[bluesky]

Hi

We must also remember that Hugh caters for a niche market, many of us already have a preamp of one sort or another, and even then there are diverse opinions on just what preamp is best, some like passives and others insist on the tube/solid state approach. 

It would be silly of Hugh to try and cover every approach out there, that's what Marantz et al are there for.  Most people in this section of the market want a preamp and a separate amp combination and see this set up as best so they can choose whichever type they feel is best for them, or can upgrade to a new component when it suits them.  I personally think there would be very few who would choose an intergrated over separates and as such it would not be viable for Hugh to spend a heap of development time on something few would buy anyway.

Ian 

[LM]

Well the new girl has about 30 to 35 hours up now and I'm pleased to report she is quite settled in and is now an integral part of the family.  I'm getting to know her better and better and with reflection, I have the impression that there has been a small and gradual smoothing out of sound over the period to date though there has been minimal obvious change since the first 5 to 10 hrs or so.

So what have I listened to over the period?  A lot of classical to get a feel for layering and stage size, a fair bit of Rock to see how well it handles complex and often compressed recordings, some 'electronica' to hear non standard instrumentation and my own particular favorites including all flavors of female voice and jazz.

The best way to summarise the 2009 Soraya is that it just does everything superbly well - this amp is not limited by musical genre IMO.  I won't be boring and describe everything I have listened to but there were a few things that provided a pleasant surprise.  Rock for example.  Rather than my existing impression of most rock CDs being somewhat discordant and harsh, many such as Wolfmother actually appear quite well recorded and now sound very good indeed.  Roger Waters and Pink Floyd are more ethereal than ever and Goldfrapp and other electronic music come across as very clean, precise and highly listenable.

I had earlier commented on the general clarity, detail and drive giving great presence and refinement and I now think of the amp as both vivid and vital.  Oddly, the increased base extension, so obvious at first, I hardly notice now with gained familiarity - it's as if the Soraya simply provides the performance anyone would naturally expect of any amp down low.

I have also realised that the mid and upper base detail and speed I had previously noted, in reality extends across the whole frequency spectrum.  It certainly remains more instantly noticeable down low but can be clearly heard in the initial instant of a string pluck or piano note be they high or low.  So whilst I've previously mentioned how well voice and drums are handled, what has rather blown me away during extended listening has been the superb presentation of piano and guitar.  There is nearly always a small but realistic imparting of impact energy to be sensed or heard and this punchy underpinning along with the increased detail and clarity really drives the musical reality of the notes.  Tommy Emmanuel and Sam See guitar and Keith Jarrett piano recordings for example are now simply exquisite to listen to and I'd forgotten how good Sky really is.

There are still no negatives IMO. 99 out of a hundred CDs and LPs have really come out of their shell and I'm having a ball listening.  I had thought early on that perhaps the increased resolution might reduce the previous warmth somewhat and/or make poorly recorded material unlistenable, but I've been pleasantly surprised on both counts.  No the new presentation is not warm or coloured of itself but it is simply crystal clear and neutral.  I leave the warming to my GK1.  There is none of that etched or over sharp feeling that some SS amps have - rather like when one overuses the sharpness control on a TV.  There is just a clean, incisive and natural leading edge of notes and superb decay as well.  Any muddiness, resonance, reverb etc. one hears is simply from the source.  As to poor material, I've rather unexpectedly found that the new clarity quite often actually helps but with one exception though, where bad compression artifacts such as clipping are engineered into the recording, the faithful reproduction of same can be just too much of the wrong information.

In summary then, all is very well indeed in my listening room.  KK and others, you are in for a treat. 

[AKSA]

Thank you Lyn,

A very good summation;  to those reading, it must seem too good to be true.....  the truth is, this amp is something quite exceptional, particularly in the deep bass, where it absolutely rocks.  The only area I feel BEN, the Bass ENhancer, is really needed is on Bach's Toccata and Fugue, on all other music, even heavy rock, the VSonics seem entirely up to the task, and I'm constantly amazed at how much bass and scale these two way 8" speakers can deliver.

I've just finished two CB105s for despatch today and these too are absolute corkers.

I appreciate all the support here.  For those in Melbourne, come and have a listen.....

