6SN7 tubes from Russia - how bad are they?

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Frihed91

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Re: 6SN7 tubes from Russia - how bad are they?
« Reply #20 on: 17 May 2010, 08:05 am »
This is the best Russian tube IMHO. But it does cost around $100.. But well worth it. Great soundstage, pressences and body!!




These tubes are not true 1578s.  The plate structure is all wrong.  The true 1578 is a good tube, comparable to many of the very good sSN7GTs, but it can be microphonic, so watch it, especially if you are buying from the Ukrane.  As a driver tube, or as an input tube in some circuits in power amps, microphonics is not really a problem unless you are given to tapping the top of the tube while you play the music.

Are non-EH Russian (and non true 1578s) 6SN7s  any good?  If you are using the tube just for gain in some circuits, the sonics won't matter.  But you have to know the circuit to be sure.  These tubes don't sound very good as input tubes in some circuits where their sonics do matter.  It's really hard to generalize when you can actually hear a tube and when you are just hearing (or not) its electrical properties---which is also a bit of a muddled statement.  By a couple and find out how it works in your amp.

But don't pay $200 + for a pair of non true 1578.

DARTH AUDIO

Re: 6SN7 tubes from Russia - how bad are they?
« Reply #21 on: 17 May 2010, 11:16 am »
These tubes are not true 1578s.  The plate structure is all wrong.  The true 1578 is a good tube, comparable to many of the very good sSN7GTs, but it can be microphonic, so watch it, especially if you are buying from the Ukrane.  As a driver tube, or as an input tube in some circuits in power amps, microphonics is not really a problem unless you are given to tapping the top of the tube while you play the music.

Are non-EH Russian (and non true 1578s) 6SN7s  any good?  If you are using the tube just for gain in some circuits, the sonics won't matter.  But you have to know the circuit to be sure.  These tubes don't sound very good as input tubes in some circuits where their sonics do matter.  It's really hard to generalize when you can actually hear a tube and when you are just hearing (or not) its electrical properties---which is also a bit of a muddled statement.  By a couple and find out how it works in your amp.

But don't pay $200 + for a pair of non true 1578.
You sound very informed, but these tubes sound fantastic in my preamp. No problems what so ever! I also bought them from two well known tube stores.

KingStyles

Re: 6SN7 tubes from Russia - how bad are they?
« Reply #22 on: 27 May 2010, 01:37 am »
Here is a picture of the true 1578.


nature boy

Re: 6SN7 tubes from Russia - how bad are they?
« Reply #23 on: 27 May 2010, 01:56 am »
Paul,

You are truly the AC Good Humor Man.  Missed you at Rutt's Hut earlier this month, guess you had a hot date.  The dogs, onion rings and birch beers were as my daughter says "totally awesome man".

Cheers,

NB

Apparently, the only thing absolute around here is that certainty that you know it all, whether it be tube quality, any and all signal or power cables, solid state amps, whatever.... I admire your certainty, though I really think it ill founded.

I use New Sensor tubes and am quite pleased with them. Their EH 6922 are excellent and pretty much bullet proof, as are their 12ax7lps. Their Mullard and Tung-Sol 'tribute' tubes and are lovely. But I can't speak specifically to their 6SN7s.

I believe both of our families came from Russia, mine a couple of generations prior. Hopefully, your children will loose that reflexive hostility.

FWIW,
Paul

cafyon

Re: 6SN7 tubes from Russia - how bad are they?
« Reply #24 on: 16 Feb 2016, 07:53 am »
Many thanks for your input.
My experience of Russian tubes so far are minimal. I had 6N1P and 60's 6SN7. I tried 6N1P to replace 6N1 (Chinese made), but it did not work out well, not because 6N1P was bad, but because they are not direct exchangeable.
60's 6SN7 was pretty good. It sound better than Sylvania GTA/GTB in my Rogue 99 preamp. However, they had some microphonic noise after a while.

