[JLM]

I already own a 2012 iMac (stock 21 inch version), a 2014 MacBook Air (stock 13 inch version), and iPhone 4S.  So far just use iTunes.

Question:  Best to buy $3000+ DAC using one of the (non-dedicated) Macs or split the budget up for a player/streamer (whatever) and DAC?

I've noticed that most DACs in the $1000 - 2000 range are DAC/pre-amps, which would leave the door open to sell my pre-amp and have the option to someday develop a desktop setup with active speakers.  This is a definite consideration.


The iMac sits at my desk (directly behind "the" listening chair, not the ideal position), so I've been using a $6, 35 foot long optical to an ancient/cheap DAC that amazingly works 99.999% of the time.  The iMac also has an ethernet output.

The MacBook is my portable computer, it frequently moves, so I would envision using the MacBook while listening (no optical or ethernet outputs) via a 3 - 5 meter long USB cable to a new DAC from my listening chair (near-field setup), recognizing that long USB cabling is not recommended. 


TIA

[ACHiPo]

In that price range I'd be tempted to go with an Oppo 105 modified by Dan Wright, but I haven't really gotten into hi-rez digital so almost all my content is still on round plastic things.

[Escott1377]

I use the Cary tube DAC - http://www.caryaudio.com/products/dac-100t/.

It has a USB input as well as coax and optical.

I use a Logitech Squeezebox that I have had for years and it accesses an external hard drive where I have about 2k hours of music.

The new 200t is out now, but if I recall, Cary was planning on adding DSD to this model which is overkill for my use.

I paid $2,200 from my Cary dealer, that may have gone done since the 200t has been released. 

Also looks like they have some music server models - I know Wyred 4 Sound offers 1 and Marantz as well - just off the top of my head.

I have had good experience with Cary gear and it uses 2 x 6922 tubes which was attractive to me.

Good luck -

[paul79]

You can use your MacBook very successfully with a DAC that has a good USB input. $3500 puts you in Auralic Vega territory, so that is the one to get in my opinion. The USB input on this DAC is really fantastic. USB Cable choice is critical to getting the best results as well.

[mav52]

How about a Teac UD501 does DSD also for under $1000.  Sounds really good.   A used Vega a nice dac and pre-amp on audiogon 2800. .  Nice sound.

[Phil A]

There are lots of choices out there and of course digital changes more rapidly than other formats.  Much depends on how much file playback and hi-rez file playback you'll do as well as what kinds of discs (CDs, SACDs, etc.) you will be spinning.  For me I have lots of hi-rez files, including DSD and I rarely play a disc (it is there if someone else comes over).  I have two HAL (Hollis Audio Labs) music servers, an MS-2 and an MS-3.  There's a whole thread here - http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=132170.0

For me with JRiver (or you could do Foobar for free) the HAL products are great and don't break the bank and leave plenty of money left over for a DAC and Rich Hollis is a top notch guy.  You could of course do JRiver on the MAC too but I prefer something dedicated (I have JRiver and Foorbar on my PC too) for the audio system.

If you want a disc spinner/DAC, you could start out with an Oppo 105D along with something like an HAL MS-3 and be hundreds under your budget and could always get the 105D modded down the road.  I don't have much need for a disc spinner so I have two 103Ds in two system.  One is solely for video in the main system and the other is for video and audio in a third system.  The 103D also does DSD files attached to a hard drive as well (and I can control it with the Oppo Media App and an iPhone). 

So my advice would be to decide if you really care about disc playback.  If you're going to use it for file playback mainly, then invest in a player/streamer and a DAC.

[Phil A]

How about a Teac UD501 does DSD also for under $1000.  Sounds really good.   A used Vega a nice dac and pre-amp on audiogon 2800. .  Nice sound.

The Teac is very nice for the money.  I have one in a secondary system with the HAL MS-3 with JRiver on it.  I got my Teac 18 months ago for under $800.  It does double DSD and up to 384kHz PCM.  I listened to some free sample cuts from justlisten.nativedsd.com several days back in double DSD and 352.8kHz.  They were outstanding.  The nice thing about the Teac and MS-3 is that it will only take up just under half your budget leaving you plenty of funds for hi-rez purchases.

[DaveC113]

The MacBook is my portable computer, it frequently moves, so I would envision using the MacBook while listening (no optical or ethernet outputs) via a 3 - 5 meter long USB cable to a new DAC from my listening chair (near-field setup), recognizing that long USB cabling is not recommended. 


TIA

Given this issue, I'd check out the Sony HAP-Z1ES as you would no longer require a music server. I've compared it to the Vega in my system and, via RCA outputs, they were very close and since then Sony has updated it's firmware and it sounds even better. Price is very attractive too, I think it's at the very top of the value for the money equation when considering digital sources.

[DaveC113]

The Teac is very nice for the money.  I have one in a secondary system with the HAL MS-3 with JRiver on it.  I got my Teac 18 months ago for under $800.  It does double DSD and up to 384kHz PCM.  I listened to some free sample cuts from justlisten.nativedsd.com several days back in double DSD and 352.8kHz.  They were outstanding.  The nice thing about the Teac and MS-3 is that it will only take up just under half your budget leaving you plenty of funds for hi-rez purchases.

For the money I agree but the Teac is nowhere close to the performance of the Sony HAP or Auralic Vega. I'd put the Teac in the same performance category as the Schiit Bifrost, ifi Micro, etc... good but they leave a lot on the table compared to much more expensive options.

