New Products - Thumbs Up or Thumbs Down?

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic. Read 11146 times.

modwright

Re: New Products - Thumbs Up or Thumbs Down?
« Reply #60 on: 12 Apr 2018, 12:55 am »
Thanks, I appreciate that!

The finish is clean and elegant.  The graphics are laser-engraved, not silkscreened.

The question is, one box or two?

Take care,

Dan

GregC

Re: New Products - Thumbs Up or Thumbs Down?
« Reply #61 on: 12 Apr 2018, 01:08 am »
I prefer two boxes, especially if I want to place my MC step up next to the phono stage and place the power supply on a lower shelf in my rack.  If I use the internal step up transformers then the one box would probably be more convenient. 

With two boxes and the power supply far enough away I suspect the two boxes would have a quieter noise floor.

JohnCh

  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 11
Re: New Products - Thumbs Up or Thumbs Down?
« Reply #62 on: 12 Apr 2018, 01:14 am »
Based on your final topology, can the two boxes be placed close together as in the photo, or do they require significant space between them?  Is there a price difference between the two options?  All things being equal, I prefer two boxes as it provides maximum flexibility when tracking down a hum problem.

modwright

Re: New Products - Thumbs Up or Thumbs Down?
« Reply #63 on: 12 Apr 2018, 01:30 am »
If used side by side as per this design, it is noisy.  It is ideal that the two boxes be about 12" apart or at least on separate rack shelves.  It really has to do with proximity and orientation of the power transformer to the inputs and step-ups.

Cost-wise, there is really not that much difference.  The cost of two boxes and umbilical, umbilical connectors, two face plates, etc., has cost too.  The one box design would have a bit more sophisticated aesthetics probably, because i would want it to match the SWL 9.0 Ann Ed in the same family, and this costs money too.

The other way to go, to keep it a two box design and also keep the form factor of the phono stage 1/2 width as it is:  Make the external supply a 'brick' type small enclosure, that contained the power transformer and power choke only. It could then be tucked away anywhere, away from the phono box. It would not be a 'display' piece, and would not have an AL face plate. It would likely be a black steel, powder-coated box with no switches.  Just a power IEC input and umbilical out.

The phono stage could then be very similar in size to what is shown in the photo.  In fact, if that were done, the total enclosure cost would be a bit less and this could either drive the cost down a bit, or allow for better quality parts in the phono stage itself.

I see two things here from the feedback.  Outboard supplies are desirable because they keep things quiet! They are inconvenient if they take up another shelf space.  However, if the umbilical were say 6ft. long and the supply could be on the floor and off the rack, then it may be more attractive.

If that were the case, would it also be attractive for the phono enclosure to be 1/2 size, in case you want to put it beside your TT on a wide shelf, use the MM input with exotic high end Step Up transformers, etc.

All things being equal, is it more appealing for the phono stage to be full width, or more compact?

Thanks,

Dan

GregC

Re: New Products - Thumbs Up or Thumbs Down?
« Reply #64 on: 12 Apr 2018, 02:14 am »
I do not care about the aesthetics of the power supply enclosure compared to the quality of the components, so cost saving or using the money saved on the enclosure towards better quality components is where I would place priority.  I would like 6 ft umbilical so can place the power supply low on my rack.  Also if there is a possibility of an upgraded umbilical that can improve the sound that would be a nice option.

modwright

Re: New Products - Thumbs Up or Thumbs Down?
« Reply #65 on: 12 Apr 2018, 02:49 am »
If we go this route with external supply, the umbilical will be an off-the-shelf 4-pin or 5-pin XLR type. We will of course also offer upgraded umbilicals, but I wanted to be clear what the stock cable would be.

Thanks,

Dan

PicknPop

  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 9
Re: New Products - Thumbs Up or Thumbs Down?
« Reply #66 on: 12 Apr 2018, 03:03 pm »
"The phono stage could then be very similar in size to what is shown in the photo.  In fact, if that were done, the total enclosure cost would be a bit less and this could either drive the cost down a bit, or allow for better quality parts in the phono stage itself."

I like the idea of using the cost saving for better quality parts in the phono stage itself.

JohnCh

  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 11
Re: New Products - Thumbs Up or Thumbs Down?
« Reply #67 on: 12 Apr 2018, 03:11 pm »
I'd prefer the PS to be a non descript, black brick that I can place on the floor behind/next to the rack, and either lower the price, or use better components in the phono stage.  Take a look at the power supply for the Lehman Black Cube SE II for inspiration.  BTW although this seems to be the consensus among the people replying to this thread, I have no idea how the typical buyer in this price range feels about 1 box vs. 2, and hidden PS vs. housed in a display quality enclosure.  Are any competitors in this price range using 2 boxes and if so, how are they treating the PS?

modwright

Re: New Products - Thumbs Up or Thumbs Down?
« Reply #68 on: 15 Apr 2018, 06:12 am »
I have decided that it will be a two box and I believe that the 'black box' approach to an external supply makes the most sense in order to keep costs/price down.  The savings will be applied to better parts in the phono or a lower retail price.

To be clear, when I say 'black box' supply, I am not talking about a wall wart. Rather, a steel box that includes the transformer, choke and basic DC rectification circuitry.  The enclosure will be powder coated steel and not finished as a display piece.

The umbilical will be a stock off-the-shelf 4-5 pin XLR cable.

We may offer upgrade paths as follows:
Upgraded external supply with tube rectification or more sophisticated design.
Upgraded custom umbilical.
XLR transformer coupled output for fully balanced operation.


The goal will be to make the base unit the very best that it can be and represent the highest value and performance possible. For those that want to pay more for the upgrades, they will be available at time of purchase or as future upgrade path.

Thank you very much for the feedback!

Dan

dminches

Re: New Products - Thumbs Up or Thumbs Down?
« Reply #69 on: 15 Apr 2018, 01:52 pm »
Dan, I think the 2 box solution is best.  It solves your noise issue and gives people flexibility if they have size issues for the phono pre placement.

nature boy

Re: New Products - Thumbs Up or Thumbs Down?
« Reply #70 on: 15 Apr 2018, 02:06 pm »
Dan,

I really like your approach.  Best parts for the phono preamp and a simple power supply box.  Upgrade options also make sense to me.  Hope you have a productive time  Axpona.

NB

modwright

Re: New Products - Thumbs Up or Thumbs Down?
« Reply #71 on: 15 Apr 2018, 03:25 pm »
Thank you! It is the approach I have always taken with our products.

Dan