I just ordered NOS 8x6SN7 (80's production from Novosibirsk factory) and 8x6C33C-B from Russia. I only paid $155 with shipping, and I will see how good they are in about 3 weeks.  BAT sells 6C33C-B at $125 each, so even if only half of them work reliably, I should be still OK.
I have a bunch of Sylvania GTA/GTB tubes, and will see how crappy those Russian tubes are, if they work at all.  :)

Sorry for bringing up this old topic. dinaudia's comment attracted my attention.

I'm looking for 6n1 tubes. As I understand from dinaudio's experience, although 6n1 and 6n1p are similar, they are not identical nor direct replacements.

I opened a topic on this question. The replies in this topic didn't exactly answered my "6n1 ?= 6n1p" question.
Finally I'm able to get both 6n1 and 6n1p tubes. I need to hear some more experience on whether 6n1p can be safely used in place of 6n1 .

 :wave:

tiversen

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Re: 6SN7 tubes from Russia - how bad are they?
« Reply #25 on: 6 Mar 2016, 09:13 am »
Hi,

The Chinese 6N1 is a direct copy of the russian 6N1P, so you should be able to replace the Chinese with the russian directly. If you are buying Russian 6N1P I reccomend 6N1P-EV. IMO 6N1P-EV produced at the Voskhod factory ( with the rocket logo) before 1984 is the best of these.

7x57

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Re: 6SN7 tubes from Russia - how bad are they?
« Reply #26 on: 25 Dec 2016, 08:08 pm »
I once order four NOS RCA 6C4 tubes from Angela Instruments, and all 4 were too microphonic to use in my preamp. I ordered a pair of NOS GE 12AY7A tubes at $25 each, and one of them failed within 100 hours. Some tubes are just junk for audio, no matter where they are made.

I have gotten good and bad tubes out of Russia and Eastern Europe. I would suggest staying with the best known examples and ordering twice as many tubes as you actually need from a reputable dealer and testing them yourself in your own gear. Tubes that do not work out well often end up on eBay. NOS American and European that really work are very rare and usually cost more than they are worth.

The dealers that mainly sell to guitar amp users is where I buy any tubes these days, as they have the best prices and the higher volume of sales relative to High End Audio. I ordered 8 tubes from Watford Valves in England, sent them to Andy Bowman of Vintage Tube Services for pin descaling, testing and grading, and they more than met the standards for my intended use. Cost from Watford, delivered, was $14 per tube for genuine Mullard NOS M8080 which is a military grade 6C4, and a few more bucks for Andy's service. About $20 per tube, I would say. The tubes are rated for 10,000 hours under military conditions in field radios that take a beating, per the official Mullard specs.

firedog

Re: 6SN7 tubes from Russia - how bad are they?
« Reply #27 on: 14 Jan 2017, 09:23 am »
Lots of people like the modern Tung Sol 6SN7, even more than the EH.

Graywulf

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Re: 6SN7 tubes from Russia - how bad are they?
« Reply #28 on: 14 Jan 2017, 10:13 am »
I've been lucky enough to have gained a good selection of NOS and good used 'old tubes' of most of the common audio signal tubes. I've avoided what are often seen as the 'supreme' valves of each type, the expense to me isnt justifiable. I work on a 80% of the improvement for 50% of the cost.. which seems to be a pretty reasonable calculation.  I have Mullard tubes in all my input/signal tubes as my go to for a listening session.. but often find I mix as the Mullards can end up a little too 'sweet' in my amps.
 I purchased a MingDa MC34AB in 2007 and still have this amp today {prior to were home made Williamson stereo amp, Leak TL12+, Leak Stereo 60. Radford STA100} It came with EH 6SN7 and ECC81 input valves,, it was horribly bright to my ears.
  I would rate them as one of the most 'brittle' sounding 6SN7's I have.... I'd agree that the Shuguang {cheap brown base} outperform them noticeably. I've got Brimar/GEC/National/Westinghouse/Kenrad/RCA/Sylvania/and some rebranded which are of UK manufacture as my 'everyday' tubes.
   I've also got some of the Russian military tubes at a good price at the time... they are 'right up there' with the average 'old' tubes... in facr pretty close to my Brimar's.
   Of course I am not comparing them to the 'elite' tubes... but if you can get military Russian? They are a good buy.

