Oppo DSD

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klao

Re: Oppo DSD
« Reply #20 on: 30 Mar 2013, 04:06 pm »
The review at HiFI+ (UK, I think that was the name) incorrectly had the Oppo set for PCM and was using the wrong HDMi output.  It was a case of ignorance; not reading the manual.  The Oppo is SABRE chip-bases like many DSD-capable DAC; it plays back DSD in native format if set to do so (what happens inside any of these DACs is for the more technical...DSD actually becomes 5 bit, etc.....but that's not the issue).  The difference in sonic goodness from playback has much more to do with quality of aprts (i.,e price) and design of the analog stage and power supplies.  Of course a $7k-15k playback setup will likely outdo a $500 Oppo!

Thanks, Ted.

Well, I'm still enjoying SACD playbacks from my MWI Oppo 95 Tube Mod via analogue XLR outputs.  Glad to be confirmed that Oppo's 95 & 105 internal DACs (and perhaps all universal players that can play SACDs) can play DSD in native format. 

Just noticed from the discussions in the link below, however, that given my current settings, SACD output: DSD, and HDMI Audio: Auto, I should not turn on my TV.  If it's turned on, I should not select TV to display the particular HDMI input that is connected to the Oppo.  Otherwise, the SACD playback would show "PCM" (even when Oppo's HDMI1 is set as the primary video output and "yes" in only video signal sending option).

If instead, it is set to - HDMI Audio: Off (while SACD output: DSD) then no such troubles. 

http://forums.stevehoffman.tv/threads/oppo-bdp-95-audiophile-universal-blu-ray-sacd-dvd-a-player-part-2.268591/page-4

Russtafarian

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Re: Oppo DSD
« Reply #21 on: 1 Apr 2013, 06:24 pm »
Here’s an update on playing multi-channel DSD files on my Oppo BDP-103.

My current setup for playing multi-channel DSD (and FLAC) files uses Foobar to play and convert the files to 24/88 PCM, then send them to the BDP-103 via HDMI.  With Apple Remote/Ipod Touch control over Foobar, I can easily browse, search, scroll, through the files and see metadata and cover art.  The setup works smoothly, sounds pretty good and serves as my point of reference for evaluating direct DSD playback on the Oppo.  I did try setting Foobar to play DSD through HDMI to the Oppo.  It didn’t work.

I connected a 3TB USB drive with nearly 400 multi-channel DSD albums (ripped and extracted from my SACD collection) to the front input of the 103.  I was able to access the folders and files through the menu system and play any file I selected.  The sound quality differences between playing multi-channel SACDs and DSD files are the same as what I heard when comparing stereo discs and files, so I won’t go into any more detail on that.

Sound quality compared to the Foobar/PCM/HDMI setup (see above) is WOW much better!  The level of resolution really steps up.  Direct DSD sounds significantly more open, extended, and fast.  Comparatively, PCM/HDMI sounds a bit blurred, muted and smoothed over.  Elements in the mix that PCM/HDMI only hints at snap into focus with direct DSD.  For example, with direct DSD I could discern for the first time the slightly smoky, gritty character of Susannah McCorkle’s voice as she sang “Waters of March”.  And the transient percussive snap of the various drums on “Daraijin” from Kodo - Mondo Head was so intense that it kept my “startle” impulse on edge through the whole track.

This is a good news/bad news situation for me.  DSD file playback on the 103 via USB drive clearly sounds better than my current Foobar/PCM/HDMI setup.  That’s good!  But the Oppo menu interface is so LAME compared to the Apple Remote interface for Foobar.  That’s bad.  To navigate to an album I have to click down, one by one, past each album folder to get to the one I want.  With nearly 400 album folders, do you know how long it takes to get to Pink Floyd or Shostakovich?  TOO long!  There has got to be a way to improve Oppo’s interface for playing back music files.

I did run into a few other limitations and technical glitches.  I don’t use a center channel speaker, and with the PCM/HDMI setup I set the Oppo to map the center channel signal to the left and right speakers.  This is not an option when playing back direct DSD multi-channel files.  With most mixes, not having the center channel doesn’t seem to make a big difference. But there are a handful of mixes, like James Taylor – Hourglass, where the main vocal just disappears from the mix.  Oh well.

