[Woodsman]

I just sold my Klipsch RF 7 speakers. They were very dynamic and could really shine with rock music. The problem with them as I have aged, they became very fatiguing in a short period of time. So I have narrowed it down to 3 Salk speakers that are in my price range. The Song Tower Supercharged, Veracity HT2-TL, and the Silk Towers.

My absolute favorite genre is progressive rock. The likes of Rush, Ayreon, ELP, Pink Floyd etc. Then my favorite guitarist Steve Vai, so screaming guitar is needed in most of my music. While I don't listen at ear piercing volumes, I do like to jam it from time to time. I do need that bass slam too.

So given the 3 choices that I have given, please provide your suggestion. Oh yes, room size. It is in a larger area of the basement, pool table, exercise area, etc, roughly 25 by 25.

Thank you

[Big Red Machine]

Supercharged would be my choice. Tighter bass and meets all your midrange and above as all Salk's do.

[charmerci]

Given that many prog rock recordings are very processed with less than ideal sound, unless you have super electronics (read very expensive) and have tamed your room, I'd actually avoid the RAAL tweeters. They are very unforgiving. I listen mainly to 50's, 60's and 70's rock - including ELP - and it's hard to crank them up on RAAL tweeters. (I have AVA and Odyssey Audio upstream.)

[greg92]

Try these. The Heil is very dynamic:

[jsalk]

Take a good look at the Song3's as well.  They have very solid bass and are more forgiving on less-than-ideal recordings.

- Jim

[Woodsman]

Thanks Jim,

I did initially have it on the list, just thought the turbo charged might fit the bill a little better. So yes, that is highly considered in the choices.

Jim, you just have too many great choices, that is what makes the decision very hard. Have to get it right the 1st time.

[Woodsman]

Thanks Jim,

I did initially have it on the list, just thought the turbo charged might fit the bill a little better. So yes, that is highly considered in the choices.

Jim, you just have too many great choices, that is what makes the decision very hard. Have to get it right the 1st time.

[Folsom]

I don't really think any of them are a problem. I'd be more worried about fatigue from electronics than hearing some of the less than ideal recording information from a detailed tweeter. I find RAAL's are only hard on the ears if the electronics are, as I've heard numerous speakers where they sound almost soft, too.

I'd want at least two mid-bass drivers for rock, or something with a mid and woofers. But honestly several of his monitors wouldn't leave you high and dry for rock anyways.

[undertow]

Woodsman,

Honestly your biggest issue was owning the RF7's... I think they are the worst balanced speakers Klipsch ever made!

Super high fatigue, and they produced nothing in the way of serious bass even with the dual 10" drivers in them unless you drove them with a ton of current, because they dropped well below 2 ohms. That 1" titanium "Tractrix" is nothing like the far better wide mouth "Squawker horns". But people seem to love them still... And the crossovers were horrible.

Only reason I mention this is the type of music you are describing, and the fact you had 100 db plus horns so trading them out for more traditional dynamic drive models with 88 to 92 db sensitivity, they will fall off a cliff on the volume control your use to especially in a room that large.

You may need to either add gain to your system, or bigger power amps in a room that size with using something like a Salk, its just an acoustic / electrical fact, so I would suggest trying a few things first before making this move only because the sensitivity to power ratio will be more than noticeable in this case.

Generally a 10 db difference is DOUBLE the perceived volume, so if you cranked the Klipsch at 12 o'clock, you might max out your volume with a 89 db speaker to get the same acoustic output.

Not saying that the RF7 is superior in any sense to a Salk, but they are WAY more efficient by miles. Believe me I have done side by sides with 100 db vs. 90 db speakers you just won't get the dynamics out of the same system normally without extra changes. This is more than a matter of swapping speakers especially in a 25 ft x 25 ft room. 

On a side note in a room like that trying to do what you are, and coming from an RF7 consider doing an easy load speaker on the mains, even cutting off before 50 hz, and drop in Dual Subs going Active on your bass... [Stereo Subs]... I believe there might be a couple Salk Combos to meet this configuration as well.

[Woodsman]

Thanks for all the info so far guys, I do appreciate all of it.

Undertow, I have several high current amps. The latest one I was using with the RF 7's is  W4S STI 1000. I am pretty sure that amp can run pretty much any speaker with authority. Still you are correct with the RF 7's, even with all that power, the bass out of 2 10's was crap. No worries, I am done with Klipsch and other mainstream speakers. I have some Salk Silk monitors being built, now just need to decide on some towers for that other system. I know one thing for sure, they will be made by Salk Sound.

[putz]

I'm a vinyl rocker and a Salk owner.

I had the Songtowers with the Hiquophon tweeter for a couple of years and they were great speakers except in the bass department. I then picked up some older used HT3s. Great hard hitting bass. I had to retire my subwoofer and add bass traps to tame the low end. I like to crank the volume and, no matter how loud I play them, there's never any fatigue. You do need mucho power for them to shine.

[DEP14]

I am right there with you as far as Rock goes.  Rush is one of my favorite bands, and I am a huge Steve Vai fan also.  I pretty much listen to Rock, Hard Rock, Some really hard Rock, a bit of Yacht Rock, Blues Rock and you guessed it, a touch of Reggae.

So here is the thing with Rock.  There are a lot of bad recordings, and even worse digital remasters out there.  Most of us love guitars and dynamics (therefore many of us have owned Klipsch, lord knows I have owned a few pairs from KG4's in the 80's through Palladiums in 2012/13.).