Cheers,

Hugh

[bluesky]

Hi Hugh

Is it possible that your new power supply could be advantageous with other amp modules, or are the chokes etc only suitable for the big Soyara?  Would it work with smaller transformers or does it only work in supplying the required voltages and current for the Soyara?

Thanks,

Ian

[AKSA]

Yes, Ian,

It would improve most amps, I'm quite sure.

Nice shot of KK's 2009 Soraya:



Cheers,

Hugh

[bluesky]

Hi Hugh

It looks sensational, something to aim for in the future I think.  It is a very tube like sort of power supply with the use of chokes, not often seen in most run of the mill solid state amps.  I understand that chokes store and release energy in a more controlled manner and can ramp up the regulation a bit extra too, great expression of a good leading edge power supply!

Ian

[painkiller]

I really want one of those!  aa

Someday I'll invest in a new amp, and it'll be this one. Until then I'll have to live with my (ever so pretty) LF55's. 

[LM]

I really want one of those!

Hi painkiller,

The Soraya is definitely a superb amplifier to aspire to, and I know how good the LF55’s are.  Incidentally, whilst there is little I can add to my previous review comments, one thing I can now say about ‘living’ with a Soraya 09 is that even after 4 months, I never cease to get a thrill of anticipation whenever I turn it on.  I still feel pleasantly surprised at how great it sounds each time as the first notes flow.

[DSK]

In the past, I've usually gone into great detail about the differences in sound between components and where one surpasses the other. Often writing more than most people would probably care to read. Strangely, upon upgrading from the LifeForce to the Soraya a few months back, I don't feel compelled in the slightest to do this. Instead, I am at peace with the upgrade and simply enjoying real music. Each time I fire up the rig and sit down, I am more readily sucked into the suspension of disbelief as it were. There is simply less 'electronics' between me and the performers, more inner detail and texture from a quieter background, less chaos for the brain to decipher and become fatigued. Just real, live music that doesn't get congested when things start rocking. Oh, and the bass is more powerful, articulate and convincing than the LifeForce too. Mental wrestles over whether you would be better off with a tube amp simply vapourise as you enjoy real music with natural (ie. as heard from unamplified instruments) warmth, body and texture. Nothing unnaturally emphasized and nothing missing, just beautifully balanced music, regardless of genre.

I'm not sure it gets any better than this but, if it does, I am sure I can't afford it ... and I don't care. 

[AKSA]

Thanks Darren,

An enthralling critique - so good, people will be sceptical the Soraya is that good!!     It is the nature of so many of the Aspen reviews, a bouquet I'm proud to earn, but which probably is not always believed.....

I will admit that the last couple of years on DIYaudio I have taken a huge beating from the technocrats, who dismiss sound quality with abandon (human senses are completely unreliable!) as they condemn and ridicule 'the golden ear set'.  It seems one must hold forth with tales of enhanced transconductance, lashes of loop gain, and enough poles and zeros to launch aerial combat....

As so often happens in life as we get older, I regret that at University I studied motorcycles and women so convincingly   , yet flunked my maths..... truly, a profound regret   .  It would not have made my amps sound any better had I passed math, possibly they would not be as good as they are, but it sure would have given some pleasure to whop these guys with a few nicely chosen triple integrals!!   

Thanks Darren, you've made my day!

Cheers,

Hugh

[gaetan8888]

Hello Hugh

Your math weekness are your strenght, because with more math you would may have become like John Curl or Bob Cordell and your amps would have sound plain ordinary.

It's hard to have lot of science knowledges and good intuitions in same times, thoses "brains" guys in the diyaudio forum are, for many of them, a bit marrow mind and they will not use some very importants littles details in amps topologies, because maths and sims say that it's not worth it. They will not admit that yours amps are so good sounding because they would need to admit that all those years in universities was not enough to design best musical amps, so they will continu to  beat and mock you.

Designing musical amps are much more than maths and sims but those math guys can't accept this simple fact.

Most peoples who want a musical amps don't know which guys made them and they don't know your amps, so they buy tube amps since most transistors amps sound dry and life-less.

Bye

Gaetan

[gerald porzio]

Yup. The hobby needs more witchcraft.

[DSK]

Yup. The hobby needs more witchcraft.

