***X-Otica Main & Sub Build***

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nik.d

Re: ***X-Otica Main & Sub Build***
« Reply #80 on: 23 Feb 2016, 07:01 am »
Well Peter,

At least I know what's the perfect amplifier for your speakers: Gerd Sauermann's mono blocks.





And here's the link to the artist's behind the look of Gerd's front plate(s) - perhaps you'll find their work inspiring: Susanne and Mirko Gersak

Brgds,
George

Peter J

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Re: ***X-Otica Main & Sub Build***
« Reply #81 on: 7 Mar 2016, 03:28 am »
Thanks for the input, Greg. Always appreciate having a view from another vantage point.

George, that is some cool stuff. Messing with unusual finishes is certainly intriguing to me...and apparently at least one other! Someday I'd like to try doing something similar, but should get these done first, methinks.

Me being me, I had another idea on how to do the gilding and patina. I think I like this pattern best of all so far and may have reached patina nirvana...time will tell. If there's interest, I'll detail that process when I get there...someday...





I did get a few licks in on the sides of mains. I was kinda dreading this because of the inset baffle and angles. As much as I puzzled out the details in SketchUp, I was still figuring out a few things on the fly. Here I'm routing the dados for the shelf braces and tops & bottoms.

Routing jig





Once routed, jig gave me a consistent witness line to align with scribe marks





And got to here





Shelf dados cut





Routed 3/8" roundover on both edges, then onto table saw to cut rear rabbet for grill





And same for front baffle





Because I kinda got ahead of myself, I had to do some head scratching  to get the shelf brace width right on the money to fit already made baffles. If doing again, I think it would be easier to build cabs first, then baffles. Hindsight and all that...





A quick mock to keep me motivated




Next up will be shelf braces...with a twist.




Plund

Re: ***X-Otica Main & Sub Build***
« Reply #82 on: 7 Mar 2016, 01:13 pm »
Peter,  looks very good.   Over my ability, but looks very good!

"Me being me, I had another idea on how to do the gilding and patina. I think I like this pattern best of all so far and may have reached patina nirvana...time will tell. If there's interest, I'll detail that process when I get there...someday..."

Yes, please!

Peter J

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Re: ***X-Otica Main & Sub Build***
« Reply #83 on: 8 Mar 2016, 02:54 am »
I've been thinking how to run internal wiring in a neat and clean way. Rather than drilling holes in shelf braces I'm wondering if clipping the corner like drawing will work OK. I'd probably route visible wire in top section in convoluted loom.

My question; For those who've built open baffle speakers before and were faced with similar, do you see any drawbacks to doing it this way?







mlundy57

Re: ***X-Otica Main & Sub Build***
« Reply #84 on: 8 Mar 2016, 03:04 am »
I can't really see how that would detract from the brace's stability any more than drilling a hole as close to the corner as possible.

gregfisk

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Re: ***X-Otica Main & Sub Build***
« Reply #85 on: 8 Mar 2016, 03:22 am »
I've done that same thing before to run wiring and I think it works really well. The wire is (right in) the corner so it is easier to staple cleanly or however your'e going to fasten it.

By the way, I think your last gilding and patina piece is perfect to me and yes, I would really like to know the process :thumb:

Captainhemo

Re: ***X-Otica Main & Sub Build***
« Reply #86 on: 9 Mar 2016, 03:17 am »
I've considered doing the same thing with  subs  and the NX-Otticas instead of the holes.  Being the holes are already in the  program, that is what we've gone with but I  don't see what you are suggesting being an issue whatsoever.

In the top section of my OB7's,  I drilled holes between the  drivers ( in the baffle) then cut  slots  around the permimiter of the driver to  routte the cables up t othe next driver (thanks Neil T ).  Neil has pics of this in his build thread of his OB7's

jay

Peter J

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Re: ***X-Otica Main & Sub Build***
« Reply #87 on: 21 Mar 2016, 03:54 am »
OK sports fans, here's an update on my (slow) progress.

I got to thinkin' about leg placement, weight distribution, stability and the meaning of life :o. OK, we'll leave the latter for a different time, but the rest is pertinent. The planned legs don't project past front of speaker. In fact, nearly the entire weight of baffle filled with drivers is in front of legs with no back on cabinet or other means to counter balance that out. Thus, my seat-of-pants engineering says the whole affair will weight biased to the front and possibly unstable if standing straight up.

