AudioCircle

Industry Circles => Daedalus Audio => Topic started by: vinyl_lady on 17 Jul 2011, 04:53 am

Title: New Daedalus/Bolder Speaker Cables
Post by: vinyl_lady on 17 Jul 2011, 04:53 am
I have upgraded every part of my system beginning in 2005, except the speaker cables. I have a long run, 24 ft, to reach the left speaker (along the side wall & front wall) (all equipment is on the side wall). In 2004, I replaced 1980's Kimber's black & gray with Synergistic Research's Alpha Quad with active shielding. The Synergistic Research have served me well, but had become the weak link in my system. I have been talking to Lou about various options for about 2 years. Lou told me he was working with Wayne at Bolder Cable on a Daedalus cable that would be a perfect match for his speakers. Knowing the quality of Lou's and Wayne's work, I told Lou to let me know when he and Wayne were satiusfied with the new cable.

Finding a 25 ft pair to audition in my home was impossible and I did not want to go through the hassle of moving the source equipment so I could accomodate 8 ft to 10 ft cables just to compare cables. I talked to Lou and we scheduled a time where I could drive over, bring my cables and compare them to the Daedalus cables. That happened on July 2.

Since Lou and I use a ModWright KWA 150 amp and the Gill Audio pre amp, I was confident that his system was more than revealing enough to hear a difference in speaker cables if it was there. I didn't want the Daedalus cables to make a discernable difference, but they did and it was immediately noticeable. The track we used to compare cables was Songbird from Fleetwood Mac's Rumours album (we also used some Paul Simon and Robbie Robertson tracks). Within the first 30 seconds or so I turned to Lou and commented that there was an immediate improvement in clarity and detail with an over all "fuller" musical presentation. The piano notes were more crisp and natural sounding. Christine's vocal was striking. Bass was solid. It was as though another "veil" had been lifted. When we put my Alpha Quad's back in the music sounded "dull" compared to the Daedalus cables. I was definitely hearing more music with greater detail, clarity and fullness with the Daedalus cables compared to my old cables. The improvement was significant enough that I ordered a pair. :thumb:

The Daedalus is an excellent cable and a perfect match for any Daedalus speaker (we listened to the Ulysses and Athena).

Laura

Title: Re: New Daedalus/Bolder Speaker Cables
Post by: dodgealum on 24 Jul 2011, 03:16 pm
I also recently had the chance to audition Lou's speaker cables--once in my own system and twice at a friend's who has a pair of Ulysses. Lou's cables sound a lot like his speakers--resolving yet non-fatiguing, accurate yet organic and musical. We heard excellent tonality, separation among musical lines, spaciousness and detail. Mostly what we heard was extraordinarily beautiful music making which was less evident when we swapped in a variety of different cables that were part of the audition. The Daedalus/Bolder cables just get out of the way and let the music come through in a way that is so compelling. Nice job Lou and thanks for arranging the audition!
Title: Re: New Daedalus/Bolder Speaker Cables
Post by: jazdoc on 1 Aug 2011, 06:01 pm
Just finished my in home audition of the new speaker cables and echo what Laura said.  It simply builds on the Daedalus strengths with more quality/articulation of lower frequencies, more imaging solidity and ease to the musical flow. 

The sound is really addictive, so much so that my spouse was wondering how they could make such a difference.  Don't audition unless your ready to buy  :D
Title: Re: New Daedalus/Bolder Speaker Cables
Post by: Berto on 12 Aug 2011, 12:06 am
Listening as I write, and I think my fellow Daedalus owners are spot on IRT to the improved SQ. The soundstage literally engulfs the listener. That and the immediacy of the Music contribute to a more lifelike concert experience. It pulls off one hell of a balancing act between being so detailed and so easy to listen too. Luv the improved bass weight, reminds me of how my old speaks sounded when i added a sub :o

There greatest quality IMO (as well as my most important objective) is how musical they make Lou's speakers sound.

I guess you can say I like them :thumb:
Title: Re: New Daedalus/Bolder Speaker Cables
Post by: misterclean on 12 Aug 2011, 06:05 pm

Is there a link or a place to go to learn more about these cables, including pricing?

Thanks for the comments. Very interesting reading indeed.
Title: Re: New Daedalus/Bolder Speaker Cables
Post by: Daedalus Audio on 14 Aug 2011, 06:33 pm
Is there a link or a place to go to learn more about these cables, including pricing?

Thanks for the comments. Very interesting reading indeed.
sorry for not having info up. will get a page on the DaedalusAudio site with pics up next week. the pricing changes with the costs of materials since we are trying to keep the margins low on these cables.  right now the cost is $1500 for an 8 ft pair.
thanks,
lou
Title: Re: New Daedalus/Bolder Speaker Cables
Post by: misterclean on 15 Aug 2011, 03:55 pm

Thanks, Lou. I'll keep an eye on the web site and see if an audition might be possible sometime in the fall.