No, just more designers prepared to be open minded, try things out that may not make sense in (currently known) theory, and use the same measurement devices to tell them whether something sounds more like the real thing that we use to determine whether we enjoy the real thing in the first place .... ie. our ears. 

Given that when I sink into the couch to enjoy a beautiful recording, it is my ears that I use to listen to the music (ie. the point of the whole hobby), you can be damned sure that it is my ears that I will use to make my purchasing decision. And, extrapolating further, I would hope that the designer has used his ears in the design process. If we just follow currently known principles and measurements like lemmings we get nowhere, it is in challenging them that we make progress.

I'll happily enjoy my music while the maths boffins stage mental arguments about why things will never work and lay claims to being the designer of the best amplifier circuit never built. Life is too short.

[LM]

I regret that at University I studied motorcycles and women so convincingly

Ah see that’s where you have it wrong Hugh!  Grunt when it’s needed and fine touch and sensuality for the rest of the time.  Great design principles that show up well in the Soraya …….  So that’s where you got them eh!

I'm not sure it gets any better than this but, if it does, I am sure I can't afford it ... and I don't care.

Darren, a great ‘to the point’ review and a good summation.  If I hadn’t waffled on so much early in this thread, I would have been pleased to get to the nub of the Soraya’s qualities in such an elegant way. 

[DSK]

...Grunt when it’s needed and fine touch and sensuality for the rest of the time...

Yep, you sure gotta treat them 'cycles with a fine touch and sensuality 

[gerald porzio]

If it weren't for those designers w/ math, physics & electronics knowledge, the hobby would not have made significant progress. Relying on the Golden Eared Gurus, who all know what they hear but can't demonstrate it, is a crap shoot. This is not to disparage listening which certainly has it's place.

[gaetan8888]

Hello

The fact that some designers work with math, physics & electronics knowledge are not a problem, it's more that a lot of them use those knowledge without their ears to design an amp. I know somes who gain a kind of "pleasure" by designing complicate amps because of the technical chalenge and not for the musical result.

Bye

Gaetan

[bhobba]

As so often happens in life as we get older, I regret that at University I studied motorcycles and women so convincingly   , yet flunked my maths..... truly, a profound regret   .  It would not have made my amps sound any better had I passed math, possibly they would not be as good as they are, but it sure would have given some pleasure to whop these guys with a few nicely chosen triple integrals!!   

I was the exact opposite Hugh, loved my math (actually did a degree in math) but was driven to do so well in it I ignored the other stuff you mention.  Never regretted it just like you should not.  It takes all types.  As one guy I went to uni with said (he was returning after failing the first time around) he majored in tiddlywinks previously but would not have missed the experience for anything.

You can always pick it up.  Here is a great math book (I have a copy and its terrific):
http://matrixeditions.com/UnifiedApproach3rd.html

Thanks
Bill

[AKSA]

You do need maths for amp design, but it's not onerous.

I'm actually very good with figures, and well able to handle simple calculus and integration.

I can figure all the currents and voltages in an amp in a couple of minutes without benefit of simulators or calculators.

Mr Porzio, do not jump to conclusions because someone is a little self-effacing.  Clearly this approach is alien to you, doubtless you are a math exponent with a thousand good sounding amps to your credit...... I use simulation widely as well, and study Bode plots and loop gain graphs with great care.  I would challenge you to compute exact and precise lag comp and phase lead, too.  A listening test is best here as the final test.  Clearly all the aids are very necessary.  Your witchcraft comment is a feeble attempt at engineering ridicule, and I would suggest you carefully read up on the Dunning Kruger syndrome.  I would also remind you that some of the most complex, math intensive designs sound terrible.  Now, can you tell us why this is so?

Finally, have you heard my amps?  No, I thought not.....

Notwithstanding, thanks for all the positive comments, guys, much appreciated,

Hugh

[LM]

I think that one of Hugh’s shortfalls on forums, even his own, is that he is pretty self-deprecating in the typical Australian manner about his skills and abilities.   I hope no-one really thinks that he and his colleagues such as Colin don’t put in the hard yards on painstaking topology, circuit board design, spice simulations and measurement etc. that underpin a truly great design.  The Soraya 09 is not the product of a crap shoot.  Nothing that sounds this good possibly could be – it’s just that Hugh values the ear above all else to fine tune the end result that takes it far beyond the initial maths only design.