I could tilt the speakers back to compensate, but that wouldn't be fitting for this build, 'cuz it's all about how I can over think things and add complexity to the overall project, right? I weighed the baffle and drivers which came out to about 25 lbs. I considered strapping a pipe to the top of speaker sticking out rearward a couple of feet and then attaching a downrigger weight to that...too ugly. Could use guy wires like a mast on sailboat, but opined it would make the whole affair to hard to move.

So I landed on the idea of adding lead ballast at rear and bottom of box. And so it goes...

Here's the template for top, bottom and center braces.





I cut out cores of 1/2 Baltic Birch





Routed slots. No pics but after this I glued 1/4" MDF on one side




Filled compartments with #9 lead shot




Poured epoxy resin over shot to make one big gob




Tops and mid braces




Bottoms got extra dose. After epoxy cured I laminated another layer of 1/4" MDF to opposite side so it's all encased



Flush trimmed the last layer, drilled pocket holes to attach baffle later




Because I decided to make them thicker than originally planned for more lead capacity, I cut rabbets so I didn't have to redo dados in sides




Assembled and ready for next step...someday...










Captainhemo

Re: ***X-Otica Main & Sub Build***
« Reply #88 on: 21 Mar 2016, 04:33 am »
Nicely done Peter, well thought out  :thumb:
Kind of surprised that the baffle with drivers is only 25lbs..

But you know, they do make some pretty cool  downrigger weights these days 

 
or, maybe with a built in "disco ball"


Might have been pretty slick  :lol:

jay

Peter J

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Re: ***X-Otica Main & Sub Build***
« Reply #89 on: 21 Mar 2016, 01:54 pm »
Nicely done Peter, well thought out  :thumb:
Kind of surprised that the baffle with drivers is only 25lbs..

But you know, they do make some pretty cool  downrigger weights these days 

 
or, maybe with a built in "disco ball"


Might have been pretty slick  :lol:

jay

The 25lbs is close, I think I actually calculated 26lbs. Lighter because it's only half that nasty MDF

It's done now, but in hindsight I could've mounted a whole downrigger with adjustable arm and covered all the possibilities.


Peter J

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Re: ***X-Otica Main & Sub Build***
« Reply #90 on: 16 Apr 2016, 12:49 am »
Hiya all. Not much progress to report, but have been thinkin' about some aspects. Busy times with work and all. Maybe I'll get some time in this weekend.

One thing I'm considering is external crossovers. Not really about functionality but perhaps more about eyeball and doing something a little different. I've got this idea to house crossover in some kind of project box and integrate that into an amp stand (Ncore) and run balanced interconnects from preamp. Amp and crossover would live in close proximity to speaker.

Any comments on how that will or won't work? Also there's some cool looking aluminum boxes on PE, any reason not to use an aluminum box to house crossover? Actual crossover would be mounted on non-conductive material inside box.

What say you, geeks?

HAL

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Re: ***X-Otica Main & Sub Build***
« Reply #91 on: 16 Apr 2016, 12:53 am »
Putting the crossover external to the speaker removes it from the vibration environment.  Always a good thing.

Aluminum is good for shielding and heat dissipation for components. 

My Ninja Nobel crossover networks for my N2X's are external in a gloss black box with the plexiglass lid.  Fun to see the guts for me.

I think it is a good thing to do.


Vedder323

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Re: ***X-Otica Main & Sub Build***
« Reply #92 on: 18 Apr 2016, 02:47 pm »
This thread is so inspiring!

Peter J

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Re: ***X-Otica Main & Sub Build***
« Reply #93 on: 13 May 2016, 04:53 am »
Hi again sports fans.  No, I didn't fall off the planet or get hit by a car, just been up to my eyeballs in alligators and not much time to work on this.

I have gotten a few things done and made the decision to use outboard crossovers.  I've got some cool looking cases coming, amp cases actually, which will house crossovers. More on that later.

Glued some meat on the back to sort of contain the grill and give me a place to mount the connectors, two sets on account of outboard crossovers.

Wanted to see how many clamps would fit in a small area.





