New GR Neo 3 tweeters are here.

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Danny Richie

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Re: New GR Neo 3 tweeters are here.
« Reply #40 on: 15 Aug 2017, 01:13 pm »
Interesting. So the material of the baffle affects the FR that much?

I guess it makes sense in the higher frequencies, but I don't think that had occurred to me (makes sense when I think about it - think of side walls in your listening wall made of the different materials). Is that correct?

Could a coating on the MDF (as opposed to paint) make a difference and reduce the width?

Yes, it can have a significant effect.

The thickness of the material effects the drivers response too as it loads the drivers slightly and places edges on four sides (mounting through hole) that causes edge diffraction. So 1/2" thick Aluminum has advantages there as well.

Coating the edges with something that will be effective requires some pretty thick felt. It wouldn't be pretty, but would have some effectiveness.

orientalexpress

Re: New GR Neo 3 tweeters are here.
« Reply #41 on: 15 Aug 2017, 01:23 pm »
Just curious ,how much does 1/2 inches mill aluminium cost for a pair like Denny cost? :D

lap

tasar

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Re: New GR Neo 3 tweeters are here.
« Reply #42 on: 15 Aug 2017, 01:32 pm »
Let's see the "N" series out with these.

rollo

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Re: New GR Neo 3 tweeters are here.
« Reply #43 on: 15 Aug 2017, 02:41 pm »
  Time to Tweeter up boys. Get those tools out and get a working. :thumb:


charles

Ric Schultz

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Re: New GR Neo 3 tweeters are here.
« Reply #44 on: 15 Aug 2017, 07:29 pm »
As shown on the line source I linked, if you mount the Neos directly on the face of the wood baffle and then cover the entire front with felt then there is no diffraction.  Also in the back (no matter how thick the baffle is) you simply flare out the rear behind the drivers (like a waveguide) and felt this flare and the entire rear panel.....again no diffraction effects.  Cheap and incredible sounding.  When you use a combo of 16 ply plywood and highly refined MDF and use Green glue in between the layers you get a very, very rigid baffle.  Aluminum might give you 5 % more........for thousands of $ more.  Use better xover parts (Clarity cap CMRs with copper foil Jupiter bypasses and use 12 gauge Jantzen wax paper copper foil Inductor on the midrange and 14 or 16 gauge on the tweet and use great wire like Neotech, Vhaudio, etc)......this is where the money should go.

Captainhemo

Re: New GR Neo 3 tweeters are here.
« Reply #45 on: 15 Aug 2017, 07:48 pm »
The problem with that is   the front all covered in felt is   butt ugly, who wants to  build a killer set of   speakers  and then felt the front ?
If you   put a round over or chamfer on the rear side, you'll have to widen the baffles to make room  for the featurs.  A 45 degree chamfer will extend "out"  = to the depth it is.
I hadn't realized the aluminum baffles were only .5" thick so going to a   1.25" baffle like I suggested above   is not really a solution.  However, there are some  really cool composites out there, how they compare to aluminum in terms of  strength, resonance resistance, cost etc would have to be determined

jay

Danny Richie

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Re: New GR Neo 3 tweeters are here.
« Reply #46 on: 15 Aug 2017, 08:25 pm »
Quote
The problem with that is the front all covered in felt is butt ugly, who wants to  build a killer set of  speakers and then felt the front ?

This is completely correct. No one buying a speaker at this level wants it to look like a DIY project.

mresseguie

Re: New GR Neo 3 tweeters are here.
« Reply #47 on: 15 Aug 2017, 10:53 pm »
The problem with that is   the front all covered in felt is   butt ugly, who wants to  build a killer set of   speakers  and then felt the front ?
If you   put a round over or chamfer on the rear side, you'll have to widen the baffles to make room  for the featurs.  A 45 degree chamfer will extend "out"  = to the depth it is.
I hadn't realized the aluminum baffles were only .5" thick so going to a   1.25" baffle like I suggested above   is not really a solution.  However, there are some  really cool composites out there, how they compare to aluminum in terms of  strength, resonance resistance, cost etc would have to be determined

jay

Not that I'm a cabinet maker, but would using HDF either alone or in conjunction with another material like MDF or BB accomplish what you seek? I know HDF isn't cheap, but it must be less expensive than aluminum, no?


Captainhemo

Re: New GR Neo 3 tweeters are here.
« Reply #48 on: 15 Aug 2017, 11:23 pm »
Not that I'm a cabinet maker, but would using HDF either alone or in conjunction with another material like MDF or BB accomplish what you seek? I know HDF isn't cheap, but it must be less expensive than aluminum, no?

Hey Micheal :wave:
Not if   the baffle is  only to be  .5"  thick. But , as mentioned  above, there   are  composites out there that are pretty amazing. The question would really be if  they will compare to aluminum ( I know  one in particular   will)  and  how the cost measures up

jay

gregfisk

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Re: New GR Neo 3 tweeters are here.
« Reply #49 on: 16 Aug 2017, 04:38 am »
What about using a corian type product which is also .5 inches deep?