Occasionally, files will stop, start and/or stutter in the middle of playback.  It didn’t happen often, and restarting the track usually fixed it, but it’s a definite mood killer to have that happen in the middle of a tune.  Also, when I set the Oppo to output DSD as PCM, channel assignments for multi-channel DSD files get mixed up.  The left rear & right rear channels get swapped with the center and LFE channels.  The result is that center channel vocals play from the left rear, LFE gets lost in the right rear, and surround elements appear in the middle of the front sound stage.  This is not a big deal since I’m not sure why someone would go to the trouble of playing back direct DSD only to convert it to PCM.  I’m sure Oppo will fix this in future firmware updates.

Russ

ted_b

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Re: Oppo DSD
« Reply #22 on: 1 Apr 2013, 07:25 pm »
Russ,
Thanks for that.  Yes, the GUI is the biggest hurdle right now, as is the DSP/mixing you need for your setup (or channel trims for those with various gains/efficiencies in their speaker setup).  I am able to do all through jremote, but then I need a stack of three DACs and a USB hub, with cables, etc.  :)

Ric Schultz

Re: Oppo DSD
« Reply #23 on: 3 Apr 2013, 06:06 pm »
I have not done this on the 103/105s but on the 95 here is some info that might be useful: 

1.  The front usb port does not sound anywhere near as good as the rear port.  The rear port is located very close to the decoder chip whereas the front usb port has to go through extra cables and a long distance on the circuit board.

2.  If you are using a usb thumb drive then all thumb drives sound different from each other.  I had a thumb drive that had a plastic rattly housing on it.  I had an identical one and removed its plastic housing, removed the led on it, and burned it on the computer using damping material to hold it tight into the socket.  When I plugged it into the back of the Oppo I used the same EAR SD40AL damping material to hold the modded usb into the socket.  It sounded way, way, way better than the stock unmodified usb.  I told this info to someone who was using the front usb jack and he did not want to believe any thing I said......but he finally decided to listen and agreed 100%.  He not only said the rear port sounded better but that his rubber encased usb stick sounded rubbery and that his all steel one sounded steely.  All my listening was using a 24/192 download of Tea for the Tillerman.  I would describe the sound thus: the front usb port using the stock usb stick sounded like a 1960 transisitor radio (horrible).  The rear usb post using the stock usb stick sounded like a 1960 tube radio (listenable).  The modified and damped usb stick in the rear sounded like really good 16/44.  I figured with more tweaking that it would have sounded like 24/192 but never did more.

3.  What I did not try was treating the contact pins on the usb stick and I never tried other usb sticks.  There are only four pins and you could use the silver-gold contact enhancement on them without shorting and I also wanted to try damping the usb receiver inside the player.

4.  If I was using a usb cable then I would treat the contact pins and use the EAR material to damp the usb connection.  I bet this would give better sound.

tubesguy2

Re: Oppo DSD
« Reply #24 on: 4 Apr 2013, 02:26 pm »
He not only said the rear port sounded better but that his rubber encased usb stick sounded rubbery and that his all steel one sounded steely. 

Well, there you have it. All USB sticks for audio should obviously be made of silk. :wink:

Hank

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Re: Oppo DSD
« Reply #25 on: 5 Apr 2013, 10:22 am »
Uh-oh, another chance for one of the snake oil audiophool vendors to offer a hyper-expensive mod  :duh:

Russtafarian

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Re: Oppo DSD
« Reply #26 on: 5 Apr 2013, 04:40 pm »
Let's keep this thread on topic please. 

Rick offers some tweaking suggestions that are relevant to playing DSD files on the Oppo.  That's cool.  I reconnected my USB drive to the rear connector on the 103 based on his suggestion.  I haven't taken the time to listen and compare front vs. back USB connections, but I will soon.  If I hear a difference, I'll report back.

Russ

Hank

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Re: Oppo DSD
« Reply #27 on: 2 May 2013, 02:58 pm »
Russ, I assume you heard no difference between front and back USB ports.

Russtafarian

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Re: Oppo DSD
« Reply #28 on: 15 Dec 2013, 12:07 am »
Something new to report on Oppo DSD playback.  Oppo just released their media remote app for ipod/iphone and android phones/tablets.  The ipad version has been out for a while, but not having one, I wasn't able to try the media app... until now.

While file navigation still doesn't compete with tightly integrated programs & apps like Jriver/Jremote, the app makes it much easier to search, select and play storage-attached files on the Oppo.  This is a nice step forward for those of us who want to use the Oppo to play native DSD (especially multi-channel) music files. 

It also makes it easier to set up and control a simple music server without messing with a computer or USB DAC.  Attach a USB drive with music files to a current Oppo player.  Set up the player and media app on a home network and start listening to your music files with tablet/phone playback control.

If you have a Oppo BDP-103 or BDP-105, it's worth checking out.  It does require the latest firmware update to work.

