Vinyl record quality

yeldarb · « **on:** 5 Mar 2015, 03:01 am »

Back in the 1980s, the thing that sent me running to CD was the quality of the mostly rock records I was buying. Surface noise, pops and clicks, off center, even some regrind. Lately, my vinyl purchases are making me think that what goes around comes around. I have purchased a lot of vinyl which is just crap. High dollar, heavy weight re-masters with non fill issues. Or edge warps. Or off center. Damned frustrating to say the least. I am sure I am about to wear out my good will with one seller. Is it too much to ask that a piece of vinyl be quiet so that you can enjoy the music? Some do a decent job, like Pallas, but I have been furnished other brand replacements that have the same noises in the same places. Bad stampers? Rushing the press? Even had one new one with scraps of paper in the vinyl. I received a replacement for a noisy record today. It is noisy too. It drives me mad, I tell you, mad!

In 30 years, I could count the number of defective cds I've purchased on one hand. Out of hundreds. Sure, some sounded like crap, but they weren't defective.

GentleBender · « **Reply #1 on:** 5 Mar 2015, 10:30 am »

I've experienced this too. Had to give up on Megadeth "Countdown to Extinction" picture disc. Out of six shipped to me only one was not defective on the first song, in the exact same place. The one that was good I gave to a friend as a gift, so mine has a nice POP on the first and my favorite song. Seems they are rushing some of this vinyl due to demand and quality control goes out the window. It hasn't happened often, but my biggest problem is warped vinyl. I think I will try one of those heated sleeves someone recommended on here to see if it works.

Still, most of my vinyl sounds much better than my CDs. One of the reasons why I still prefer vinyl and put up with the occasional defects. Now that they are reopening/opening more vinyl presses, I hope it gets better. Music on Vinyl brand has some excellent represses and I have not had any problems with their reissued stuff.

NIGHTFALL1970 · « **Reply #2 on:** 5 Mar 2015, 06:09 pm »

I bought the new "this is Pink Floyd" version of DSOTM and heard surface noise throughout the entire record, on both sides.

jimdgoulding · « **Reply #3 on:** 5 Mar 2015, 06:15 pm »

I have a large record collection and haven't experienced what you're talking about hardly at all I'm happy to report

. Vinyl has an organic quality

that appeals to me. Wish I could describe it better.

vinyl_lady · « **Reply #4 on:** 5 Mar 2015, 10:51 pm »

I have bought a lot (hundreds and hundreds and hundreds) of new vinyl over the past 10-15 years and I have not experienced a quality problem like the OP describes. I have had maybe 3 to 5 defective records in all those years and all have been replaced with good copies by the vendor. I look for MoFi, QRP, Pallas, RTI pressings. Some plants are better than others. I never buy picture discs. I can't imagine those would be quality pressings.

dminches · « **Reply #5 on:** 5 Mar 2015, 10:55 pm »

My experience has been the same as vinyl_lady.

Question to the OP. Are you using a wet vacuum cleaner like VPI or an ultrasonic one? I find that is a necessity.

There are some releases which are disappointing but it is usually the mastering as opposed to a bad record.

vinyl_lady · « **Reply #6 on:** 5 Mar 2015, 11:03 pm »

Quote from: dminches on 5 Mar 2015, 10:55 pm

Question to the OP. Are you using a wet vacuum cleaner like VPI or an ultrasonic one? I find that is a necessity.

This ^^^^^. I clean all new records in my Audio Desk ultrasonic cleaner before first play.

nickd · « **Reply #7 on:** 5 Mar 2015, 11:06 pm »

I have not bought anything new that I thought was noisy. My table and cart. and preamp are on the "quiet" side I suppose. Most people at the house do not know I'm playing an LP unless they see me put it on the table or get up to flip it. Edge warp I have seen from time to time. I was thinking that shipping in summer months might be to blame for some of that.

Minn Mark · « **Reply #8 on:** 6 Mar 2015, 02:48 pm »

I buy from any of the following:

eBay,Discogs,ElusiveDisc,SoundstageDirect,AcousticSounds,MusicDirect.

I have occasionally gotten pressings that are less than pristine. Sometimes I can clean these problems away (Record Doctor from Audio Advisor), other times the defects seem real and are in the pressing.

I am near (sort of) some brick-and-mortar stores (Twin Cities, MN USA area-don't often visit), but the downside of digital buying is that one has to post back-and-forth when there are problems. This most often results for me in simply keeping these less than pristine pressings.

I still prefer vinyl to CD, in my systems.

Happy listening,

Mark

Devil Doc · « **Reply #9 on:** 6 Mar 2015, 03:57 pm »

I can't stress enough how important it is to clean a new record. Back in the day I bought "Stage Fright" by the Band. I was young not very experienced and new nothing about cleaning records. Anyway the record seemed to have a locked groove on the first cut. Well, to make a long story short, I never played that record again. It sat on my shelf, un-played for forty or so years. So one day on a lark, I decided to run it through my RCM. Guess what? It played perfectly. No locked groove. So now I have a first pressing of a great album in M- condition.

Doc

Bear · « **Reply #10 on:** 6 Mar 2015, 04:04 pm »

http://www.wired.com/2015/03/hot-stampers/

Quiet Earth · « **Reply #11 on:** 6 Mar 2015, 04:36 pm »

I think it is very important to clean new records. Sometimes you need to clean them twice on a machine of some sorts to really get the crud out. But I have a hard time believing the people who say they recently bought hundreds of records and only a few of them have surface noise issues. Come on now, let's be for real.

Some of my best sounding, quietest records are ultra thin, light weight, department store purchases from the mid to late seventies (early eighties?) which have been played hundreds of times on low tech turntables. So I have to agree with the OP that the bar is set awfully low for all these new and improved records to be not so consistently good.