It would be way less expensive and if you rough it up a bit it should take paint.

The only problem I see with that is resonance and I know nothing about that but what I do know is that it is very rigid.

Any thoughts?


S Clark

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Re: New GR Neo 3 tweeters are here.
« Reply #50 on: 16 Aug 2017, 06:01 am »
One of my students made speakers from Corian.  I remember the sheets were much less rigid than plywood. I suspect that the fine particle in resin nature of it offers little strength length wise. 

oz_audio_todd

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Re: New GR Neo 3 tweeters are here.
« Reply #51 on: 16 Aug 2017, 12:17 pm »
Sorry guys, I hate to put this tread back on track, but for the ppl in the cheap seats, can someone please explain what is right/ wrong with these new tweeters, that we have to modify them before they can be used??
Do they have to be modified, will they work without, are there f/r or sensitivity issues with or without? (again, so to re-rail the tread..)

Danny Richie

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Re: New GR Neo 3 tweeters are here.
« Reply #52 on: 16 Aug 2017, 03:16 pm »
Sorry guys, I hate to put this tread back on track, but for the ppl in the cheap seats, can someone please explain what is right/ wrong with these new tweeters, that we have to modify them before they can be used??
Do they have to be modified, will they work without, are there f/r or sensitivity issues with or without? (again, so to re-rail the tread..)

You can run them as is no problem. If you want the improved dispersion that you get by blocking the outer rows (like the BG pdr version) then I have illustrated how to do that at the first of this thread. I can send you the yard and it is real easy to do. But you'll have to do it yourself. I am not going to sell them that way. It could be considered a patent violation if I sold them that way. But when you get them then they are yours, and you can do whatever you want with them including what I illustrated earlier.

gregfisk

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Re: New GR Neo 3 tweeters are here.
« Reply #53 on: 16 Aug 2017, 03:29 pm »
One of my students made speakers from Corian.  I remember the sheets were much less rigid than plywood. I suspect that the fine particle in resin nature of it offers little strength length wise.

This is interesting Scott, I have two sheets of material that is used for shower walls and it is way more rigid than .5" ply. If you hold it at an angle with the short end sitting on the ground you cannot get it to flex at all, it is super stiff. If you hold a 4x8 sheet of .5" plywood the same way it bows toward the ground and is springy. This must be a different type of material than corian but it is definitely very stiff and less money than corian as well.

jparkhur

Re: New GR Neo 3 tweeters are here.
« Reply #54 on: 17 Aug 2017, 07:05 pm »
Danny. Remind us. How low can the neo3 go ?

S Clark

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Re: New GR Neo 3 tweeters are here.
« Reply #55 on: 17 Aug 2017, 07:43 pm »
This is interesting Scott, I have two sheets of material that is used for shower walls and it is way more rigid than .5" ply. If you hold it at an angle with the short end sitting on the ground you cannot get it to flex at all, it is super stiff. If you hold a 4x8 sheet of .5" plywood the same way it bows toward the ground and is springy. This must be a different type of material than corian but it is definitely very stiff and less money than corian as well.
It's possible that there are several formulations for the stuff.  What I remember was that a local cabinet guy had given the kid several 8' strips about 15" wide that we cut for his bookshelf speaker project. IF my memory is correct, it had more give than 3/4 plywood... and obviously a lot more weight.  Please note the capital IF.  I could easily have this wrong, since it was a good while back. 

Danny Richie

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Re: New GR Neo 3 tweeters are here.
« Reply #56 on: 17 Aug 2017, 08:59 pm »
Danny. Remind us. How low can the neo3 go ?

In the BG face plate, and with the deep back cup, I crossed them easily at 1.8kHz.

In the wave guide and in the open baffle I have crossed them as low as 1.2kHz. 

Danny Richie

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Re: New GR Neo 3 tweeters are here.
« Reply #57 on: 26 Aug 2017, 10:57 pm »
These can now be ordered online: http://gr-research.com/grneo3.aspx   :thumb:

oz_audio_todd

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Re: New GR Neo 3 tweeters are here.
« Reply #58 on: 27 Aug 2017, 10:31 pm »
Does that also mean that the N's and OB's are back, or will they require tweaking first?

jcotner

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Re: New GR Neo 3 tweeters are here.
« Reply #59 on: 27 Aug 2017, 10:39 pm »
Does that also mean that the N's and OB's are back, or will they require tweaking first?

They have been back with the BG drivers. I think Danny was buying BG drivers from Parts Express
to sell them.
I was wondering was how Danny was going to handle it going forward. IMHO it might be best
to offer kits with a choice of driver as not everyone will want to do the modification.
At the very least he will have to remove the references to BG if he sells them only with the new
GR drivers. There is also the deep cup and regular Neo as well, so I don't know how that all works out.