Russ

Phil A

Re: Oppo DSD
« Reply #29 on: 15 Dec 2013, 12:13 am »
Thanks for the update on the Oppo players.  At some point I will be getting one for a spare room and was looking forward to something better for navigation for DSD and other files.

ebag4

Re: Oppo DSD
« Reply #30 on: 15 Dec 2013, 01:05 am »
Something new to report on Oppo DSD playback.  Oppo just released their media remote app for ipod/iphone and android phones/tablets.  The ipad version has been out for a while, but not having one, I wasn't able to try the media app... until now.

While file navigation still doesn't compete with tightly integrated programs & apps like Jriver/Jremote, the app makes it much easier to search, select and play storage-attached files on the Oppo.  This is a nice step forward for those of us who want to use the Oppo to play native DSD (especially multi-channel) music files. 

It also makes it easier to set up and control a simple music server without messing with a computer or USB DAC.  Attach a USB drive with music files to a current Oppo player.  Set up the player and media app on a home network and start listening to your music files with tablet/phone playback control.

If you have a Oppo BDP-103 or BDP-105, it's worth checking out.  It does require the latest firmware update to work.

Russ

+1

BTW, I have not done the update to the latest firmware on my 103 but it still works, what file is playing doesn't read correctly but all of the browsing, playing and other controls work.  Laid out well.  Nice that I was able to do this on an Android phone.

Best,
Ed

holzohr

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Re: Oppo DSD
« Reply #31 on: 14 Jan 2014, 09:36 am »
Oppo's 105D http://www.oppodigital.com/blu-ray-bdp-105/blu-ray-BDP-105D-Overview.aspx brings an updated USB DAC with support of DSD64 and DSD128.

Quote
By bypassing the low fidelity, poor quality DAC of traditional computer soundcards, the BDP-105D turns any computer into a high performing multi-media source by converting digital audio to analog through the ESS Sabre32 Reference DAC. The BDP-105D supports DSD audio in standard rate (DSD64) or double rate (DSD128 or DSD 2x) via its new USB DAC input. If your computer can play it, the BDP-105D can convert it to analog.

Phil A

Re: Oppo DSD
« Reply #32 on: 14 Jan 2014, 01:24 pm »
Great news - may have to re-think what I want to do.  I was just going to attach a hard drive to a 103 in a spare room but the extra capability of the new 105 is worthy of at least consideration

Russtafarian

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Re: Oppo DSD
« Reply #33 on: 14 Jan 2014, 07:04 pm »
'bout time.  I have a friend that just bought a 105 and will be seriously pissed that he just missed out on DSD DAC capability.  Oh well.

I'll bet orders for the Modwright version will go through the roof!

Russ

Phil A

Re: Oppo DSD
« Reply #34 on: 14 Jan 2014, 07:54 pm »
'bout time.  I have a friend that just bought a 105 and will be seriously pissed that he just missed out on DSD DAC capability.  Oh well.

I'll bet orders for the Modwright version will go through the roof!

Russ

Dan has posted about his DAC and modding a new 105 will be just over 60% of the selling price of his new DAC and you have a player as well.  Should be interesting.

rbbert

Re: Oppo DSD
« Reply #35 on: 14 Jan 2014, 09:15 pm »
'bout time.  I have a friend that just bought a 105 and will be seriously pissed that he just missed out on DSD DAC capability.  Oh well.

I'll bet orders for the Modwright version will go through the roof!

Russ
Supposedly there will be a hardware update available for the 105.  That's from a post by Sam S (an Oppo beta tester) at the SH Forums.

mca

Re: Oppo DSD
« Reply #36 on: 14 Jan 2014, 09:48 pm »
I thought the 105 was already DSD capable?

rbbert

Re: Oppo DSD
« Reply #37 on: 14 Jan 2014, 09:54 pm »
I thought the 105 was already DSD capable?
Not through the USB "B" input, only through the "A" - i.e. flash drive or external hard drive, not the music server input.

mca

Re: Oppo DSD
« Reply #38 on: 14 Jan 2014, 09:58 pm »
Gocha

Bear

Re: Oppo DSD
« Reply #39 on: 14 Jan 2014, 10:06 pm »
Not through the USB "B" input, only through the "A" - i.e. flash drive or external hard drive, not the music server input.

so the 105D supports native multi channel DSD through the USB "B" input...so I could use say Jriver MC to send the Oppo DSD natively to be decoded by the Oppo's DAC's?

If so, :banana piano: :beer: :violin: :drums: :guitar: :bounce: this is Suhweet!