Records, they are a crapshoot. (But I love them.)

vinyl_lady · « **Reply #12 on:** 6 Mar 2015, 04:47 pm »

Quiet Earth,

I am absolutely serious when I said out of hundreds and hundreds of new pressings I have bought over the last 10+ years, only a handful were defective and needed to be returned and replaced. Pressings from MoFi, Pallas, RTI and QRP are consistently high quality. It has not been a crap shoot for me.

Peace

Quiet Earth · « **Reply #13 on:** 6 Mar 2015, 05:37 pm »

No sweat. Unfortunately, I don't have the same amount of luck as you. Or maybe it is not luck at all, but rather skill, money, and resources.

Also, I bet we all have different definitions of what constitutes "defective". Myself, I have only returned one or two records in my lifetime, and that is when I was a lot younger with higher hopes. Now that I am much older, I expect a certain level of mechanical or surface related noise from a vinyl record. It's par for the course, IMO. The occasional tick or pop does not bother me. The severe warp does though. The worst warped record I have is a 180g reissue Audiophile pressing. But, I am too lazy to exchange a poor modern pressing in hopes of getting a better one, if they would exchange it at all. They don't do exchanges at my local store, and I hate shipping things back and forth in the mail.

Anyway, I have never in my lifetime heard a perfectly quiet record from start to finish, on any system anywhere. But if you guys say that it is normal to expect that kind of perfection, then I will accept that I am doing something wrong.

I still agree with the OP in terms of expecting more from modern pressings, but I guess we are the two odd men out.

Peace, (again)

SteveRB · « **Reply #14 on:** 6 Mar 2015, 05:37 pm »

Quote from: vinyl_lady on 6 Mar 2015, 04:47 pm

Quiet Earth,

I am absolutely serious when I said out of hundreds and hundreds of new pressings I have bought over the last 10+ years, only a handful were defective and needed to be returned and replaced. Pressings from MoFi, Pallas, RTI and QRP are consistently high quality. It has not been a crap shoot for me.

These are good plants and these records still need to be cleaned. However, you cannot fix no fill and off centre. That's just the luck of the draw.

vinyl_lady · « **Reply #15 on:** 6 Mar 2015, 06:06 pm »

QE,

I think your point about what constitutes "defective" is a good one. I do not mean to imply that every new record I have bought is dead quiet, but many, perhaps most, are (after cleaning). Some new records do have some surface noise between tracks, but that hasn't interfered with the music in the grooves. Pops and ticks are usually eliminated with a good ultrasonic cleaning.

Quiet Earth · « **Reply #16 on:** 6 Mar 2015, 08:25 pm »

The ultrasonic cleaning machine is on my "next thing to try" list.

G E · « **Reply #17 on:** 8 Mar 2015, 02:05 am »

I remember the frustration buying new records in the '70's with warps, off center pressings and loads of background noise.

When I returned to vinyl a few years ago with a major upgrade in playback gear I was surprised how quiet playback was. better gear- better set up certainly contributed. Not much one can do with off center pressings though

yeldarb · « **Reply #18 on:** 8 Mar 2015, 03:28 am »

Now I don't want to PO anyone off, but you shouldn't have to resort to high dollar record cleaning machines for brand new vinyl. Just so it sounds ok. More power to you if you have the $ and space for one of the gadgets. I normally run a carbon fiber brush, followed by a humidity type directional fiber (AT and it is an old big one). Then I hit it with the Zerostat and clamp it down with a Kabusa clamp / weight. And if it is nasty with pops and cracks, I will attempt a cleaning with PVA glue, which is a PIA, but has rescued some absolutely unlistenable old stuff. And I have a Spin Clean, which I use on older purchases and the occasional new album. But noise is noise and, if it is in the vinyl, it isn't going away. The worst for noise in the new releases seems to be clear vinyl or colored. Maybe there was a reason it was all originally black.

And if the relative humidity in the house is low (typical in the winter), I keep a wet paper towel under the dust cover, while I am playing records. Got to help reduce some static. Spin Clean seems to make the detail in the pressing much more apparent, but accentuates any noise from non-fill. What we need is some record spackle. Just apply a layer and fill all the holes with a stylus pressing.

vinyl_lady · « **Reply #19 on:** 8 Mar 2015, 04:42 am »

Quote from: yeldarb on 8 Mar 2015, 03:28 am

Now I don't want to PO anyone off, but you shouldn't have to resort to high dollar record cleaning machines for brand new vinyl. Just so it sounds ok. More power to you if you have the $ and space for one of the gadgets. I normally run a carbon fiber brush, followed by a humidity type directional fiber (AT and it is an old big one). Then I hit it with the Zerostat and clamp it down with a Kabusa clamp / weight. And if it is nasty with pops and cracks, I will attempt a cleaning with PVA glue, which is a PIA, but has rescued some absolutely unlistenable old stuff. And I have a Spin Clean, which I use on older purchases and the occasional new album. But noise is noise and, if it is in the vinyl, it isn't going away. The worst for noise in the new releases seems to be clear vinyl or colored. Maybe there was a reason it was all originally black. And if the relative humidity in the house is low (typical in the winter), I keep a wet paper towel under the dust cover, while I am playing records. Got to help reduce some static. Spin Clean seems to make the detail in the pressing much more apparent, but accentuates any noise from non-fill. What we need is some record spackle. Just apply a layer and fill all the holes with a stylus pressing.

All new vinyl needs to be cleaned before first play to remove the mold release compound. And the goal is not to sound "ok" but to sound great with a dead quiet background, which it does. Disagree about clear and colored vinyl as that has not been my experience.