Rice and I know it is the biggest cliche in the HiFi book 'I'm hearing stuff I've never heard before' but with these it's so true, makes you wonder how much detail there is left in these recording really.
To me it makes so much sense if you are into your music to have a pair of headphones not as an way to listen to music late at night or to keep the piece but as an alternative to using your main speakers as you get such a different and immersive experience, I've found them particularly great with vocals led music.
I've found that the SP3 has no problems whatsoever driving these so it will be interesting to see if the BHA-1 sounds any different, I can see me really getting into the headphone way of listening to music, I'd love to hear the Audeze LCD-3's and Stax SR-009.
So the million dollar question James, how close is the BHA-1 to release?
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=56828)
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=56829)
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=56830)
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=56831)
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=56832)
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Hi Vipers
I hope end of Feb and I am trying to get a pair to PMC for the upcoming audio show.
James
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Hi James,
Can I simplify "serious listener" by the price of headphones? Say anything below $500, stick to the BP26?
Ash
Hi Ash
It really depends on the load and efficiently of the hearphones.
James
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For instance on the BHA we have developed a circuit with vanishingly low distortion and find it sounds exceptional on most of the headphones we have tried including the very difficult loads that the orthodynamic phones present - which are currently all the rage.
James,
In addition to the statement from Alexander at Audeze that you provided earlier in the thread, it sounds like your own experience confirms that the BHA-1 does a good job of driving the LCD-2. Have you had the opportunity to test the Audeze LCD-2 yourself? Thanks!
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Hi Vipers
I hope end of Feb and I am trying to get a pair to PMC for the upcoming audio show.
James
Excellent, thanks James, I spoke to Tom at PMC last week and he mentioned that we'll hopefully have a BHA-1 available for our open day which will be great as I've just opened a Grado account so it will nice to have something a bit special to demo them on :)
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Here is what the BHA-1 does to a person as reported in the January 2012 issue of Stereophile by Kalman Rubinson from the 2011 CEDIA Expo: "When I first arrived at the Indiana Convention Center, I came upon Bryston's James Tanner, feet up, eyes closed, oblivious to all the manic activity around him, listening to music via a prototype of Bryston's new headphone amp." Man, I wish I had a job like that! :D
And I am still sorry that I didn't take a picture before I disturbed his reverie.