Best sounding full range driver speaker ever!

HAL · « **Reply #200 on:** 23 Sep 2013, 01:51 am »

Quote from: North Star on 9 Aug 2013, 07:12 pm

Here, I just posted in this thread!

Is there a question? Not sure what this post means.

rak313 · « **Reply #201 on:** 9 Dec 2013, 10:51 pm »

Quote from: HAL on 9 Aug 2013, 12:19 pm

Still waiting on a major software update from the company that developed it to check out the setup. Once updated the software will no longer work with these DAC's that have the M2Tech Evo's, so will be trying it with a single DAC setup with a different USB async to I2S Bus interface.

No timeframe at this point, as I am waiting on the software to test.

It's been quite a while since the first post on this topic. I like the basic idea of having a speaker custom equalized, but it does raise a lot of questions (as to how well it will work). I wonder if you are any closer to knowing that than when you first started this thread?

Have you done a quick prototype - proof of concept to prove the algorithms? With measurements that show the resulting designed filter improves the sound - and that the speaker doesn't change over time such that the "designed filter" is no better that a generic filter design based on a typical instance of the speaker. (not that that would be so bad).

I am also interested in what you don't like about the ESS SABRE32 DACs sound.

I look forward to your next step and Good Luck!

PS. I like the looks of the speaker!

Danny Richie · « **Reply #202 on:** 9 Dec 2013, 11:07 pm »

I'll respond to a couple of these.

Quote from: rak313 on 9 Dec 2013, 10:51 pm

Have you done a quick prototype - proof of concept to prove the algorithms? With measurements that show the resulting designed filter improves the sound - and that the speaker doesn't change over time such that the "designed filter" is no better that a generic filter design based on a typical instance of the speaker. (not that that would be so bad).

Working with and designing speakers all the time I can tell you that as a speaker burns in the change is not in amplitude. In other words the frequency response stays very constant. Slight changes are usually found in the lower ranges near Fs. But in an open baffle application the full range drivers will be well down in output by that point, so it will have no effect.

Quote

I am also interested in what you don't like about the ESS SABRE32 DACs sound.

That DAC is not at the performance level of what Rich has been working with using this concept. I have listened to a couple of the Sabre DAC's as well. It is not bad, but not in the same ballpark of what I have been using. The whole point of this was to use a DAC that is as good as the top level DAC's out there. This is where all of the currently available digital crossovers have lagged way behind.

HAL · « **Reply #203 on:** 9 Dec 2013, 11:18 pm »

The software only solution for the DSP crossover is not going to occur, since the developer has decided that he has to many other project to take this on. This only occurred last week.

The hardware based DSP crossover version is in build and hope to hear it is shipped before Christmas. That is an update from today.

I need the operational hardware DSP crossover to test the filter that is designed and make measurements with the speakers.

Danny's comments on the difference in DAC's is exactly why I started the project.

rak313 · « **Reply #204 on:** 10 Dec 2013, 12:04 am »

Quote from: HAL on 9 Dec 2013, 11:18 pm

[snip]
...
Danny's comments on the difference in DAC's is exactly why I started the project.

Which begs the question - what DAC are you using?

HAL · « **Reply #205 on:** 10 Dec 2013, 02:25 am »

Will not be revealed until the product is ready.

jtwrace · « **Reply #206 on:** 10 Dec 2013, 02:48 am »

Quote from: HAL on 10 Dec 2013, 02:25 am

Will not be revealed until the product is ready.

Will it be hardware and software?

HAL · « **Reply #207 on:** 10 Dec 2013, 04:10 am »

The four DACs on the DSP board will be hardware.

dlparker · « **Reply #208 on:** 12 Dec 2013, 07:43 pm »

Quote from: HAL on 10 Dec 2013, 04:10 am

The four DACs on the DSP board will be hardware.

Hi HAL. I'm Dave. I don't care if you let me in our not. I have my own air supply, and it's a really big one.

I know I'm off topic, but I just got up and the caffeine is starting to work..

HAL · « **Reply #209 on:** 12 Dec 2013, 07:59 pm »

LOL! I am glad the caffeine is working for you.

HAL · « **Reply #210 on:** 11 Mar 2015, 02:59 am »

The Monolith open baffle speaker with the 8" Dayton full range driver and 3x8" servo woofers is fully operational with the new dspMusik digital crossover. Will take pictures of the setup as it now exists and post.