There IS a reason for that.  People who like Rock typically like forward midrange, a BIG sound, and some level of impact.  Klipsch does that, and at lower volumes actually does it pretty well.  I am not saying they are the be-all, end all, but they do do some things well (as do most horn speakers).   With vinyl recordings, a tube amp, and some big klipsch, you can have some fun (to this day).

That said, when they get turned up (as most rockers like to do) they get bright, they get forward, and they get fatiguing.  Then they get sold. (though they can be worth keeping around for a home theater).

I went through this.  My first speakers after my Palladiums were SoundScape 8's.  I dug them, I compared them to BRM's Exotica's and for Rock preferred them.  The SS8's are dynamic, very accurate, and they play low.  They do exactly what Jim designed them to do.  I liked them a lot.  I did find though they revealed everything in recordings and gave you what your source (for me a pre-pro and Sony HAP Z1-ES) music server were feeding them.  This can be good, this can be bad.

They don't have an artificial mid-bass bump, that a lot of people who listen to rock like.  I heard things in recordings (particularly Pink Floyd that was really deep) that I never heard before.  But I also missed some of that "thump" you get in the mid-bass.  With guitars, they excelled but again I will tell you that the accuton mid-range and RAAL are not forgiving (they are not overly bright, but they are revealing).  When turned up at times they could get fatiguing.  It wasn't the speaker - it was the recording.

I likely would not have sold mine if not for a budget crunch, I ended up with some Old NHT 3.3's for a while which had an even more robust low-end, lacked a smidge in the midrange compared to the SS8's and could also get a little bright on top.  When budgets came back around, but not to SS8 levels, I ended up with some JBL S3900's I picked up used that I am currently using and like a lot.  Though, they are not the speaker that the SS8's were by any means.  Horns, but not remotely bright, very different than Klipsch.

I've talked to Jim a few times about building a "rock" speaker.  He has mentioned a midrange (I want to say a Seas Excel Nextel?) that would be a bit more forgiving of bright recordings, and possibly using the Be tweeter up top.  With a little tweak to the crossover/passives for a bit of mid bass oomph.  I suspect eventually I'll get around to it as Jim's builds are second to none and I want to get a new Salk set-up here eventually. 

All of that said, if in your budget Jim is suggesting the Song 3, then I would go with the Song 3.  Particularly if you want something a little more forgiving for Rock recordings.

[Woodsman]

Thanks Doug, awesome information. I have always known, older rock was recorded horribly. Some was extremely well recorded though.

Jim, is it possible that you may have a ROCK speaker in the works? That is something I can wait on. The Song 3 may already be that speaker eh?

[jsalk]

Thanks Doug, awesome information. I have always known, older rock was recorded horribly. Some was extremely well recorded though.

Jim, is it possible that you may have a ROCK speaker in the works? That is something I can wait on. The Song 3 may already be that speaker eh?

Woodsman -

I guess it is all determined by your budget.  Right now, based on your listening preferences, I would say the Song3 would be a leading candidate.  But I have some ideas on a few other designs that would also work well.  For example, using a Seas Nextel and beryllium tweeter in a SoundScape 8 would be awesome.  But it would be quite a bit more expensive than the Song3's.  And there are some ideas in between.  As with many of our new designs, we often don't pursue them until someone wants a pair.  So these are not models we are currently working on, but can get into high gear as soon as we have an order.

- Jim

[Woodsman]

Thanks Jim

When work settles down a bit for me, I will give you a phone call and see what we can come up with.

[ernest787]

I don't think you can go wrong with any pair of salk speakers.

I listen to like 90% rock music.  Most of my listening is centered around punk, hardcore, metal, etc. 

I own a pair of Songtowers with RT and a pair of HT3s.  Both speakers are fantastic and reproduce what they are fed.  So I would definitely agree with the other posters that the electronics you are using will matter.  The source material obviously matters as well, but listening to a lot of punk and such I don't always have the best recordings.

That said, I've never listened to either pair of Salk speakers and thought I can't listen to this.  In fact, I love that they are so good at reproducing what is there. 

I've had several friends over to listen and almost everyone says the same thing "I've never heard electric guitars sound so good."  They just sound like they are suppose to. 

If the song 3s are in your budget I would highly recommend them or if you can get to a more expensive model I don't think you'd be disappointed.  In fact, I really want to move up to a pair of exoticas, but that won't be in my future anytime soon.

[DEP14]

Woodsman -

I guess it is all determined by your budget.  Right now, based on your listening preferences, I would say the Song3 would be a leading candidate.  But I have some ideas on a few other designs that would also work well.  For example, using a Seas Nextel and beryllium tweeter in a SoundScape 8 would be awesome.  But it would be quite a bit more expensive than the Song3's.  And there are some ideas in between.  As with many of our new designs, we often don't pursue them until someone wants a pair.  So these are not models we are currently working on, but can't get into high gear as soon as we have an order.

- Jim

Please do this so I can have a listen and then plunk down my credit card!!!

(or maybe one of these days I'll be the guy to plunk down my CC)

[fsimms]

I've had several friends over to listen and almost everyone says the same thing "I've never heard electric guitars sound so good."  They just sound like they are suppose to. 

Maybe that is because Jim is a good electric guitar player.  I think he is in the Midwest Rock and Roll Hall of Fame from his younger years.

Bob