Keep up the good work!
Title: Re: New Daedalus/Bolder Speaker Cables
Post by: Wayne1 on 18 Aug 2011, 10:30 pm

(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=50152)

Here is a quick snap of the Daedalus/BOLDER speaker cable.

Not much to look at, but it's what it sounds like in your system that matters.  :wink:
Title: Re: New Daedalus/Bolder Speaker Cables
Post by: Berto on 19 Aug 2011, 12:48 am
Congrats on these Wayne and Lou, really takes the rig to notha level. Just gave them up for a few days and the difference is astonishing. I thought my system sounded really good already, but now I know what it can really do. :thumb:
Title: Re: New Daedalus/Bolder Speaker Cables
Post by: Wayne1 on 19 Aug 2011, 02:44 pm
Thank you, Berto.

If any of you are coming to RMAF, The Daedalus SE cables will be used in room 1030. I also believe they will be used with a pair of Athena speakers used by another vendor.

Title: Re: New Daedalus/Bolder Speaker Cables
Post by: Daedalus Audio on 19 Aug 2011, 04:23 pm
thank you all!  it looks like Dan  will be using them in the Modwright room 1010 with a pair of Athena.
 these are very neutral cables and work well with my speakers... they should since they are based on the internal wiring system that I have developed with Wayne. that said I don't know how they would be with other systems that may lean to bright or warm.

thanks again for the positive feedback!

lou

Title: Re: New Daedalus/Bolder Speaker Cables
Post by: jtwrace on 19 Aug 2011, 07:17 pm
these are very neutral cables and work well with my speakers... they should since they are based on the internal wiring system that I have developed with Wayne.
lou

You no longer us DH an listed here?  http://silversonic.com/docs/partners.html
Title: Re: New Daedalus/Bolder Speaker Cables
Post by: Daedalus Audio on 19 Aug 2011, 07:26 pm
You no longer us DH an listed here?  http://silversonic.com/docs/partners.html
we use the DH Labs wire for our pro cabinets but have not used DH wire in our home audio speakers for several years.

thanks,
lou

Title: Re: New Daedalus/Bolder Speaker Cables
Post by: jriggy on 22 Aug 2011, 09:29 pm
And thanks to Birto I am hearing this astonishing difference! Im sure the entirety of it will hit me once I remove them tonight to send back to him... Thank you SO MUCH Birto and Lou for arranging this at such a short notice.
 
Apart from what has been said here -- the control and order they put to the entire soundstage is impressive.

Title: Re: New Daedalus/Bolder Speaker Cables
Post by: jazdoc on 23 Aug 2011, 04:55 am
Well I received my new Daedalus cables today and right out of the box they are a home run.  I'm sure things will only improve with break-in.  Well worth the cost.  Indeed, I would consider these an integral part of the Daedalus speaker system.  Highly recommended.  Kudos to Lou and Wayne!
Title: Re: New Daedalus/Bolder Speaker Cables
Post by: vinyl_lady on 2 Sep 2011, 03:55 am
Mark, Mark and Berto,

Thanks for posting your impressions/review of the Daedalus/Bolder cables after your in home auditions. Since you got to spend some time listening with the cables in your systems, I am obviously pleased that your impressions are similar to mine and all of ours to each other. It seems like all of us heard similiar improvements in overall SQ where the music just naturally flows through the speakers. Paul McGowan (PS Audio) writes a blog and the other day he wrote about wire
Quote
Cables do make a difference in your system but they cannot add anything tonally. To add something to an audio signal we need to inject more than we started with.  With a passive (no added energy available) device like a cable there is simply no mechanism for adding anything not already present.  Think of this like the proverbial water hose.  The hose can only deliver what is fed into it and has no capability to add more.  In fact, all it can do is restrict the flow of what’s coming through – and that is the entire point.

Compared to my Synergistic Research cables the Daedalus/BOLDER Cables are like a fire hose compared to a garden hose--so much more music or as Berto said: how musical they sound. If this analogy sounds familiar it is because it is they way Lou described the effect of the all-poly cap crossover upgrade:
Quote
I think that this premise of simply "opening the flow" is the basic design criterion for the best audio builders. We are not trying to add anything to the recording just allowing it to come through.

Thanks for giving me an idea of what I am going to hear when I receive my new cables.

Laura
Title: Re: New Daedalus/Bolder Speaker Cables
Post by: celticsfan1 on 6 Sep 2011, 12:50 pm
Hi I am the first DA-RMa owner in Australia!!
Within 2 minutes of hearing these cables my mind was made up, absolute no brainer....