So I could end up with this at the bottom





And this on top



Glued phenolic cabinet liner on top and bottom to tie everything together and keep seams from telegraphing through veneer on top





I had the legs all figured out...I thought.

Cut a dowel to fit inside of carbon fiber tube


Bevel cut after epoxying in tube, but wasn't loving how it looked







So I mocked up some alternatives. Would appreciate your feedback on these. I think I have a fave, but as evidenced by this whole thread, things can change!









mlundy57

Re: ***X-Otica Main & Sub Build***
« Reply #94 on: 13 May 2016, 05:07 am »
I like the rounded black end. Blends better than the silver and looks more finished than the beveled cuts.

gregfisk

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Re: ***X-Otica Main & Sub Build***
« Reply #95 on: 13 May 2016, 05:36 am »
I like the black or silver, but it really depends on the rest of the design and color. Everything needs to work together, so silver, brass, copper or whatever needs to all work together as a whole. Unless you can work the red in somewhere else I don't see that as a good option. The round black looks good and the silver looks good but as I recall you were looking at brass screws at some point, so maybe the end needs to be brass on the legs if you are still considering brass screws.

mresseguie

Re: ***X-Otica Main & Sub Build***
« Reply #96 on: 13 May 2016, 06:14 am »
I prefer the rounded black end, but I don't know what the rest of the cabinet will look like when it is finished.

lacro

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Re: ***X-Otica Main & Sub Build***
« Reply #97 on: 13 May 2016, 01:39 pm »
I like the bevel, but it needs to be finished with a cap, either from CF sheet or a thin piece of Black Walnut. Even a piece of veneer glued on, or maybe CF vinyl wrap would finish it off. BTW/ I like your dowel lathe set-up :thumb:

NeilT

Re: ***X-Otica Main & Sub Build***
« Reply #98 on: 13 May 2016, 03:09 pm »
Bevel, for sure.

Neil

undertow

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Re: ***X-Otica Main & Sub Build***
« Reply #99 on: 13 May 2016, 05:32 pm »
Honestly on the the 3 design elements :

1 - Copper / Brass thumbtack on the grill way too "1962" trust me. Plus it does not go with your flow using carbon fiber legs at all. Your adding work, and calling attention to something that honestly makes it look more "Garage" built in my opinion.

2 - I am not 100% sure if these are planned for real world production or simply a concept for maybe providing flat packs or something, however you can get grill frames punched out 20 at a time from single sheets of whatever .25" material you want with all the beveling, cross bracing etc... on a CNC machine for probably 20 bucks a pair which would save you a ton of time, materials, and money unless you love the self inflicted pain doing details like this!

It's a grill so I see it as 100% industrial function for protection so I would never listen with them anyway.

By the way I do know of a mass production place super professional that can do the grill frames with state of the art CNC for any possible design you want punched out, and they will do pretty small quantities, with magnets, and all installed already, and yes they are easy to talk to, and located in the U.S. I think they will even put the fabric as a finished product, but that would cost more obviously.

3 - The leg concept is interesting, and I get going for the "Design" element of it, but I will make a serious suggestion here.  First you are putting a ton of stress on those bolts holding it to the cabinet regardless of the clamp mechanism, so if somebody tilts this thing, or pulls its weight across the floor I think you risk some type of cracking, or damage at a point in the future. I would highly suggest simply cutting out full "Outriggers" that cross the bottom of the entire cabinet either from metal, or even wood could work, and this will take all the stress off, and give you plenty of surface area to bolt, and place wherever you like into the the speaker. Gravity will do the rest. And then use the "Legs" attached the to the top of the outrigger simply as an ornament with a single fancy clamp you came up with just for audio jewelry to give the design element your looking for, and ultimately save a ton of assembly time.

Then you don't need to try and get the shear strength of bolts like the M3 you mentioned, or anything into the tube itself for alignment, and keeping it from slipping, you just put your tube thru the clamp tighten up so it looks cool, but really has no a critical function at least that your battling with. Otherwise your putting a lot of bank on those tubes to do it all, with clamps holding a heavy speaker in the lateral plain basically "Floating". Again this can be eliminated with a simple cheap, and very effective fix using outriggers like in the photo to pull it off, and you never have to worry about the engineering on this part. Plus it still looks just as cool, and maybe even more robust than before.

Yes I have built many speakers  :thumb: