AudioCircle
Industry Circles => GR Research => Topic started by: Danny Richie on 15 Aug 2016, 07:19 pm
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$1,229 for the pair and that is with the flat pack.
Some of you guys have been asking about getting just the MTM section only for the NX-Otica so that you can simply add them to the top of your existing H-frame servo subs. Well now you can. You can order the MTM section only.
I just completed designing a crossover for this version, and the result was very good. And I designed a version using the standard Neo 3 pdr and one using some of the custom Neo 3's that I still have on hand.
Here is the crossover response.
(http://gr-research.com/pics/NX-Otica%20MTM%20crossover.jpg)
There is no high pass filter on the woofers. They can be played full range. If you plan on using a lot of power with them then some form of inline passive filter to be plugged in before your amp is recommended.
Here are a few pics:
(http://gr-research.com/pics/side2.jpg)
(http://gr-research.com/pics/side.jpg)
(http://gr-research.com/pics/back.jpg)
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Danny, did the crossover change from the original floor standing model other than the parts required for the bottom 4 drivers? What is the cost of the kit (minus the N3PDR)? Any comments on the differences between the floor standing and the MTM would be appreciated as well.
Thanks,
Ed
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Danny, did the crossover change from the original floor standing model other than the parts required for the bottom 4 drivers? What is the cost of the kit (minus the N3PDR)? Any comments on the differences between the floor standing and the MTM would be appreciated as well.
Thanks,
Ed
Hey Ed,
The 100uF cap value that was inline with the woofers are now gone. So there is a big advantage in that they are no longer in the signal path. And when that went away it change the shape of the woofer output a little and then I needed to compensate with a slight change to the tweeters crossover. So it is different.
I don't have a two woofer H-frame pair here to play them with and compare to the floor standing version, but I bet it will be a little give and take.
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Thanks Danny. If I am remembering correctly, the MTM section mid drivers are nearly double the displacement of the Wedgie MTM drivers, is that correct? If so, I would guess these would play a little lower than the Wedgie. How high do you believe the servo subs need to play with this setup?
Thanks again,
Ed
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Thanks Danny. If I am remembering correctly, the MTM section mid drivers are nearly double the displacement of the Wedgie MTM drivers, is that correct? If so, I would guess these would play a little lower than the Wedgie. How high do you believe the servo subs need to play with this setup?
Thanks again,
Ed
Yes, these will easily play down to around 100Hz or so.
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Sweet, as soon as a total price is set I'll be first to order but last to actually complete the build. It took me a year to finish my pair of Super Vs lol.
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Sweet, as soon as a total price is set I'll be first to order but last to actually complete the build. It took me a year to finish my pair of Super Vs lol.
Commission a complete build. The cost difference between a flat pack and a completed set should be quite reasonable.
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Commission a complete build. The cost difference between a flat pack and a completed set should be quite reasonable.
I know at least one person who could accommodate such a commission :green:
They, along with the crossover components, should be home in a few days.
I'm building this first pair of crossovers with the same parts I usually use: Sonicaps, Platinum by-pass caps, Mills resistors and Erse XQ inductors. However, I'm going to wire the crossovers up in such a way that I can easily swap networks in and out. That way I can build upgraded crossovers later on and easily A/B them.
Danny, thanks for all your help on these. I can't wait to see how they sound now.
Mike
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Any chance of getting one of these kits by the end of the month? Or is availability a few months away
Steve
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Any chance of getting one of these kits by the end of the month? Or is availability a few months away
Steve
I have everything in stock and ready to ship.
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What's the total price (with the flat pack and no Rez)?
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What's the total price (with the flat pack and no Rez)?
Do you have a pair of the Neo 3 pdr tweeters already or do you need the tweeters too?
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Do you have a pair of the Neo 3 pdr tweeters already or do you need the tweeters too?
I don't have anything. I saw a price earlier in the thread, but that was without the tweeter, flat pack, and no Rez, I think.
And with the lack of a "box" here, wouldn't it be better to just twist on the speaker wire?
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Once I fill all of the obligations for NX-Otica and NX-Treme I'll see if I have tweeters left of the custom version. I'd like to hang onto them for NX-Treme models as they will need the higher sensitivity version.
At some point Parts Express is supposed to get some from Christy Digital, but I have played that game with them already myself. They talk a talk, but don't really deliver. Maybe one day they will deliver.
I also have completed development of a new Neo 3 and am now awaiting some pricing on production. It will require a network adjustment but the frames are the same. So they will be able to be used with these new designs.
Hang in there.
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I also have completed development of a new Neo 3 and am now awaiting some pricing on production. It will require a network adjustment but the frames are the same. So they will be able to be used with these new designs.
:banana piano:
Are you still planning on reworking the networks on older models such as the N series to work with these new tweeters?
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:banana piano:
Are you still planning on reworking the networks on older models such as the N series to work with these new tweeters?
If all goes well then they will get the new tweeters and wave guides.
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What's the total price (with the flat pack and no Rez)?
I'm interested in that as well, although living in Europe I don't know whether it remains as interesting, with shipping costs and all...
although I could get the woodwork done over here, if exact plans are available.
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Hi Danny,
I am interested in the MTM monitors using the new Neo tweeter and waveguide.
I plan to mate them to my servo subs in the W style open enclosure.
Add me to your list and let me know when the components become available.
Mark
Syracuse, NY
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We've still got to get boxes and custom foam/packaging cut so still trying to get a fianl price on the flat packs.
But, we've got 4 complete sets of these in stock now, will have more cut when needed.
We used dowels in the base to correctly postion the wings just like the Otticas/Tremes. The long wing has 3 dowels and 3 screws that go up throght the base, the short wing only has a dowel due to space but they'll be easy to asemble.
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=149680)
After the dowels are in place, pop the wings into position
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=149681)
Then the baffle
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=149682)
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=149683)
Base is a simple wedge shape that extends just a bit outside the baffle and wings. It's got a .5" rouindover to match the verical front corners of the baffle/wing.A guy could shorten it up on the rear edge if he/she wanted.
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=149684)
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=149685)
They stand 24.5" tall when sitting on the 1" base. The top edge of the baffles will be cut at a 5 degree bevel to match the wings before they go out the door.
We'll finalize prices in the next day or two, get some good douilble layer boxes like we ship our subs in, get the custom cut foam ordered and hopefully be ready to ship them out within a week.
jay
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Jay,
Looking good and a lot easier to glue up with the dowels to keep things from moving.
Mike
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Jay,
Looking good and a lot easier to glue up with the dowels to keep things from moving.
Mike
Thanks Mike,
as you know, gluing up the wedge shaped cabinets can be a bit of PITA, the dowels really do make it easy. Another thing guys can do to aid is buy a 2x2, cut a couple of 24" pieces, then slice the edge off each at 10 degrees. You can then run one up each side of the baffle against the wings and you end up with a 90 degree surface for some clamps to squeeze the wins tight against the baffle.
jay
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Thanks Mike,
as you know, gluing up the wedge shaped cabinets can be a bit of PITA, the dowels really do make it easy. Another thing guys can do to aid is buy a 2x2, cut a couple of 24" pieces, then slice the edge off each at 10 degrees. You can then run one up each side of the baffle against the wings and you end up with a 90 degree surface for some clamps to squeeze the wins tight against the baffle.
jay
Just be sure to cover the clamping guides with packing tape so they don't get stuck to the cabinet when the glue dries. :green:
Mike
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Just be sure to cover the clamping guides with packing tape so they don't get stuck to the cabinet when the glue dries. :green:
Mike
Gee Mike, I thought the speakers might look really good with clamps attached, more of an industrial look :thumb:
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Gee Mike, I thought the speakers might look really good with clamps attached, more of an industrial look :thumb:
Oh, the clamps will come off OK, it's the boards used to keep the parts aligned that might decide to stick around and become a part of the speaker :green:
Mike
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Oh, the clamps will come off OK, it's the boards used to keep the parts aligned that might decide to stick around and become a part of the speaker :green:
Mike
Then they're called enhancements.
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Danny, what is the hook up wire you are using in the first picture?
Rocket Ronny
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Peter, exactly :lol:
Ron, pretty sure it is his (Danny's) OFC 16ga solid core wire w/teflon jacket. Works well in a 4 or 6 conductor braid for speaker cables too , pretty good results
jay
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Nice, thanks.
Rocket Ronny
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Peter, exactly :lol:
Ron, pretty sure it is his (Danny's) OFC 16ga solid core wire w/teflon jacket. Works well in a 4 or 6 conductor braid for speaker cables too , pretty good results
jay
Yep, that's what it is, Danny's normal internal/speaker wire.
It looks a little odd because I wired these up to check the NX-Ottica networks I built for another AC member. Since the wire on the networks was long enough to reach the drivers in a full size NX-Ottica I was able to set the boards on the floor next to the speakers and the wire reached up to the back of the MTM section. All I needed to do then was run wires from the drivers to the back of the cabinets so I could hook the networks up with alligator clips.
I thought this would make it easier for Danny to measure the speakers and tweak the network for the MTM section so I left them wired this way when I sent the speakers to him.
Mike
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Jay,
You said the flatpacks are 24-1/2" tall sitting on the 1" base. Where does that put the center of the tweeter?
Mike
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Jay,
You said the flatpacks are 24-1/2" tall sitting on the 1" base. Where does that put the center of the tweeter?
Mike
14" from bottom of base, so, if a person sits these on top of a dual h-frame, the tweeter will be very close to the same height as the NX-Ottica. Remember how good the vertical off axis performance is ? Witheh NX-Ottica, yo ucan get up out of achair and not notice any change :thumb:
here's a a couple pics of the cabinet with a trimmed up top edge on the baffle
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=149881)
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=149883)
A couple of the front and rear sides of the baffle itself
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=149884)
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=149885)
jay
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Okay guys....
The total price for the kit and CNC cut MTM cabinets (as show in the pics) is $939. Not including tweeters.
They are now available.
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Okay guys....
The total price for the kit and CNC cut MTM cabinets (as show in the pics) is $939.
They are now available.
Does that include the Neo3PDR? Your new tweeter? I'm guessing not.
Thanks,
Ed
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Does that include the Neo3PDR? Your new tweeter? I'm guessing not.
Thanks,
Ed
That includes the custom Neo 3 tweeter from Serenity stock.
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That includes the custom Neo 3 tweeter from Serenity stock.
That's a pretty great deal, $240. for the Neo3's and the flat pack, I gave over $200.00 for the last pair of Neo3s I bought .
Best,
Ed
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That's a pretty great deal, $240. for the Neo3's and the flat pack, I gave over $200.00 for the last pair of Neo3s I bought .
Best,
Ed
Oops, sorry about that. That price did not include the tweeters. I had NX-Otica and NX-Treme models on my mind.
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I configured crossovers for the Neo 3 pdr and standard Neo 3's for the MTM model. I also now have a way to modify standard Neo 3's to a custom unit like the ones made for Serenity Acoustics.
I don't think PE ever got any of the promised drivers from Christy Digital, but they do have some of the standard Neo 3's from the shipment that they got from Christy Digital of old inventory.
I can supply the kit with some of the Serenity tweeters as well, but I'd really like to hang onto most of them for the limited number of NX-Treme's.
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Hey folks, I received a MTM flat pack from Captainhemo earlier this week. Shipping was really fast considering the journey he has to go on just to get the packs to UPS. They were packed extremely well - so well that I think that the only way they could be damaged during shipping would be if someone intentionally tried to do so and even then I think it would be difficult. I did a rough dry fit with drivers and everything fit perfectly. The work itself looks amazing but you can probably tell that from his pictures. Miraculously there was not a spec of mdf dust/residue on any of the pieces or in the box :thumb:
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Hey folks, I received a MTM flat pack from Captainhemo earlier this week. Shipping was really fast considering the journey he has to go on just to get the packs to UPS. They were packed extremely well - so well that I think that the only way they could be damaged during shipping would be if someone intentionally tried to do so and even then I think it would be difficult. I did a rough dry fit with drivers and everything fit perfectly. The work itself looks amazing but you can probably tell that from his pictures. Miraculously there was not a spec of mdf dust/residue on any of the pieces or in the box :thumb:
Thanks for the feedback, appreciate it! Not so sure how you received no dust, it's usually free :lol:
jay
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Thanks for the feedback, appreciate it! Not so sure how you received no dust, it's usually free :lol:
jay
Yeah, I'm not sure how that happened lol.
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Hey Danny, I forgot to ask what the impedance is on these.
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8 ohms nominal impedance.
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Any progress on your build Alfred ?
jay
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Captainhemo, What is the feasibility of producing the flat pack in all solid hard wood? If not completely in 3/4" planks, how about the small < 11-1/2" pieces in solid wood, and the large piece in veneer (either ply or mdf) to match the hard wood?
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Captainhemo, What is the feasibility of producing the flat pack in all solid hard wood? If not completely in 3/4" planks, how about the small < 11-1/2" pieces in solid wood, and the large piece in veneer (either ply or mdf) to match the hard wood?
It would likely be far more cost efective to use the curent flat packs and have them laminated after assembly. I'm not saying it can't be done but hardwood is expensive and it can be more prone to resonence
Do you have a particular type of wood in mind ?
jay
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It would likely be far more cost efective to use the curent flat packs and have them laminated after assembly. I'm not saying it can't be done but hardwood is expensive and it can be more prone to resonence
Do you have a particular type of wood in mind ?
jay
Jay,
Something to keep in mind about hardwood is that it comes in varying size boards, not sheets like MDF. You would have to joint the edges flat and square so you can glue the pieces up into panels of the size you need, keeping grain pattern in mind for flow to adjacent pieces. Then the panels will have to be planed to a uniform thickness.
The width of the panels is going to be limited to the width of the planer which is going to be somewhere between 12" and 25" (my planer is 15"). The only way to get panels wider than the planer is to glue up multiple individual panels to the width of the planer and glue these panels together. Then you have to use hand planes to flatten, smooth and thickness the large panel to it's final dimensions.
Since the widest piece of the MTM Otica is the big wing at 20" you could do it with access to a 24" planer. Again be careful about grain direction. You would want it to match as it wraps around the big wing, baffle and small wing.
Another issue with solid wood to keep in mind is movement. Solid wood is not stationary. It expands and contracts with seasonal moisture variations. This movement occurs across the grain. To make the cabinet look right the grain would be oriented vertically. That would mean the expansion and contraction would occur across the width of the piece. Being glued to the base the bottom would be constrained but the top would be free to move. This would likely cause the wood to crack. One way around this would be to screw the wings and baffle to the base in such a way the bottom could expand and contract.
Another option would be to use a wood that doesn't expand or contract much. Usually that means quartersawn lumber. The issue is that the grain pattern on most quartersawn lumber is rather blend. For the most part, the really pretty grain patterns occur in flatsawn lumber but flatsawn tends to move the most in response moisture. There are exceptions to everything though. Highly figured quartersawn white oak is stunning while flatsawn mesquite is very stable.
As for resonances, at least with the MTM version, I wonder how much of an issue it would really be given how open the design is only the big wing should be affected and it has NoRez on the inside.
I'm not saying it can't be done, just that there is a lot more to doing it and making the end product look right than most people realize.
Mike
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hey Mike
Yeah, all valid points and exactly why I said much more cost effective to build an MDF pair and veneer them. I used to build some projects out of solid Ash and many of them had a lot of laminating/joinery to build panels, it's a lot of work.
As you mentioned, the grain would have to run vertically so the large wing would only be 15" so an 18" planer should be fine.. Totally agree, having the grain align and wrap around the cabinet from side to side would be tricky, and even more so whenn you'd want both cabinets to be "book matched" to each other.
After creating a 1.5" thick panel,for the baffle there would also be some CNC issues I can think of and again you'd have to keep the grain pattern in mind throughout the process....... lots to consider
My initial thoughts stand, veneered MDF cabinets would be far more cost effective. I've seen some great veneering job both on the wedgies from you and the NX Ottica MTM's from Ed
jay
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My thought on the solid wood, might just be the baffle and the small wing. Pieces that could be easily cut from a single piece of lumber. The other pieces veneered.
For example I am considering building the OB W frame sub. My thought is to use MDF for the construction, but since it is recommended to use double thickness on the sides, I was considering wrapping all four sides in either dimensional lumber or 3/4" veneered plywood.
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One reason for using two different types of material on the the sub is that whey would resonate at different frequencies. My thought is that one would dampen the resonant frequency of the other.
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are the mtm flat packs still available? how much $?
thanks,
drmike
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I'd be curious to get a total bill of materials on these as well. If I'd built, I'd likely do a black DuraTex coating.
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are the mtm flat packs still available? how much $?
thanks,
drmike
The NX-Otica MTM kit is $1,129 plus shipping, and that includes the flat pack. I forgot to add the tweeters when I quoted this earlier.
And the flat pack by its self is $239 plus shipping.
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tweeters are available for this kit?
thanks,
drmike
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tweeters are available for this kit?
thanks,
drmike
Yes, and the standard Neo 3 pdr can be used in this one.
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Danny,
Looks like I'm ready to pull the trigger on my first GR Research project...and why not go big: NX-Otica MTM and H-Frame servo subs.
To obtain a full NX-Otica MTM kit (including flap packs), should I PM you?
Also, do you have any of the custom tweeters left?
Thanks for all your (and so many others) support in this forum. I've had quite an education that will no doubt continue over the summer.
Once I get going on this I'll start a new build thread.
Thanks again.
Bob
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You can call to order anytime. 940-592-3400
And yes, I have the some of the custom tweeters still in stock.