In fact I heard the Daedalus Bolder cables on my friend's high end system where he just purchased cables that have a MSRP of $10,000 for a 2-meter length. The Daedalus Bolder cables in my view would easily be at the level of his cables....

Title: Re: New Daedalus/Bolder Speaker Cables
Post by: vinyl_lady on 1 Oct 2011, 03:40 am
Received my Daedalus/Bolder speaker cables this week. Installed them into the system this afternoon after listening to my old cables first. WOW! the music seemed to open up and there was a fuller presentation from top to bottom with incredible clarity and detail. Tighter lower end too. I've been listening to the 45 RPM Rumours and just amazed at what I am hearing. Also listening to Alan Parsons, Libby Titus, Carly Simon, the new Wilco and now Mark Knopfler & Emmylou Harris. There is a more "they're playing live in front of me" sensation. Great imaging and focus--very natural sounding too. I am really enjoying my system more than ever tonight.

As Mark said above,
Quote
right out of the box they are a home run.
Wire does make a difference. :thumb: IMO, they are a must for anyone with Daedalus speakers--great synergy. Congratulations Lou & Wayne, and thanks for designing and making these great speaker cables.

Laura
Title: Re: New Daedalus/Bolder Speaker Cables
Post by: jriggy on 1 Oct 2011, 02:24 pm
Congrats on receiving your cables and your new enjoyment Laura! Hopefully mine are right around the corner.
When I borrowed Birto's pair for a weekend, it took them a day and a half to settle in to my system, but as you said, the improved imaging and focus was incredible... Looking forward to discovering all their benefits!

Enjoy!
Title: Re: New Daedalus/Bolder Speaker Cables
Post by: Big Red Machine on 1 Oct 2011, 02:42 pm
They look solid core like the ones I make.  Stranded or solid?
Title: Re: New Daedalus/Bolder Speaker Cables
Post by: Wayne1 on 3 Oct 2011, 09:29 pm
Thank you for your comments, Laura.

I have been backed up with building the cables that will be used at RMAF. I hope to get caught up a bit more after the show.

The speaker cables are actually made of 10 separate wires. Some are stranded and some are solid. There are different gauges and different materials involved. The geometry is on the complex side. The final bundle of wires is dampened the entire length to reduce mechanical noise which could take away from the image. Woven carbon fiber is used to reduce RFI/EMI pick up. All of this is done by hand.

I hope that people coming the RMAF will stop by the three rooms using the Daedalus/BOLDER speaker cables to listen to what they might be able to do for your system.
Title: Re: New Daedalus/Bolder Speaker Cables
Post by: mmcentyre on 25 Feb 2014, 04:45 am
Resurrecting this thread.  For those of you using the Daedalus wire, are you still happy with it?  Thought about auditioning Grover Huffman and Clear Wire too, but wondering if it's worth the time if the Daedalus wire is the perfect match.  I trust Lou, and he thinks it is.  The other two are significantly less expensive and I am somewhat budget conscious. Thanks.
Title: Re: New Daedalus/Bolder Speaker Cables
Post by: Daedalus Audio on 25 Feb 2014, 05:09 am
just an FYI, the cables are now made for me by WYWires. They do a great job and we are always working to refine them to be a perfect match for the Daedalus speakers.

I am always interested in other options, especially when they can be done at a lower cost and welcome any information.

thanks,

lou
Title: Re: New Daedalus/Bolder Speaker Cables
Post by: rawhit on 27 Feb 2014, 12:46 pm
Hi Lou,
    are there any differences in the speaker cable version made by WYWires vs the earlier one made by Bolder cables?
Thanks
Title: Re: New Daedalus/Bolder Speaker Cables
Post by: jonbee on 27 Feb 2014, 03:06 pm
I am always interested in other options, especially when they can be done at a lower cost and welcome any information.
I've traded cabling around a lot in the year or so since I've got my RMAs (3 or 4 different sets of SCs and ICs), and am very satisfied with the sound I'm getting now.
I've switched to Dave's Cables speaker cables since getting my DA-RMA V2 back, and they are truly wonderful sounding- dynamic, clear and smooth, with a superb soundstage and imaging. Haven't compared them to the Daedalus cables, but they are easily the best I've had and a great bargain at $500/8ft.  I'm using Dave's D3 ICs in the system, too.
Dave is a newcomer to the business side, but makes fabulous products, IMO:
http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=118081.0 (http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=118081.0)
Title: Re: New Daedalus/Bolder Speaker Cables
Post by: mmcentyre on 28 Feb 2014, 03:00 am
Jonbee, thanks for the tip.  I had read about Dave's cables.  I need to do less reading and more auditioning.  If I get on the cable tour, I'll let people know how they sound with the Pans.  Thanks.
Title: Re: New Daedalus/Bolder Speaker Cables
Post by: vinyl_lady on 28 Feb 2014, 03:36 am
I started this thread 2.5 years ago and the Daedalus/bolder speaker cables are still in my system. I believe they are a perfect match and I wouldn't think of changing them.