[barrows]

You are in the Auralic Vega price territory.  I do not think you will find a higher performance DAC in this price area, the Vega is really good for the money.
I would stay away from such long USB cables though.  Consider putting your laptop close to the DAC and controlling it remotely.

Not quite as user friendly as the Vega is the Chord Hugo, but it has a sound many people really seem to like.

As always, audition in your system first!

[geowak]

Although I have not heard the Vega, it does get alot of high praise. That DAC is more in line for your budget.
I do not agree with the Schiit Audio comment. The one to get is the Gungnir, not the Bifrost. The good thing about Schiit Audio, is that it was started by two guys who have been in the digital industry for awhile and the products they make are upgradable. That is important now, since digital audio improves so rapidly. I have a Bifrost that I ugraded to an Uber by swapping the analog card. I really like the Bifrost Uber. Also don't overlook Benchmark. They make very good DACs within your budget.

[paul79]

I don't think 3-5 meter for a USB Cable is out of the question...

I'll echo the HAP-Z1ES. It is a great all in one unit. You did mention using the DAC for volume control or to displace a preamp, and with the Sony, you cannot do this. You are also locked in to this unit where other DAC's will provide more expandability, but this is not necessarily a bad thing depending on what you want to do... Other than that, it is a very great sounding unit, especially considering the cost.

[Big Red Machine]

Used PS Audio Directstream would be my choice.

[JLM]

What I'm asking is much more about future desktop (DAC/pre-amp) than spinning disks (that I see as all but extinct).

Yes, I purposely set the budget to correspond to be inclusive of the well respected Aurelic Vega DAC, but also within reach of several DAC/pre-amps + a number of less expensive servers.

The most of the current $1000 - 2000 DAC darlings include pre-amp functions, but the Sony seems to put too much in one basket while still requiring a pre-amp or at least a volume control.

I was really psyched over the Hugo last year, but it's really designed for portable use, OTOH Chord is supposed to be releasing two desktop versions, the 2Qute at $1800 and a much more expensive one.  However the 2Qute lacks pre-amp functions, putting it at a disadvantage to Benchmark, Hegel  HD12, Oppo HA-1, Mytek 192, or NuPrime DAC 10/10H.

I'm a total computer dunce, so will need the support hopefully included with purchasing new.

The basic question is: at this price point (significantly cheaper could be a different topic), would a server with class B DAC make more sense than the Aurelic Vega DAC (class A) using an existing MacBook?

[Phil A]

I'm a total computer dunce, so will need the support hopefully included with purchasing new.

The basic question is: at this price point (significantly cheaper could be a different topic), would a server with class B DAC make more sense than the Aurelic Vega DAC (class A) using an existing MacBook?

I was there a few years ago and while not an expert, I find that JRiver is really easy/ user friendly.  There are many fine DACs out there.  If you have audio hobby people near you (either from this site or others), I'd at least try hands on a couple of the interfaces to see which you feel comfortable with.  You don't want to end up with something that either has a lot of glitches or has things which you don't feel comfortable resolving regularly.

For example besides many people here using JRiver, they have this - http://wiki.jriver.com/index.php/Main_Page
plus a forum and have been in business many years.

[Pneumonic]

So many choices available, coupled with law of diminishing returns, leads me to suggest ..... spend the majority of your budget on more music 

[DaveC113]

So many choices available, coupled with law of diminishing returns, leads me to suggest ..... spend the majority of your budget on more music 

I do not believe you have hit the point of diminishing returns at the budget JLM has set. There is a massive difference in performance between, for example, the Teac and the Auralic, which does scale with price. But it would be hard to live with the Teac after you've heard the Auralic.

[poseidonsvoice]

What I'm asking is much more about future desktop (DAC/pre-amp) than spinning disks (that I see as all but extinct).

Yes, I purposely set the budget to correspond to be inclusive of the well respected Aurelic Vega DAC, but also within reach of several DAC/pre-amps + a number of less expensive servers.

The most of the current $1000 - 2000 DAC darlings include pre-amp functions, but the Sony seems to put too much in one basket while still requiring a pre-amp or at least a volume control.

I was really psyched over the Hugo last year, but it's really designed for portable use, OTOH Chord is supposed to be releasing two desktop versions, the 2Qute at $1800 and a much more expensive one.  However the 2Qute lacks pre-amp functions, putting it at a disadvantage to Benchmark, Hegel  HD12, Oppo HA-1, Mytek 192, or NuPrime DAC 10/10H.

I'm a total computer dunce, so will need the support hopefully included with purchasing new.

The basic question is: at this price point (significantly cheaper could be a different topic), would a server with class B DAC make more sense than the Aurelic Vega DAC (class A) using an existing MacBook?

I was using a Mac Mini along with the Vega. I changed the Mac Mini to an Aries. Did the sound improve? Yes. Did the sound improve as much, when I replaced my previous DAC (a very tricked out Buffalo) to the Auralic Vega?

No. Absolutely not.

Under $10K, I would seriously look at the Vega. You can upgrade your MacBook later if need be. I know of nothing cheaper in cost than a Vega that is worlds better than it. Different? Maybe. Worlds better? Nope.

But remember, it's supposed to be FUN!

Best,
Anand.

[MtnHam]

The Oppo 105 is excellent, and the Modwright Truth mod makes it superb. The Sony Hap-Z is also excellent if you don't want to spin discs. Both are great value, and allow for a wide range of media.

I take advantage of the 22,000+ CD collection at my local public library, which allows me to explore a diverse range of music, and only buy what really pleases me. Used CD's are incredibly cheap.

[TF1216]

How about a Lampizator DAC and JPlay 6 with a computer as a server for your music.  That could be sweet!