 My 'main' Amps dont use 6SN7, so I can only base my finding on my MingDa and speakers....

FullRangeMan

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Re: 6SN7 tubes from Russia - how bad are they?
« Reply #29 on: 14 Jan 2017, 10:18 am »
Sorry for bringing up this old topic. dinaudia's comment attracted my attention.

I'm looking for 6n1 tubes. As I understand from dinaudio's experience, although 6n1 and 6n1p are similar, they are not identical nor direct replacements.

I opened a topic on this question. The replies in this topic didn't exactly answered my "6n1 ?= 6n1p" question.
Finally I'm able to get both 6n1 and 6n1p tubes. I need to hear some more experience on whether 6n1p can be safely used in place of 6n1 .

 :wave:
6N1P are the most prolific tube in equivalents & substitutes:
6n1,6N2P,6922,6DJ8,7DJ8,7308,ECC88,E88CC,6H23,E288CC,8223,GA7,6H30,CV5358.

danabunner

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Re: 6SN7 tubes from Russia - how bad are they?
« Reply #30 on: 27 Feb 2017, 02:16 pm »
Lots of people like the modern Tung Sol 6SN7, even more than the EH.

I tried these, hoping to find an in-production source of good 6SN7s, but in my amp they compressed and flattened the soundstage.  I have a number of 50s and 60s Westinghouse, Sylvania, Ken-Rad, etc., which sound better to my ears.  I put just 40 hours on the Tung-sols before tossing them back into my bin, perhaps they would improve with more hours on them. 

DaveC113

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Re: 6SN7 tubes from Russia - how bad are they?
« Reply #31 on: 27 Feb 2017, 03:46 pm »
I see no reason to purchase new production 6SN7 when there are so many good NOS for so cheap. Even the old Russian plastic base tubes are good... the metal base tubes are even better and come in may varieties... the black, non-hole-plate metal base are the best value with some liking them better than the $$$ 1578s with holes. 5692 version is the quietest I have tried... reinforced US military tube.


thunderbrick

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Re: 6SN7 tubes from Russia - how bad are they?
« Reply #32 on: 27 Feb 2017, 04:00 pm »
I see many of 6SN7 tubes from Russia sold at less than $5 each. How good/bad are they?


Where do you find them for less than $5?    I'd be suspect of ANY new tube selling that cheap, and I'd be very reluctant to put them in my gear.

Think about it....for the seller to make a profit he'd have to buy them for about a buck or less.  That's nuts!

doggie

Re: 6SN7 tubes from Russia - how bad are they?
« Reply #33 on: 14 Mar 2017, 08:18 pm »
Can anyone recommend a reliable source for a pair of the legendary Hole Plate Metal Base MELZ Russia 1578 6SN7 6H8C tubes?

Seems like they are pretty scarce with imposters being sold.

sabocat

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Re: 6SN7 tubes from Russia - how bad are they?
« Reply #34 on: 14 Mar 2017, 11:48 pm »
I like the Electroharmonix 6SN7 just fine.  I understand the EH gold version just comes with gold-plated tube pins. 

These are builty very robustly and sound quite straight-forward, and depending on where, I have at times preferred them to the likes of KenRad black glass or Sylvania "Bad Boys."



I agree 100%. They sound just as good if not better than Sylvania 6SN7 GTB's in my microzotl2.

FullRangeMan

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Re: 6SN7 tubes from Russia - how bad are they?
« Reply #35 on: 15 Mar 2017, 01:10 am »
Can anyone recommend a reliable source for a pair of the legendary Hole Plate Metal Base MELZ Russia 1578 6SN7 6H8C tubes?

Seems like they are pretty scarce with imposters being sold.
Look no further, MELZ perforated anode at 69usd from a friendly and reliable seller:
http://www.gstube.com/catalog/?key=6h8c&submit=Find
The best 6SN7 from Russia, ask a robust package.