Last summer Lou exhibited at CAF, and changing out the WyWires speaker cables for the Daedalus speaker cables made by WyWires took the system to another level. It makes a difference to have speaker cables designed and built to work with Daedalus speakers. Ask Lou or Woodsyi about the experience.

Laura
Title: Re: New Daedalus/Bolder Speaker Cables
Post by: Daedalus Audio on 3 Mar 2014, 12:48 am
Hi Lou,
    are there any differences in the speaker cable version made by WYWires vs the earlier one made by Bolder cables?
Thanks
We have made a few refinements resulting in slightly more open top end etc.  I'm very pleased with the build quality!

These are a great cable and mate extremely well with the Daedalus systems, unfortunately they are expensive to build.

I would love to find an alternative which I could recommend that gets close but for substantially less money ....

btw looking at Dave's site it would appear you would use the 11 ga which I think is more like $800?  I'm tnterested in hearing what people think.

thanks,
lou

Title: Re: New Daedalus/Bolder Speaker Cables
Post by: MegaHz on 3 Mar 2014, 02:11 am
Dave's Speaker cable uses high end Neotech Ohno Continuous Cast Copper in a Litz braid with a cotton insulation. For the high efficiency Daedalus speakers I would think 14 gauge wire would be plenty for most all and those who use low power SETs might consider the 20g wire.  He does offer an 11gauge wire but that seems geared to 200watt plus systems.

Some comments listening to the 14g Dave speaker cable on the Daedalus Ulysses powered by tubes.  What strikes immediately on hearing this wire is its squeaky clean, neutral presentation with an impressively extended and detailed top end not typical of wire in this price class.  The Daedalus tweeters really shine here. 

Now if your are looking to soften up an overly aggressive high end or butter up the midrange some, there are better choices.  But if you are aiming your system for precision, inner detail with a purity of tone and full extension, these should definitely make your demo list.         
Title: Re: New Daedalus/Bolder Speaker Cables
Post by: Daedalus Audio on 3 Mar 2014, 02:34 am
Dave's Speaker cable uses high end Neotech Ohno Continuous Cast Copper in a Litz braid with a cotton insulation. For the high efficiency Daedalus speakers I would think 14 gauge wire would be plenty for most all and those who use low power SETs might consider the 20g wire.  He does offer an 11gauge wire but that seems geared to 200watt plus systems.

Some comments listening to the 14g Dave speaker cable on the Daedalus Ulysses powered by tubes.  What strikes immediately on hearing this wire is its squeaky clean, neutral presentation with an impressively extended and detailed top end not typical of wire in this price class.  The Daedalus tweeters really shine here. 

Now if your are looking to soften up an overly aggressive high end or butter up the midrange some, there are better choices.  But if you are aiming your system for precision, inner detail with a purity of tone and full extension, these should definitely make your demo list.       
sounds like the Q audio or Wywires (Blue series), definitely good stuff.  it would be very interesting to have someone who has the Daedalus cables do an audition of these??? 
Title: Re: New Daedalus/Bolder Speaker Cables
Post by: misterclean on 27 Jan 2017, 04:18 pm

For anyone interested in acquiring some excellent speaker cables for your Daedalus speakers, I have an 8-ft pair of Daedalus/Bolder cables for sale for $500.

As indicated in this thread, they are a superb complement to Lou's amazing speakers.
Title: Re: New Daedalus/Bolder Speaker Cables
Post by: genjamon on 6 Mar 2017, 07:24 pm
For anyone interested in acquiring some excellent speaker cables for your Daedalus speakers, I have an 8-ft pair of Daedalus/Bolder cables for sale for $500.

As indicated in this thread, they are a superb complement to Lou's amazing speakers.

I had an itch I had to scratch and decided to plunk down for Misterclean's cables for use with my DAR-Ma V2's.  I had called Lou to chat about them before purchasing, and had a great conversation as always.  They definitely are very well balanced cables - better overall frequency balance than my current cables paired with the DAR-Ma V2's, and I'm very curious what the current production version made by Wywires sounds like.  Lou says similar overall character, but even better detail/resolution/refinement. 

Well, I've posted these Daedalus/Bolder cables for sale to hopefully generate some funds for an upgrade.  See here if interested: http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=148396.new#new