Took way longer than expected!

gregfisk · « **Reply #211 on:** 11 Mar 2015, 06:00 am »

Quote from: HAL on 11 Mar 2015, 02:59 am

The Monolith open baffle speaker with the 8" Dayton full range driver and 3x8" servo woofers is fully operational with the new dspMusik digital crossover. Will take pictures of the setup as it now exists and post.

Took way longer than expected!

I look forward to your posts, I was wondering what happened to this project.

HAL · « **Reply #212 on:** 11 Mar 2015, 09:40 am »

Here is a plot of the frequency response of the Dayton 8" full range drive before and after correction with the dspMusik crossover. The red graph is before and green is after correction. My measurements are only good down to 500Hz and working to improve that as time goes on.

Looking into the ground plane measurement technique for an improved measurement method.

S Clark · « **Reply #213 on:** 11 Mar 2015, 03:01 pm »

Looking at that red graph, I'm wondering how much of that correction you could achieve by simply moving 15-20 degrees off axis?

HAL · « **Reply #214 on:** 11 Mar 2015, 03:05 pm »

This is at 10 degrees off axis measurement to lower the more peaked on axis response and then correcting for the rest of the response peaks. On axis was very bright. The 10 degree off axis sounded better than on axis and much better after correction.

HAL · « **Reply #215 on:** 11 Mar 2015, 03:30 pm »

Here is the 8" full range driver on axis without any correction on the same OB U-Frame.

S Clark · « **Reply #216 on:** 11 Mar 2015, 03:43 pm »

Wow. That's quite a rise, and an ugly section from 2300-3500 hz. It would be hard/impossible to tame with passive components. I guess you could tame that peak with a notch filter, but the dropout would still be audible. Your computerized crossover seems to be a good solution.
When we would make speakers from driver like this one, the crossover components would run more that the drivers cost. It made me appreciative of the mid woofers like the M-130 that Danny sells.

Guy 13 · « **Reply #217 on:** 12 Mar 2015, 10:02 am »

Quote from: S Clark on 11 Mar 2015, 03:43 pm

Wow. That's quite a rise, and an ugly section from 2300-3500 hz. It would be hard/impossible to tame with passive components. I guess you could tame that peak with a notch filter, but the dropout would still be audible. Your computerized crossover seems to be a good solution.
When we would make speakers from driver like this one, the crossover components would run more that the drivers cost. It made me appreciative of the mid woofers like the M-130 that Danny sells.

Hi S Clark,
I am sure the extended range drive I bought a few years back
from Common Sense Audio (Audio Nirvana 8"basic 98 USD/pair)
had the same bump between 2Khz to 3.5Khz because it was very
ear piercing and fatiguing.
Well, what did I expected for that price.
I am not a fan of active crossover,
but I guess in this case that would be almost the only solution
to tame that peak.
I would be very curious to see the frequency response curve
of the Omega 7F that I own and like very much,
because it sound pretty linear to me,
but a curve might say otherwise.

Guy 13
Sorry, maybe I did derail this post/topic.
Sorry if I did.

I also like the Danny's GR Research M130-16
that I have in my N3 speakers.

HAL · « **Reply #218 on:** 12 Mar 2015, 10:22 am »

Guy 13,
Well if someone can measure your Omega 7F driver in far field conditions, with a system like Audiomatica CLIO and a calibrated mic, I can make some suggestions.

The dspMusik is not like other digital crossovers in sound quality to me. It sounds like very good analog when being used as a digital crossover and DAC. Once you hear the Dayton 8" full range corrected, I would never go back to the original sound.

The techniques I am using for correction are applicable to any full range driver. For best results, I need a sample of the driver on the correct baffle for measurements to do the design.

Guy 13 · « **Reply #219 on:** 12 Mar 2015, 10:55 am »

Quote from: HAL on 12 Mar 2015, 10:22 am

Guy 13,
Well if someone can measure your Omega 7F driver in far field conditions, with a system like Audiomatica CLIO and a calibrated mic, I can make some suggestions.

The dspMusik is not like other digital crossovers in sound quality to me. It sounds like very good analog when being used as a digital crossover and DAC. Once you hear the Dayton 8" full range corrected, I would never go back to the original sound.

The techniques I am using for correction are applicable to any full range driver. For best results, I need a sample of the driver on the correct baffle for measurements to do the design.

Hi HAL,
thanks for your comments,
I will keep them in mind when I decide to improve the sound of my system.
Rega Apollo CDP, Decware SE84C+ SET amplifier and my Omega 7F extended range driver in Open Baffle Dipole, but maybe latter on I might go with Bass Reflex enclosure due to smaller listening room when back in my home country Canada.

Guy 13 on planet Vietnam, for now...